 The Oboe BBoard
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Author: Jaysne
Date: 2006-10-15 02:44
I'm wondering how absolutely necessary you good oboe players out there think the left F key is. I see some pretty good oboes for sale that don't have it.
My current oboe doesn't have one. I've been taking lessons for a while and seem to get along fine with the two other F fingerings. Can you tell me what I may be missing?
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Author: cjwright
Date: 2006-10-15 03:30
When you begin playing in semi-professional groups, you will want the left hand F.
Normal F has several advantages:
1. Forked F sounds different (brighter)
2. Forked F is often sharp
3. Any Scale going down that has F to Eflat you should be playing forked F (any scale with more flats than F)
4. Any scale going up or down which has a dflat, eflat, and f natural you'll want to be using right hand dflat, left hand eflat (switch to right hand eflat in the middle), left hand eflat
Forked F because of it's instability in pitch, and dullness in tone (without the eflat key) or brightness/sharpness in tone/pitch (with the eflat key) will be deemed unacceptable. By college your conductors will be able to know which one you are using.
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Author: Dutchy
Date: 2006-10-15 04:32
Adult beginner here. I don't have to worry about the members of my chamber music group frowning on me because I don't have a Left F, but I use Left F constantly anyway when going from bottom-low C to up first-space F. It saves a "blip" because your fingers aren't fast enough. It also comes in very handy in the key of Db, for going from first-space F down to low Db, also saving a "blip".
How necessary is it? I'd hate to have to go back to my first oboe that didn't have it. On a scale of "necessity" ranging from "can't live without it" to "don't need it at all", I'd put it about the middle, at "incredibly convenient".
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Author: vboboe
Date: 2006-10-15 04:56
... now that you're asking this question and you've been taking lessons awhile, maybe it's the right time now for you to move up to a left F keyed oboe; however, it does take a bit of getting used to as you have to learn to coordinate different combination of fingers, so you can't expect to be smooth with it right away
However, I would say it's useful to be able to play forked F's with both left and right E-flat as resonance (brightens F) especially if you can work up the difficult co-ordinated combinations for keys in 4 or more flats. There are still lots of very good oboes out there without left F's. Leftie F players are kinda stuck to full keyed oboe models unless they've got those other fingering skills down pat already.
The usual rhetoric supports the notion that left F's are bad and only basic F & left F are good. Somewhat true, but not to be swallowed as a blanket endorsement of left F instruments. A well cut & well adjusted oboe fitted with just F resonance, but no left F, should sound about the same as basic F, making forked F a darn good fingering for passing through in fast flurries.
However, not all oboes are fitted with F resonance either. What about yours? If yes, you don't need to use E-flat to brighten or flatten forked F's. If no F resonance, you do. Learning those fingering techniques left and right is a doozie which is why a lot of people skip it and get left F oboes instead
IMO no left F oboe for anybody with less than 4 beginner years, but hey, everybody wants to take short cuts to get somewhere faster
If you're still not that good at left & right forked F fingering combinations yet, step up intensive drill reps this year and get left F oboe next year -- or a year before you go on to oboe studies at university, whichever comes sooner, in which case learn left F now
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2006-10-15 11:38
I use the LH F a lot - a sequence where you'll definitely need it for smoothness is D-E-F repeated, or D-F-E - both use the LHF to avoid sliding RH finger 3.
And a LHF key can always be added to an oboe that hasn't got one.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
Post Edited (2006-10-15 12:06)
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Author: hautbois
Date: 2006-10-15 12:22
For some reason, my teacher removed the left F from my high school oboe when it was first purchased for me. The consequences were two, one positive and one negative: I am very facile moving to forked F from E; but even after 30+ years on a professional oboe with a left hand F, it does not feel as comfortable as I believe it would have felt had I used a left F when I was developing my technique.
Post Edited (2006-10-15 12:25)
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Author: cjwright
Date: 2006-10-15 13:02
The other thing is many oboes offer models without the forked F resonance key, which is the key on the side of the oboe below your low C, Dflat, Eflat pinky keys on your righthand side.
The advantage of this is that F resonance, even if it's in a perfectly adjusted, good fit pad, still tends to leak a bit. I used to take black electrical tape and tape it off, while taking the actual key/pad off. This helps lower passages, particularly in pieces like Le Tombeau and Mendlesohn Scottish Symphony. It just depends on what your need more I suppose.
I love the feeling of my oboe without the F resonance. It just looks a bit funky.
Overall, I think learning left F can only help your playing, and can't hurt your playing. If you want a basic model with the Left F, I'd say one of those Yamaha 411(?) are decent.
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Author: d-oboe
Date: 2006-10-15 13:18
It only has that bad sound if it's on a bad oboe. On my greenline, I play forked F all the time....even in Tchaikovsky 4th, in the slow movement!
If it sounds bad on a good oboe, the F-resonance key isn't in proper adjustment. It's just that most people don't go looking to fix it, because they just accept that forked F will always have a rotten tone. It doesn't have to!
Of course, it *does* have a slightly different sound than the real F, but it's easy to meld it into a phrase.
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Author: ohsuzan
Date: 2006-10-15 13:50
Thank you all, you experienced oboists, for your comments about the forked-F fingering becoming acceptable on modern oboes.
I have the left-F and F-res on both my oboes, but found it very easy to learn and use the forked-F (both left and right) -- perhaps as a result of earlier years playing recorder. I have read often bout forked-F being a no-no because of suspect intonation and color, but in my experience, it just isn't that way -- it's a pretty decent note, actually.
I also keep the F-res almost closed -- much better time on the low notes that way.
Susan
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Author: oboist
Date: 2006-10-15 19:33
I also have to say,I am using pretty often forked F on my Greenline and it's sounds very decent.Particulary I use in baroque music in order to immitate color of Baroque oboe
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Author: vboboe
Date: 2006-10-16 06:24
oops, sorry folks, my forked fingers made cross-wired typo mustook and tired self-editor missed it, this sentence --
<<the usual rhetoric supports the notion that *** left F's *** are bad and only basic F & left F are good>>
should read
<<the usual rhetoric supports the notion that *** forked F's ***are bad and only basic F & left F are good>>
... hope everybody was able to interpret what i meant to say ? {:-]
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Author: sylvangale
Date: 2006-10-16 06:32
Forked F has been kind to me, never had intonation issues on a number of oboes. I even had an old oboe which has a more intune forked F, but the regular F fingering was out of tune.
As you progress through more complex literature you'll find that working in the left hand F will aid you considerably. Sometimes switching to the right hand F's are simply un-ergonimic and you will find yourself in a lot of pain vs using the left hand F where it would work best.
Go though your music and mark passages that may work out better with a left F and use it there. No need to use it for the sake of it. Just be sure that you use it so that you will be able to call upon it when you need it.
Give that D, E, F and D, F, E sequence a while... repeat them over and over with your normal method and work in the left hand F. Your hands will thank you. It may seem off at first, but all new fingerings are odd, as you make use of the fingering you'll forget all about the difficulty of using it.
... Is there any harm in closing off the F resonance key? I generally use forked F with an added left or right Eb than without as it is consistently stuffy. I find that F resonance a really problematic key on my Loree and would rather be without it myself.
Regards,
Stephen
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Author: cjwright
Date: 2006-10-16 07:07
I've never had problems closing off my R resonance key. Many oboes like covey offer models without the F Resonance.
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Author: phoenix_song
Date: 2006-10-20 08:29
Completely agree. For me it's not about the tone of the F (although that is important) but about fingering ability in different passages. There are situations where forked F is completely appropriate and other situations (like D-F-E's etc) where only left F will do. It's not really that hard to work out what F you will need for what passage. It may take a bit to think about and you may have to make a notation on each F as to how you will play it at first, but in the end it saves you headaches from not being able to play fast parts as smoothly as you would like (and it saves your fingers a lot of unnecessarily awkward sliding)
My wallet photos:
Phoebe the Lesher
Marilee the Loree
Walter and Nichols the oboe reeds
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Author: OboeAgain
Date: 2006-10-20 14:06
I sometimes like the color I get with a forked F without using the E-flat key.
I have also used a "mute" -- usually a piece of cloth stuffed into the bell -- to acheive a similar color. I also find the mute allows for a quieter sound in some delicate passages in wind quintets or quartets.
So, in addition to facilitating fingering in some keys, I like the forked F option to create different tone colors.
Walter
Post Edited (2006-10-21 00:02)
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