 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: WhitePlainsDave
Date: 2017-05-13 20:28
I'd never want anyone infirmed, disabled, or of age not playing clarinet simply because they couldn't perform standing. In fact such people, I think, should sit when soloing, (no differently than Itzhak Perlman) with zero issue for anyone.
But these exemptions said, what are you feelings on practicing while standing?
I tend to have my students (who are usually high school age) do so during lessons and encourage some of it during practice. It helps prevents (soprano clarinet) support of the bell with the legs, and if weight is an issue for the player, I'm totally fine with any of my students, for any reason, using a neck strap.
On the other hand, I'm all for things that allow the player to maximize their practice time by not exhausting energy on leg muscles. And yet back to the original idea, why not practice a solo as close to the performance conditions as possible?
So even I'm on the fence. Does anyone have feelings on this, whether pro, con, or indifferent?
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Author: shmuelyosef
Date: 2017-05-13 21:35
I always practice standing, except bass clarinet. OTOH, I play ball sax in big bands a lot and don't stand up for solos, as the sitting and standing neck angles are different. I get no flak for this
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Author: Philip Caron
Date: 2017-05-14 00:18
I recall a discussion here not too long back that touched on this. Some performers, maybe in particular double-lip players, rely on support from knee or leg when playing seated, and they may prefer to sit even when soloing. Harold Wright was mentioned as a double-lip performer who sat when performing solos (concertos, etc.)
Since switching myself to double-lip, it is very easy to get into the habit of using the upper-inside of a knee for stability. However, in rare cases of my soloing, I stand. SO, I do practice sometimes standing up, and I think it's a good idea for players to get used to that situation. It avoids distracting unfamiliarity, if and when.
(I'm also guilty of walking around my house at times while repeating technical drills, in an attempt to reap aerobic benefits simultaneously with fingering ones, but the efficacy of such practice would be a different topic.)
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2017-05-14 01:28
I played in a function band last week which is a standing only gig. I was on tenor sax all night and after two hours of playing and standing I felt it. But at least I could move about and shift my weight from one foot to the other unlike another time doing military music when it's a done thing to stand with both feet together and remain stock still for an eternity both during and not during playing.
And as a result of that I've also had a sacroiliac joint go on me a couple of years back which is no laughing matter - the only cause of that was standing around like a lemon during a load of speeches when I could've easily left for that, but the other player insisted we stay for the speeches and stood in such a way all the weight was on one leg as that's what's in the drill manual. Without being able to move, things got more and more painful and the following evening whilst watching telly a sudden and intense pain hit me very hard. I couldn't do anything to stop the pain no matter what position I tried to get comfortable in. I managed to do a concert that evening, but only as a last resort as I couldn't get a dep at such short notice, so managed to drive myself to the venue and make it off the kerb where I parked right outside the concert hall (on the grass as there were no spaces left nearby), hobble into the hall and both roll and crawl onto the stage to do the concert. The following morning it took me half an hour just to get down the flight of stairs at home.
So standing for short periods of time is fine if you have to do it for performing solos and if you can shift or move around. But don't expect to have to do it if you can't or know it won't be doing you any good.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: kdk ★2017
Date: 2017-05-14 02:07
I don't have my students stand for lessons. Most of their playing at school is done sitting. Concert band and orchestra players don't stand. The jazz bands at least in this area don't stand except for solos. So, they need to learn to hold the clarinet while sitting and to breathe while sitting. If 90% or more of their playing is done sitting, I don't know that an hour of standing at their lessons is teaching them what they most need to learn.
Karl
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2017-05-14 03:19
And as a bari player, the whole standing up thing can get a bit tricky as its a big lump of metal to move about as is reading music from the desk-type stands big bands use.
One time when I was playing bass clarinet we were all required to stand to play the national anthem (GSTQ) at the beginning - this was a last second decision by the MD. Stand and play. With a low C bass clarinet. I managed to move my chair in front of me during the drum roll to rest the floor peg on it.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: kdk ★2017
Date: 2017-05-14 03:49
I guess since most of my playing is in orchestras, I'm surprised they expected the players of big instruments to stand. They don't ask the cellists to stand, and the bassoonists and bass clarinetists in the orchestras I play in sit even when the rest of us stand for the anthem. I'm not sure about about the tubists - they aren't playing Sousaphones, after all.
Karl
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Author: Caroline Smale
Date: 2017-05-14 04:16
As a life-long double lip player I always used to stand when practising until about 10 years ago, when age and some start of arthritis in my hands made this increasingly uncomfortable.
And I do now use my knee as a gentle support for the clarinet too.
But apart from age, infirmity or injury I would still prefer and recommend standing to practise.
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Author: TomS
Date: 2017-05-14 04:29
Stoltzman stands while soloing ... but I think he mentioned it is occasionally painful.
I vote for seated. The reflection from the floor reinforces some of the range of the clarinet, giving it a bigger, warmer sound.
Tom
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Author: Tony F
Date: 2017-05-14 07:00
Due to some foolishness in my younger days I now have difficulty standing for more than about 10 minutes at a time. Most of my playing is with concert bands where we play sitting, but when I play with a jazz band I take along a tall bar stool which gets me up to a near standing position without too much discomfort. I have to be a bit careful though, last year I fell off it halfway through Petite Fleur.
Tony F.
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Author: kilo
Date: 2017-05-14 13:09
I practice Tenor and bari standing, because that's usually how I perform with them. I practice clarinet and bass clarinet sitting, because that's how I usually perform with them. As a clarinet student I always stood for my lessons. My most uncomfortable gig was playing tenor in a church, seated on a pew, not being able to play the horn from the side, and having to sit sideways on the bench — for two rather long hours — one of the few times I wished I were playing an alto.
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Author: Slowoldman
Date: 2017-05-15 14:49
Why is resting the bell on a knee a problem, as long as you're not blocking the bell? (For the record, I play double-lip, so I do it.)
Amateur musician, retired physician
Delaware Valley Wind Symphony, clarinet 1
Bucks County Symphony Orchestra, clarinet 2 (sub)
Post Edited (2017-05-15 14:52)
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Author: WhitePlainsDave
Date: 2017-05-15 18:21
Slowoldman: resting the bell on the knee: not a problem....
Single lip players bracing the clarinet between their knees and as a result not being able to play as well standing up, and who don't use a neck strap: problem--at least for me.
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Author: kdk ★2017
Date: 2017-05-15 18:28
Slowoldman wrote:
> Why is resting the bell on a knee a problem, as long as you're
> not blocking the bell? (For the record, I play double-lip, so
> I do it.)
>
I play double-lip, too, and I also rest the bell of my Bb on my knee and my A between my knees (it's too long to go comfortably on top). I do it as much to stabilize the clarinet and prevent movement when my fingers move as to support the weight. In fact, I take a lot of the weight back onto my right thumb when I have slower-moving passages with enough fingers down to have a good hold.
I think the main problem to guard against isn't so much "blocking the bell" as keeping the mouthpiece positioned optimally in your mouth and not letting your knee determine what goes on at the mouthpiece end. In lazier moments, I notice the mouthpiece tending to drop downward away from my embouchure and with it pulling my lip away from my teeth. The result is loss of focus and control.
The clarinet has a fixed length, so the distance between knee and embouchure depends on an individual player's size and the positions of his knee and his head. You have to be continually aware of maintaining that distance so that the clarinet is still "snugging" optimally into your embouchure and angled for clean articulation.
Karl
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Author: kdk ★2017
Date: 2017-05-15 18:36
WhitePlainsDave wrote:
> Single lip players bracing the clarinet between their knees and
> as a result not being able to play as well standing up, and who
> don't use a neck strap: problem--at least for me.
Neckstraps are of no help in stabilizing a wobbly clarinet when you're playing around the throat notes.
Why is it's being a problem different between single lip and double lip players (i.e. why do you imply that it's OK for a double lip player not to be able to play standing but not OK for a single lip player)?
For a player (younger student or adult) whose only playing is in concert ensembles where he always sits, why is being able to play standing an important skill to maintain?
Karl
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Author: ClarinetRobt
Date: 2017-05-15 19:22
Since I'm always sitting in the ensembles (like we all do), and it's rare I play a solo with any group, I only practice standing up for the piece I'll perform standing. I'm not sure if that's 'normal' in wind solo playing, but makes sense to me. I want to experience the playing same position as the ultimate performance. Mostly to be comfortable and have no surprises.
Standing, however, has revealed arthritis starting to creep into my right hand after playing standing for about an hour. A few ibuprofen remedies the pain, but it's alarming to realize I'm finally falling apart.
~Robt L Schwebel
Mthpc: Behn Vintage
Lig: Ishimori, Behn Delrin
Reed: Legere French Cut 3.75/4, Behn Brio 4
Horns: Uebel Superior (Bb,A), Ridenour Lyrique, Buffet R13 (Eb)
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Author: GeorgeL ★2017
Date: 2017-05-15 20:04
One band I play with keeps the bassoon and bass clarinet players seated during the national anthem. Another band wants us to stand. If I cannot get my chair in position to support the bass clarinet, I just hold it with my right hand and play when possible with my left hand.
I did support the bass clarinet with my right thumb once for the national anthem. Never again.
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