 The Oboe BBoard
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Author: vboboe
Date: 2008-01-03 16:58
<<On another topic, was listening to a recording on TV Galaxie channel of VSO doing Debussy's Clair de Lune (wow, that's a gorgeously beautiful shimmering piece) and among the other solo passages there was the E-Horn and the oboe (and the bassoon), and i certainly could tell the difference between oboe's solo melody playing, and merge-with-the-woodwind or with-strings playing, there's just more 'presence' (projection) in the solo passage -- on same reed i betcha>>
So for you experienced players out there, do you deliberately do ‘something extra’ when playing solo passages compared to merging with the other musicians, and if it’s not a Mystic Secret never to be divulged, what is that ‘extra’ in playing technique?
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Author: hautbois
Date: 2008-01-03 19:48
Yes, one might play more "soloistically" when the oboe has a solo, while trying to meld more with one's colleagues when it is the ensemble which is more important. In recorded music the sound engineers may further enhance the solo lines, and that may be the result which you heard. And yes, there is something 'extra' in the playing when the oboe has a solo line (though he conductor may moderate the instrumentalist's natural instinct). The dynamic may deviate from that played in the ensemble; i.e., a "piano" dynamic in a solo part can be louder than "piano", as it must be heard. In addition, there may be more intensity in the tone and a touch of rubato added, and the choice of how to use vibrato may differ from that in ensemble playing. However, many solos for oboe are appropriately played without any additional expressivo attributes, such as when they are part of a larger musical phrase where alternating instruments are developing a longer line than just that of the oboe. The choices are dictated by both inherent musical taste and that which is acquired by performance and listening experience. The conductor's role is of course relevant here.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2008-01-03 20:07
Not oboe or even oboe related (but still well within context of this topic) I was playing bass clarinet in Butterworth's 'A Shropshire Lad', towards the end there's a bas clarinet line marked 'p' which I assumed (having never played this before) that I was part of an emsemble, so I played it p-pp only realising it was a solo. Conductor asked for more, so I gave it more.
And this is fairly common in orchestral and ensemble playing - even if the solo is only marked p or mf, you have to read it as 'soloist's p (or mf)', you will have to give it more than is written to let it come through (and the other players OUGHT to be sympathetic and not overpower anyone).
Definitely the rubato and the extra amount of vibrato (though not overdoing it), as well as your special 'solo tone' (with more intensity than your ensemble tone, but not to the point of cracking up) can be employed in these special occasions to make the solo part prominent from the underlying texture.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: Dutchy
Date: 2008-01-04 13:05
It's probably a lot like singing in a choir, too. If you're a loud soprano surrounded by a bunch of not-so-loud sopranos, you've got to throttle it back or else it'll sound like You And Your Backup Singers. But when you've got a solo, you can rear back and let 'er rip.
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Author: d-oboe
Date: 2008-01-04 14:02
It's a bit of an elusive concept.
One certainly shouldn't just blast away their solos with warble-garble vibrato, just because because it's their shining moment. It takes a bit of mastery. How loud should it be? Well, play solos fully, and confidently, en caractère, and if it's a bit too loud, the conductor will tell you. (Or at least they should)
Mere loudness is not an indicator of anything. Moreover, I certainly don't "calculate" my loudness by "playing mf" if it says "p". Those are two different things! Dynamics are a state of mind! Piano doesn't just mean "quiet" - it means that the entire line is more subdued in nature - articulation, length of phrasing, intensity: everything. Mezzo-forte, naturally, is a bit more firm in articulation, there are usually shorter, more direct phrases, etc.
So, when playing in orchestra, if the composer writes "piano" he means piano! All the characteristics of piano (listed above, but you can think of many others) MUST be retained. Only then can the volume increase to satisfy blend.
(Of course, in much classical and baroque music "p" and "f" are sometimes the only dynamics used - there is a bit more room for interpreting and adjusting dynamics. However, the mainstay of orchestral music lies ( or began to lie) in the romantic period where dynamic gradation was in use. Trust the composer )
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Author: jhoyla
Date: 2008-01-05 17:15
[Amateur warning - I'm definitely not a pro]
I consciously try and meld with the other players when the line is not on my instrument. I do this in several ways:
1. As others have stated, less rubato and vibrato
2. Dynamics in line with other instruments. There is a delicate line to tread here - oboes DO stand out, but the composer KNOWS this and has asked you to play anyway
3. Intonation. Even though I KNOW I'm right (yuk yuk), I always adjust if the others (you know who you are) are going very sharp. This is especially true of unison playing with the flutes - they love to fly. I tell my 1st flutist that we are both playing a "floboe", and that this is the sound we should aim for. We work at it, and sometimes achieve it. I always have my tuner out, and the rest of the wind section knows what it means when my tuner lands on their stand ..
When you are the solo line - you are THE soloist. Just like a high wire acrobat, every nuance you make, every phrase is ruthlessly exposed in the spotlights. If you can't handle this - play second oboe! I work with our conductor on these sections, to get them exactly as she requires. I practice these sections endlessly, and pray a lot before performance ..
J.
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Author: johnt
Date: 2008-01-05 20:47
As my teacher keeps telling me, one thousand and one correct repetitions to get it right once on the concert stage. The secret is in slow.
Best,
john
johnjhoyla wrote:
I practice these
sections endlessly, and pray a lot before performance ..
J.
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Author: doublereeder2
Date: 2008-01-06 04:04
In addition to what the others have said, I also like to change the color in my tone to either blend or stand out as required by the music and ensemble. Air and embouchure are my tools for coloring the tone.
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Author: Phil Freihofner
Date: 2008-01-09 06:26
vboboe wrote:
> <<On another topic, was listening to a recording on TV Galaxie
> channel of VSO doing Debussy's Clair de Lune (wow, that's a
> gorgeously beautiful shimmering piece) and among the other solo
> passages there was the E-Horn and the oboe (and the bassoon),
> and i certainly could tell the difference between oboe's solo
> melody playing, and merge-with-the-woodwind or with-strings
> playing, there's just more 'presence' (projection) in the solo
> passage -- on same reed i betcha>>
>
> So for you experienced players out there, do you deliberately
> do ‘something extra’ when playing solo passages compared to
> merging with the other musicians, and if it’s not a Mystic
> Secret never to be divulged, what is that ‘extra’ in
> playing technique?
This is an interesting question. What are the tools available to either step forward or back?
One can play louder or softer. Articulations, independant of volume, can be crisper or harsher or more exaggerated, or they can be softened. Vibrato can be more pronounced or vary within a note, or to blend, can be suppressed altogether or limited to fit "within" the bounds of the vibrato used by the other instruments.
It is possible to intensify the core of the tone by operating at a higher air pressure level. At higher air pressure levels, the slightest flutter or tremble or other variation of breath pressure can be used expressively. These gestures can draw or direct attention to the musical gesture. If overused, though, they are like an actor that is a habitual scene stealer. When minimized, this can help the instrument recede into the background. I'm not sure what to call this technique. It is not vibrato, though it does involve "micro" fluctuations of breath pressure (on a much shorter time scale than a simple crescendo or diminuendo).
I'd like to see "intesity" given a good breakdown. I think I only hit a couple of its components. One additional thought: "change" draws attention, and things that do not move tend to fall into the background. So maybe the main thing is that when soloing, one uses every available tool in a dynamic way, but in blending, one takes care to follow and stay within the dynamics of others, or play in a way that is as "static" as possible while staying musical.
http://adonax.com
Post Edited (2008-01-09 06:30)
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