 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: michigan
Date: 2010-10-09 22:30
I know it sounds like a crazy idea: I know nothing about clarinets and want to buy a used clarinet on one of the online auctions ) for my daughter... Her future teacher (whom I did not meet yet) told me to rent Buffet B12 but I am thinking about buying the one that is advertised as "Buffet Crampon Clarinet B12 used in MINT condition. This item seems to have been played maybe a few times great shape!"
I think this clarinet comes from some Pawn Shop and it is in a grey (not black plastic) case.
I know that it is always the risk, but maybe, you could tell the age just by looking at its box, etc... I am afraid that this one is 50 year old and needs a lot of work...
Please, help!
Anna
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2010-10-10 01:51
Here's some things to read through that might help out....
http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/read.html?f=1&i=45232&t=44856
http://www.woodwind.org/clarinet/Equipment/Beginner_Equipment.html
http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/read.html?f=1&i=60378&t=60355
Some of these threads might be a little old, but clarinets (in general) have not changed much. Model names change, some minor improvements here or there, but in general, the methods/suggestions for buying a clarinet in these threads and places will still apply. In the past ten years there have been some new makers and models of clarinets suitable for beginners out there. The FORTE clarinet, RIDENOUR clarinet, veryrecently the leblanc BLISS clarinet, things like that. But overall, read over these, and do a search on this bulletin board for "beginner clarinet" or something similar and it should give you some stuff to read through.
If you have questions about particular clarinets, please give the people on the board more detailed information if you can. Make and model of clarinet, price, condition, budget, what's it come with, etc. etc. I can't help you as I have NO experience with beginners or teaching, but many on this board have and hopefully you'll get some good responses.
Alexi
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Author: SteveG_CT
Date: 2010-10-10 13:16
If neither you nor your daughter have any clarinet playing experience I would recommend against buying a used instrument off of the online auction site unless you plan to bring it to a technician for an inspection immediately after receiving it and are willing to pay for repairs up to and including a full overhaul. I have bought several clarinets off of the auction site over the years and have never had one arrive in perfect playing condition regardless of the claims made in the item description.
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Author: knotty
Date: 2010-10-10 13:47
Be careful of fakes. It may also be a fake someone is trying to re-sell after getting fooled. Read Lelia Loban's post.
~ Musical Progress: None ~
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Author: kdk ★2017
Date: 2010-10-10 14:06
I would second the warnings about fakes' and misrepresented items' being offered online at auction sites. Many music stores that rent student instruments to beginners have a very low introductory rate - often 3 or 4 months for very nearly the same fee as the monthly charge after the introductory period is over. Even if you plan to shop for the best deal on a purchase, the initial rental can buy you some time while you and your daughter get to know the teacher and perhaps get more ideas from him/her about possible instrument sources.
In my 30+ years of teaching instrumental music in a school setting, I saw many, many students trying to play on completely unplayable instruments that their parents got "on the web." You can get relative bargains online from reputable, established music dealers (there were a couple of them that I was comfortable about recommending to parents who didn't want to spend what the local store was asking), but the price difference is not what you will get from "the" (or an) auction site. The likelihood that an auction-purchased instrument is either ersatz or in worse condition than promised is in my experience very high, and **unless you know what you've actually gotten when it arrives,** you could waste a lot of your daughter's energy and enthusiasm (not to mention the cash you will have spent) on an instrument that will be a serious obstacle to her success.
Best of luck,
Karl
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Author: Tony F
Date: 2010-10-11 08:22
I buy and sell used instruments, and some of them I get from that auction site. I keep pretty well to the major makers and I've had a couple of bad ones, about 2 in perhaps 25 bought there. Most of the instruments I've sourced from that site have needed work, ranging from a complete repad and recork to some minor tweaking of the keywork. I sell clarinets there as well, but the ones I sell really are ready to go. If you plan to buy there, build sufficient slack into your budget to allow for whatever needs doing. I do my own repairs, so I'm not too concerned about that aspect, but if I had to pay somebody to do the fixes it could be an expensive exercise.
I've had some very sad instruments brought to me that were purchased on that site, and while they all ended up as good playable instruments the cost of the necessary work certainly took the edge off any savings in the purchase price.
Tony F.
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Author: Kontra
Date: 2010-10-12 00:11
Hey, I know your daughter's soon to be teacher recommended a Buffet B12, but if you want to know about other beginner clarinets, I started out on a Yamaha YCL-250 4 and a half years ago when I was in 6th grade. This is my second year marching it. Ive had no repair problems with it other than a stack being frozen because of my high school's state champion game. To me, its a good starter horn. Even though its just a student instrument, I still manage to cut through the rest of the marching band with my sound. I would recommend a Hite mouthpiece and a Rovner ligature if your daughter is a serious beginner. I'm in no way a pro, but that's just my thoughts.
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Author: JJAlbrecht
Date: 2010-10-12 00:55
Why don't you check with the band teacher at your child's school. He orshe may know of a student who bought one of those clarinets and later decided clarinet was not worth continuing (it does happen from time to time!). That way, you stand a greater chance of not buying a cheap fake sight unseen.
Jeff
“Everyone discovers their own way of destroying themselves, and some people choose the clarinet.” Kalman Opperman, 1919-2010
"A drummer is a musician's best friend."
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Author: Jack Kissinger
Date: 2010-10-12 01:47
A buyer who knows a lot about clarinets can do well purchasing on eBay even if (sometimes particularly if) the seller doesn't know anything about clarinets. A buyer who doesn't know anything about clarinets can still make a reasonable purchase on eBay if the seller knows a lot about clarinets (and is honest which, believe it or not most sellers are -- exceptions include the ripoffs selling Chinese counterfeits and (sorry) some pawn shops).
In the situation you are describing, however, neither you nor the seller know anything about clarinets. You might get lucky but this sounds like a recipe for disaster to me. Even if the seller is honest s/he wouldn't know a serious problem if s/he saw one (or it bit him/her on the ...). Since you are not capable of making an independent determination of quality on your own, stick with a seller you can trust (and can reach out and touch later if you have a problem). The worst-case scenario is that you buy a clarinet with a serious problem that goes undetected and robs your child of the joy of music.
Best regards,
jnk
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Author: Lelia Loban ★2017
Date: 2010-10-12 18:17
Jack Kissinger wrote,
>>Since you are not capable of making an independent determination of quality on your own, stick with a seller you can trust (and can reach out and touch later if you have a problem). >>
I think that's excellent advice. The restored, used instrument from a reliable local dealer will cost more up front, but it can end up being much cheaper than buying an unplayable fake or a badly-used clarinet that needs a ton of expensive work.
Lelia
http://www.scoreexchange.com/profiles/Lelia_Loban
To hear the audio, click on the "Scorch Plug-In" box above the score.
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Author: TianL
Date: 2010-10-12 19:19
i didn't read everyone's reply above, but what you can also do is considering get a used E11 from that auction site. It's higher than the B12 and there hasn't been any fake ones.
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Author: Jack Kissinger
Date: 2010-10-13 00:00
"i didn't read everyone's reply above"
Well, if you want to add something intelligent to the conversation, maybe you should.
The problem isn't just whether the instrument is a fake. It's also the instrument's potential condition. An E11 could be 30 years old. If you don't know what you're doing, then buying a used E11 on eBay is just as risky as buying a B12 -- and it costs more.
jnk
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Author: michigan
Date: 2010-10-13 16:18
Attachment: clarinet.pdf (162k)
I guess, some people (like me) are just crazy... Here I am buying the clarinet on eBay...
Thank you so much for the advices: I got very scared by the possibility to buy a fake one so, I’ve developed the following strategy:
1) Look at the instruments with multiple bids.
2) Find a seller with “return policy”
3) Bid my max amount during the last minute.
4) Worry if the bids are uneven numbers (which may indicate shill bidding)
5) Pray to get lucky, but be ready to part with extra 100$
As a result, I bought B12 that looks like this for under 200$:
“Buffet Crampon Clarinet B12 used in MINT condition. This item seems to have been played maybe a few times great shape!” ,7 day money back, sold by some pawn shop, 16 bids. 99.5 positive feedback
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Author: JJAlbrecht
Date: 2010-10-13 18:58
>>>4) Worry if the bids are uneven numbers (which may indicate shill bidding)
Not sure if that would be an indicator of shills. i don't always bid in nice increments of $5 or $10. I am not a shill bidder, either.
Jeff
“Everyone discovers their own way of destroying themselves, and some people choose the clarinet.” Kalman Opperman, 1919-2010
"A drummer is a musician's best friend."
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