 The Oboe BBoard
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Author: claire70
Date: 2007-10-16 20:31
Are there any Marigaux players out there? I have just bought a new Marigaux last week, after playing a Loree for the last 20 years; I like the sound a lot more. But I would be interested to hear from anyone if Marigaux oboes have particular 'quirks', so I can work out what might be typical of the brand, what is this particular oboe, and what is me!
The main things I've noticed so far: the C (octave above middle) is quite flat and I am having to lip it up dramatically, especially if playing quietly; the B just below that is mostly in tune but quite resistant (hard to describe). If I'm playing D-sharp to C-sharp slurred, the C-sharp doesn't always want to come out. Generally I suspect the instrument is marginally on the flat side (although I haven't tried it with enough reeds to be sure).
Can anyone comment? Also, what, if anything, is likely to change as I blow it in?
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Author: ohsuzan
Date: 2007-10-16 20:43
You might drop a note to Patty Mitchell via her website at http://www.oboeinsight.com. If memory serves, she is a Marigaux player. She's very friendly, and will certainly respond to your query.
Susan
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Author: hautbois
Date: 2007-10-16 21:37
Claire -- I have two Marigaux 2001s, made two years apart. They differ from each other in intonation on particular notes, and so I cannot tell you there is a particular Marigaux intonation pattern. Both instruments were quite stuffy until broken in (a year for each of mine until they seemed fully resonant). I had some tonehole work done on each of them to even out the scale in terms of intonation and resistance. I played Loree for many, many years (AK models), and then Laubin (which had a color which I loved, though the instrument had problems), and now the Marigaux. I play professionally, and have been satisfied with them. If you are going to have any work, such as tonehole modification, done, wait until the instrument is broken in.
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Author: mschmidt
Date: 2007-10-16 22:02
Well I'm glad I'm not the only Marigaux owner with a flat C. Well, not glad, exactly, but comforted somewhat....
Mike
Still an Amateur, but not really middle-aged anymore
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Author: oboemelli
Date: 2007-10-17 10:58
Hello there!
I have been a Marigaux player for 4 of the 6 years I have been playing and I don't think I'll be very likely to change...
You are quite right about the Cs. Can I ask if you are english thumbplate or conservatoire? I play a thumbplate/dual system model and the Cs are either a bit flat on thumplate or awfully sharp with conservatoire. You'll get used to lipping up the Cs.
I see what you mean about the Bs but I think they have a great depth and warmth about them that you can't get out of other oboes.
With the C#-D# thing that's probably just your particular oboe- perhaps it has double action?
I can't really say that Marigauxs are on the flat side. I find they are quite sharp, particularly around the middle D area. I've been used to pulling them down so much that when I tried a friend's Howarth the other day it was rather flat!
The only other things that I would watch out for is that they have the 'saggy G' syndrome! On a soft reed in particular, the Gs, especially the lowest one, are a nightmare. The C#s are very sharp, but I suppose that's with every oboe and if necessary you can get it undercut to flatten it slightly.
I personally feel that Marigauxs have an absolutely beautiful tone and range of colour that you can't find anywhere else. The other thing I have noticed recently too is that everyone's Fs are really sharp and nasty sounding compared to ours!
My oboe got loads better when it was blown in and the sound range increased considerably.
Mel
"People imagine they can reach one another. In reality they only pass each other by"- Schubert.
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Author: claire70
Date: 2007-10-22 07:02
Thanks Mel, that's really helpful. I'm a thumbplate player; and actually I mentioned the flatness issue to the Howarths people when I was there the other day, and they said it's a common problem when they put the thumbplate on, that they can fix easily. However, having said that, I now seem to be lipping it in without even thinking about it! It's definitely not that noticeable any more (unless my ears have just stopped working).
I'm getting used to the B too. The C#-D# is still sometimes odd, but I haven't worked out what's going on there. I also can't slur from bottom Bb to bottom B (the Bb key stays down), but hey, how often does one really need to do that?.... And the C# is definitely really sharp, but that seems to be the bane of every oboe.
Other than that, it's gorgeous! :-)
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Author: camille
Date: 2007-10-22 08:21
Out of interest, what length of staple are you using on your instrument? My Buffet has good scale when played with 46mm staples, but using 47mm upsets the intonation right around your problem b-c area... Might be worth experimenting...
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Author: jhoyla
Date: 2007-10-22 12:03
> I also can't slur from bottom Bb to bottom B (the Bb key stays down),
> but hey, how often does one really need to do that?....
Chris P can confirm but that sounds like a mechanical problem with your new oboe, possibly a bent or pinched tube down to the low Bb. I would get that seen to now, while it is still under warranty.
Regarding the sharp C# - see if you can adjust the C# pad a little closer to the hole. Depending on how sharp it is, this may fix your problem. check both octaves! Better still, get Howarth's to do the adjustment. While the instrument is under warranty they should fix any problems like this, especially serious intonation issues.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2007-10-22 13:20
The sticking low Bb is most likely due to the feather key barrel (LH Eb, B and Bb cluster) being bent near the top end.
It can be straigtened out, but this can also be avoided by not laying the oboe down on the feather key side as that will put presure on the most delicate part of the pinned mechanism and bend the touches inwards, consequently bending the key barrel makign the low Bb stick when you don't want it to. If laying the oboe down, always lie it on the kidney keys (RH C, C# and Eb cluster) side as there is less to get damaged there, and easier to fix if they do get bent. Or use a stand.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
Independent Woodwind Repairer
Single and Double Reed Specialist
Oboes, Clarinets and Saxes
NOT A MEMBER OF N.A.M.I.R.
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: claire70
Date: 2007-10-22 16:57
> The sticking low Bb is most likely due to the feather key
> barrel (LH Eb, B and Bb cluster) being bent near the top end.
Don't blame me! It's been like that since I tried it in Howarths... Actually, having looked at it again this afternoon, I wonder if it's something to do with the screws and/or springs. (Not that I really know what I'm talking about here.) If you hold both B and Bb down, what happens when you take your finger off the Bb key is that the key itself (where your finger is) lifts up very slightly, but it doesn't seem to have sufficient 'weight' to come up fully and bring the covering of the hole up further down. Chris, does that make sense? Could you diagnose?
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Author: hautbois
Date: 2007-10-22 18:33
As a short term fix, if it helps at all, try backing off the screw (loosening it) at the end of the B flat rod next to the joint with the bell. If that helps, then your rod may be binding witin its sleeve, and needs correction by a professional. Also, make certain that the spring under that part of the rod is securely set in the hook for it under the rod.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2007-10-22 18:55
I wasn't blaming you personally, but laying oboes down on the feather keys is the most common cause for this trouble, and there are a lot of players and teachers that do this without realising the implications.
On Marigaux oboes they have the bell key and bell vent mounted on a pinned steel (like the top joint trill levers, feather keys and kidney keys), and this is mounted between point screws. Check there's some slight lateral movement between the pil'ars (if it's too tight it can cause binding), and check that both the bell vent and low Bb key work independantly of one another, and there's sufficient spring tension to make them work. Check the low Bb pad opens and closes under it's own spring while the bell vent is held open.
The linkage from the feathers to the bell key (just above the tenon, on the right as you're looking at it) should be able to return to it's resting position under it's spring tension. If it doesn't, the spring could be weak, the screw or key barrel could be bent or the upper pillar could be misaligned. Even if there is lateral play between pillars, a slightly twisted pillar (where the screw thread is) will cause the key to bind.
To be honest, it will need to be looked at as that's the only way this problem can be diagnosed and then sorted out. But this problem should really have been pointed out to a member of staff at the time so it could have been dealt with there and then.
And problems like this can happen to any make of oboe.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
Independent Woodwind Repairer
Single and Double Reed Specialist
Oboes, Clarinets and Saxes
NOT A MEMBER OF N.A.M.I.R.
The opinions I express are my own.
Post Edited (2007-10-22 19:08)
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Author: claire70
Date: 2007-10-23 06:41
Thanks for the hints, Chris P and Hautbois. Sounds technical.... I'm not sure I trust myself!
> But this
> problem should really have been pointed out to a member of
> staff at the time so it could have been dealt with there and
> then.
I did! And he denied there was a problem... :-/ I didn't argue it because I wasn't 100% sure myself, I thought I might be imagining it. Well, I will probably go in again in a couple of weeks; there's also the flat C I'd like them to look at (which I've now decided is better than it was, but still not completely right...)
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