 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: William
Date: 2010-07-06 14:49
Doesn't seem as if any set of uniform "standards" really exist. I'ts not just about talent, but also personallity, money (how much can we afford?) and even, perhaps, personal appearance. As far as I am concerned, I play "OK" (good enough to get by with most mainstream orchestral literature), would play for free (if offered a job with the NYP or MET, ex) and have a great personality (as you all know from my frequent postings :>) But they would definately have to lower their PA standards as I am "long of tooth" (as my dentist tells me) and basically, short and ugly. However, if they loosen up a bit in those areas, HEY GUYS--I have some free dates on my calander and could fill in for Drucker on a moments notice. Just give me a call--but be sure to speak clearly as I have this hearing problem.........
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Author: Ed Palanker
Date: 2010-07-06 14:54
It would help if they actually hired someone when they have national opened auditions. I know even here in Baltimore there have been many occasions when we would not hire anyone after hear 50-150 applicants for an opened position. We have several very strong string players that have auditioned for some of those orchestra's mentioned in the article, sometimes making the finals, and not being hired. Having a very high standard is understandable but sometimes it gets ridiculous. So the result in many cases is that they have the same opening for several years and use subs all that time instead. We have had some subs perform with us for 4-5 years before finally filling a position. The subs are good enough to play every major concert, recordings and tours for years but not good enough to be hired. Doesn't always make sense to me. ESP http://eddiesclarinet.com
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2010-07-06 16:04
As our local cynic, I would put forth that many positions remain unfilled for the same reason your average company prefers temps - they don't have to pay benefits.
Money, money, money, money.
...............Paul Aviles
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Author: Liquorice
Date: 2010-07-06 17:05
What Paul says would make sense, except for the fact that it's not the same people who decide on hiring as those who are responsible for the budget. An orchestra is one of the very few institutions in which the employees (members of the orchestra) decide who they want to work with. Management (who are responsible for the budget) have very little say in the matter.
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Author: Simon Aldrich
Date: 2010-07-06 22:42
"What Paul says would make sense, except for the fact that it's not the same people who decide on hiring as those who are responsible for the budget."
But it is the same people who are responsible for the budget who decide *if* there will be an audition. Both orchestras here in Montreal do exactly what Paul describes; they leave positions unfilled (and hire for that position on a per-service basis) with the express purpose of saving money. My orchestra has done it for decades. It is a common practice.
Simon
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Author: grifffinity
Date: 2010-07-07 04:44
Quote:
It would help if they actually hired someone when they have national opened auditions. I know even here in Baltimore there have been many occasions when we would not hire anyone after hear 50-150 applicants for an opened position.
Didn't Baltimore go through about three different occasions to audition for a Flute position not too long ago? I recall reading a thread about it on MyAuditions.com
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Author: Liquorice
Date: 2010-07-07 12:45
Simon- I've never heard of something like that in a European orchestra, unless the orchestra has publicly announced that they are reducing the number of salaried positions in the orchestra. Here it's common that the musicians at the auditions decide that none of the candidates were "good enough" and for this reason the posts can stay vacant for some years.
I'm sorry to hear that the orchestras in Montreal are in such a bad financial situation :-(
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Author: Ed Palanker
Date: 2010-07-07 14:26
Paul is absolutely correct, that's what happens in a great many cases. In our last contract in Baltimore, which we gave back over 20% of our salary and benefits, after already giving back about 10%, we were forced into an agreement to reduce the full time orchestra from the contracted number of 96 or far less. The agreement calls to hire one or two full time positions back in each of the next few contract years. We'll see what happens in the future. In most cases when someone leaves or retires their position is filled with a part time player on an as need basis or not filled at all. We are presently short a player in our trumpet, trombone, bassoon, flute and every one of our string sections. It's a lot cheaper to pay a sub on a per service basis and not have to pay benefits. We haven't had a full time harp player for about 8 years now. ESP http://eddiesclarinet.com
PS. Griff is correct, we had at least 3 national flute auditions and didn't hire anyone. The same thing happened with our ass. principal 2nd violin, we had auditions over a five year period and never hired anyone. When they finally did he turned it down that last minute. It took a few auditions to finally hire a 2nd trumpet and several years ago every time the percusion committee choose a winner the conductor vetoed it. I believe they choose the same player at least three times but finally had to give into the conductors wishes. It's a tough profession. ESP
ESP eddiesclarinet.com
Post Edited (2010-07-08 01:37)
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Author: GeorgeL ★2017
Date: 2010-07-07 14:51
Orchestras are holding auditions and not selecting a winner, or are leaving positions vacant and using subs. In both cases, the orchestra saves money over hiring a full time replacement.
In Baltimore, it looks like 10% of the orchestra may be subs. From the posts I've read here, it seems like many other orchestras may have one or two subs.
When an orchestra has one or more subs, especially in non-principal positions, is there a noticeable change in the sound of the orchestra? If so, is this change noticeable only to orchestra members, or also to a small portion of the audience, or also to many in the audience?
I have to assume that if the change in sound is not noticeable to most of the audience, until the economy and corporate donations returns, this practice will only increase.
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Author: Ed Palanker
Date: 2010-07-08 00:07
It appears that in many cases it's true, the average audience member, and unfortunately most board members, don't recognize the difference in quality, but believe me, in many case we do, especially over time. It's a said state when the board and management are willing to give up quality over time for finances. It's so much easier for them to fund the orchestra that way, they don't have to work as hard or make financial commitments. As long as they see an orchestra on stage so many of them just don't care if it's a first rate symphony or just a symphony. We are experiencing that in my orchestra. They just don't care or even know the difference, but we sure know and those that can tell hear the difference over time. You can't build or sustain a great symphony with subs coming and going. ESP
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Author: JJAlbrecht
Date: 2010-07-08 02:04
I think you're right, Ed. It's sad, but they don't realize that you need to have the best members of a team there, and there consistently over time, to continue producing quality. Unfortunately, many on the boards are not that well trained musically to appreciate the differences.
There's a parallel in the US auto industry, during the time from the '70s to the 'early '90s, where quality became a secondary consideration, and the companies were run by bean-counters, instead of car guys. I think they finally learned the lesson with the loss of market share. They make great cars again, but is it in time? I have to wonder how much of Toyota's current trouble stems from a similar mistake in priorities.
Jeff
“Everyone discovers their own way of destroying themselves, and some people choose the clarinet.” Kalman Opperman, 1919-2010
"A drummer is a musician's best friend."
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