 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: WhitePlainsDave
Date: 2015-03-12 01:08
Questions:
1) I've read here that the V21 was Vandoren's answer to the Rico Reserve, and now revamped D'Addario Reserve product lines of reeds. Is there some truth to this?
2) For those with some experience using both the V21 and D'Addario Reserve (Classic of not) product lines, which do you like you better? If so why? I know it may be hard to judge as neither has been in the market that long.
Biases: I have been blown away by the near out of the box playability and consistency of the D'Addario Reserve Classic product line.
Granted, everything is subject to change, but I think what I'm looking for is even a reason to delve into the V21 product line if I'm getting such good fortune with the D'Addario Reserve Classic product line.
(I do not work in the music business.)
Thanks.
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Author: qualitycontrol
Date: 2015-03-12 07:39
They are all really apples and oranges.
The closest comparison to be made between the D'Addario offerings and Vandoren would be with the Vandoren Blue Box. The cut of the Reserve reed is fairly similar, with a regular thickness blank, regular length vamp and medium tip, as well as rounded tip corners and a french file cut.
The Reserve Classic in some ways edges towards a V12, with a squarer tip, a longer vamp (I think the cut is even longer than the V12) and a thick blank, but the RC tapers to a thick tip, whereas the V12 has a thin tip, making them very different reeds in the higher registers.
The V21 is simply the 56 rue Lepic blank (extremely thick, conical blank, regular cut) run through with a V12 profile (a longer vamp and a thinner tip.) This makes it very different than any of the D'Addario products. I haven't tried the V21s and I haven't used the 56s in a long time, but I'm guessing they sound fairly similar, maybe comparable to a Gonzales FOF.
I can attest to the consistency of the Reserve products, but sadly I found they were consistently mediocre. I found the cane waterlogged a lot easier, and I like thick blanks but hate the thick tip of the RCs. There is more variance in a Vandoren box, but I found they overall sound a lot nicer with a bit of work and a proper break-in, plus I don't really mind having some reeds harder than others in my cycle depending on how my chops are feeling any way.
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Author: Bob Barnhart ★2017
Date: 2015-03-12 20:26
I used to play V12 #4's on a (close-facing) Kanter AA many years ago, but as I've tried different mouthpieces over the years, I've experimented with Xilema, Gonzales GD, Rue le PIc 56, Rico Reserve [Classic], VD Blue Box and the D'addario Reserve [Classic] and the V21s.
I played the Rico Reserve (regular "Red Box") reeds for a couple of years on a VD B40. I liked their lively (but not too 'reedy') sound and great response. The Rico Reserve Classics didn't appeal so much to me as they seemed to have a brighter/reedier sound.
In the past 2 years I've been playing mostly #3 VD Blue Box and D'addario Reserve (regular) on a Kessler-Backun III. Recently, I've been [re-]evaluating V12s, V21s and Gonzales GDs.
I love the sound of the D'addario Reserve (regular) reeds--rather different from their Rico counterparts. For me they yield a big, dark, "woody" sound. Unfortunately, as I have a slow tongue, I cannot get them to articulate as quickly as the VD Tradionals (or the old Rico Reserves), so I may use them only sparingly in the future.
I have only played a few of the D'addario Reserve Classic, but like their Rico counterparts, their sound was too bright/reedy for me. Perhaps these play better on closer/longer facings.
For me, the (#3) V21s have great response but play too bright, more like the RLP 56s (which I could never really get into) than the V12s. They just don't have the feeling/sound I'm looking for. Colleagues of mine who have tried the V21s also seem to have a similar opinion.
In contrast, in my recent trials, the #3 V12s have a bit bigger (rounder?) sound than the VD Blue Box, but they seem to require a bit more work to play the way I want (e.g., I always found the V12's rails to be a bit heavy).
I just got a box of #2.75 Gonzales GDs (which since they run stiff, are similar to a #3 VD Traditional). I'd forgotten how great these reeds are. They are really consistent and play just about perfect right out of the box (lively, responsive, warm sound). Unlike most other reeds, they don't seem to change much during break-in, possibly because they are dried/cured longer and don't seem to get waterlogged (?).
Conclusion:
To me, the V21s may be similar to the D'addario Reserve Classic. If the latter work for you, I'm not sure that the V21s will necessarily be better.
However, I like the Gonzales GD, VD Blue Box best, then the V12 and finally the D'addario Reserve (regular). Interestingly, these are all French file-cut reeds (as opposed to the RLP 56, V21 and Reserve Classic).
Expenses aside, it's good to re-evaluate things objectively from time to time.
Bob Barnhart
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Author: Eric V
Date: 2015-05-16 03:12
I've had a chance to play the V21's for a couple months now in a variety of settings and had the same experience as Bob Barnhart posted above. They play easily especially altissimo but tend towards bright and shrill. I went back to V12's. This with a couple of Hawkins B's FWIW.
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2015-05-16 09:29
I can't really speak to the Rico product. A very talented and highly respected colleague of mine got me to try one for about five minutes and I couldn't really stand the experience. So it is more based on how the individual plays as to which reed will work better.
Vandorens (particularly the V21s and V12s) are NOT "right out of the box" reeds. They take about a week to 'settle down.' Even after you think they are all predictable and ready to go, they can still surprise you. BUT they are stable over the long haul. I am going on my third set of V21s and I can't seem to get enough of them....... I am completely in love. But I was also completely sold on the Rue Lepics after an initial trial (so I tend more to a centered, focused reed).
If you're patient, the V21s are quite rewarding.
................Paul Aviles
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Author: Ed
Date: 2015-05-16 15:51
I like the Reserve Classic in both varieties. A friend recently let me try a V21. It played well with no break in and seems promising. While I like it, for me it does not play like the D'Addario/Rico. Both are good, but different.
From the variety of responses here, I would say the only way to really know is to try them to see how they work for you on your set up.
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Author: Jbosacki
Date: 2015-05-18 09:43
I've been playing on the on Rico's since I got my Prestige Bass, It came with a Concert Select Thick Blank as a trial in the case and I fell in love with it. I then bought a box and never went back, did the same for my clarinet. I switched over to both the Rico Reserve Classics for Bass and Clarinet when those came out and the D'adaario Reserve when they switched them over last Summer.
Since Vandoren started the "flow packs" the individually wrapped cases I just.. haven't felt the same about them, I just think it does something negative to the reed.
But as always when a new type of reed comes out I'll buy them just to try them. I was actually really really surprised at the V21's. They play really well for me right out of the box. I even went and put some of them in my reed case, which hasn't seen a Vandoren reed in 8 years.
I honestly think the V21's are the best thing to come out of Vandoren in a long time, not saying I'll switch off because I LOVE the Reserves but they're in my opinion the best Vandoren reed.
Just my thoughts!
-Jeff
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