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 Re: oboe weight
Author: Chris P 
Date:   2006-08-10 12:26

On pure thumbplate system you can only play Bb and C by lifting your thumb off the thumbplate (or with the side key for trills) - there's no connection from the bottom joint (RH 1 fingerplate) for Bb and C, and also LH fingerplate 3 isn't connected to the rest of the mechanism so you can still open the Bb tonehole even if LH 3 is down (and if you accidentally lift your thumb off the thumbplate the Bb tonehole will open, which isn't always a good thing!). And LH3 is usually a plain open hole or has an inserted chimney fitted with a decorative metal ring so it feels like a fingerplate on pro oboes, but is still a plain hole with no connection to the rest of the top joint main action.

Most of the older oboes made in England and still doing the rounds are pure thumbplate system, some even have fully automatic octaves. But all the makers offered conservatoire system as well. And there are even Loree and Kreul oboes built in pure thumbplate system - Loree did an interesting one, it was pretty much identical to any Loree you'd see, but they did away with the conservatoire link (no connection from RH 1) and the top joint was pure thumbplate - but it still had the split D#-E trill, banana key and most features found on full Gillet conservatoire oboes.

Dual system is a conservatoire system oboe with an added thumbplate which holds the top end of the linkage (conservatoire bar) down on the top joint freeing the Bb and C keys to rise under their own spring tension, and closing them both when the thumbplate is pressed. Depending on which fingers are down, finger 2 will close the C key while leaving the Bb key open, and closing finger 3 will close both of them together, as you already have on conservatoire system.

But this is where confusion lies - dual systems are referred to as thumbplate as there's a thumbplate fitted, but they are conservatoire system when the thumbplate is held down, so you can still use conservatoire fingerings as long as you keep your thumb on the plate. But the thing with dual system that both pure thumbplate and conservatoire system can't do all that easily are certain fast tremolos - mainly G-Bb and G-C - keeping the thumb off the thumbplate and playing G (xxx|ooo) and then lifting LH3 for Bb (xxo|ooo) or LH 2 and 3 for C (xoo|ooo). On pure thumbplate system you need to lift your thumb along with your fingers, and on pure conservatoire you need to keep putting RH 1 down for the Bb and C.

The only pure thumbplate system oboes Howarth make are the S10 and S20 oboes (and S20 cor anglais), as well as importing the Orsi made Howarth B. The S2 (ring key thumbplate system) hasn't been made for a fair few years now - the last one I saw being finished was a special order, and that was around six years ago (I was also finishing a specially ordered S3 at the same time - that's a ring key conservatoire system), and I've never seen one made since then. At one time the pure thumblate S2 was the most popular pro oboe, and now the full Gillet conservatoire S5 and XL have taken over, either in conservatoire or dual system.

But the S20c oboe and cor anglais are conservatoire system (with the 'c' suffix) and from the S40c upwards they're all conservatoire system - but thumbplates can be added at any stage in manufacture to make them dual system.

Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010

The opinions I express are my own.

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 Topics Author  Date
 oboe weight  new
lucyw 2006-07-28 15:39 
 Re: oboe weight  new
DressedToKill 2006-07-28 16:12 
 Re: oboe weight  new
Chris P 2006-07-28 16:25 
 Re: oboe weight  new
DressedToKill 2006-07-28 16:30 
 Re: oboe weight  new
lucyw 2006-07-28 16:40 
 Re: oboe weight  new
Chris P 2006-07-28 16:46 
 Re: oboe weight  new
DressedToKill 2006-07-28 16:46 
 Re: oboe weight  new
Chris P 2006-07-28 16:54 
 Re: oboe weight  new
lucyw 2006-07-28 17:03 
 Re: oboe weight  new
lucyw 2006-07-28 17:05 
 Re: oboe weight  new
DressedToKill 2006-07-28 17:07 
 Re: oboe weight  new
Chris P 2006-07-28 17:08 
 Re: oboe weight  new
Chris P 2006-07-28 17:11 
 Re: oboe weight  new
DressedToKill 2006-07-28 17:10 
 Re: oboe weight  new
lucyw 2006-07-28 18:01 
 Re: oboe weight  new
DressedToKill 2006-07-28 18:15 
 Re: oboe weight  new
lucyw 2006-07-28 18:20 
 Re: oboe weight  new
DressedToKill 2006-07-28 18:24 
 Re: oboe weight  new
lucyw 2006-07-28 18:34 
 Re: oboe weight  new
Chris P 2006-07-28 18:42 
 Re: oboe weight  new
lucyw 2006-07-28 18:56 
 Re: oboe weight  new
lucyw 2006-07-28 19:01 
 Re: oboe weight  new
vboboe 2006-07-28 23:42 
 Re: oboe weight  new
DressedToKill 2006-07-28 18:44 
 Re: oboe weight  new
lucyw 2006-07-28 18:57 
 Re: oboe weight  new
Chris P 2006-07-28 18:45 
 Re: oboe weight  new
DressedToKill 2006-07-28 19:00 
 Re: oboe weight  new
Chris P 2006-07-28 19:05 
 Re: oboe weight  new
ohsuzan 2006-07-28 20:18 
 Re: oboe weight  new
DressedToKill 2006-07-28 20:21 
 Re: oboe weight  new
ohsuzan 2006-07-28 20:24 
 Re: oboe weight  new
DressedToKill 2006-07-28 20:28 
 Re: oboe weight  new
Chris P 2006-07-28 20:38 
 Re: oboe weight  new
Chris P 2006-07-29 05:55 
 Re: oboe weight  new
lucyw 2006-07-29 15:19 
 Re: oboe weight  new
oboeblank 2006-07-29 16:41 
 Re: oboe weight  new
Chris P 2006-07-29 20:18 
 Re: oboe weight  new
DressedToKill 2006-07-29 22:22 
 Re: oboe weight  new
Chris P 2006-07-30 00:25 
 Re: oboe weight  new
DressedToKill 2006-07-30 03:56 
 Re: oboe weight  new
Chris P 2006-07-30 10:12 
 Re: oboe weight  new
sylvangale 2006-07-30 15:25 
 Re: oboe weight  new
Chris P 2006-08-01 11:49 
 Re: oboe weight  new
DressedToKill 2006-08-01 13:03 
 Re: oboe weight  new
doublereeder2 2006-08-04 16:25 
 Re: oboe weight  new
Chris P 2006-08-08 16:59 
 Re: oboe weight  new
vboboe 2006-08-09 19:24 
 Re: oboe weight  new
mschmidt 2006-08-09 20:25 
 Re: oboe weight  new
Chris P 2006-08-09 22:58 
 Re: oboe weight  new
mschmidt 2006-08-10 00:18 
 Re: oboe weight  new
Thomas. 2006-08-10 05:09 
 Re: oboe weight  new
Chris P 2006-08-10 11:22 
 Re: oboe weight  new
Thomas. 2006-08-10 11:42 
 Re: oboe weight  new
Chris P 2006-08-10 12:26 
 Re: oboe weight  new
vboboe 2006-08-10 20:01 
 Re: oboe weight  new
Chris P 2006-08-10 20:47 


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