 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: derf5585
Date: 2015-03-04 19:20
If i want to play a duet with a piano without having to sight transpose can a piano be tuned to B-flat?
fsbsde@yahoo.com
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2015-03-04 19:26
A digital piano can easily be transposed down using the transpose function, but a regular one will need to be retuned down a tone by a piano tuner.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
Post Edited (2015-03-05 04:48)
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Author: clarinetwife
Date: 2015-03-04 19:26
Digital pianos would have a transpose function. As an accompanist that is a nice feature with singers as well when the singer asks if you can take it down a step.
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2015-03-04 23:45
A standard hammer-hits-the string piano wouldn't work at all tuned down a step. In fact, the process would probably destroy it.
However, I once successfully tuned a harpsichord down about 3/4 step to play with a recorder pitched at 405.
I have a Roland keyboard that tunes up and down by half steps and also has a fine-tuning adjustment that lets it play at any pitch between the half steps.
Ken Shaw
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Author: derf5585
Date: 2015-03-05 02:49
"In fact, the process would probably destroy it."
In my HAUGHTY opinion
Changing the pitch would have less pressure on the sounding board.
fsbsde@yahoo.com
Post Edited (2015-03-05 02:49)
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Author: clarinetwife
Date: 2015-03-05 03:10
Well, I wouldn't want to be the technician to try to get that many strings settled in at a pitch a step lower than where they have been since manufacture. I can't imagine it would sound very good.
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Author: Caroline Smale
Date: 2015-03-05 04:36
A piano would take days if not weeks to settle after such a drastic pitch change and involve several iterations of the tuning.
Then changing it back up to concert pitch again would be even more traumatic for the piano.
Of course if you don't want to transpose up a tone at sight (not the most onerous transposition) you could suggest instead the pianist sight reads it down a tone !!
Or as a democratic compromise you go up a semi tone and they go down a semi tone. Love to be a fly on the wall for that one.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2015-03-05 04:49
Another option is borrowing a C clarinet from someone who has one and is willing to lend it out.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: qualitycontrol
Date: 2015-03-05 08:11
Or write a transposition of your duet, either up a tone for you or down a tone for the piano, you won't have to sight-transpose that.
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Author: nellsonic
Date: 2015-03-05 09:59
It's not a hard transposition to learn to do by sight once you've reached an intermediate level of playing proficiency. Why not acquire a new skill rather than potentially ruining a piano?
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Author: kthln.hnsn
Date: 2015-03-05 10:17
As someone who tunes an occasional piano: don't do it. Tuning pianos is not a fun thing to do. But really if you're going to be paid to tune it essentially twice (once to put it out of of tune then again to retune it) then that's not such a bad gig. But since you'd be paying someone I really don't recommend it Also transposing by sight for clarinet is one of the easiest instruments to do.
Post Edited (2015-03-05 10:18)
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Author: Dibbs
Date: 2015-03-05 14:13
Ken Shaw wrote:
> A standard hammer-hits-the string piano wouldn't work at all
> tuned down a step. In fact, the process would probably destroy
> it.
> ...
It would work and it wouldn't do it any harm at all. Nevertheless it really isn't a practical thing to do and it wouldn't sound very good at the lower tension level.
Old pianos, when their pins start to get loose and won't hold at A440 any more are often tuned a semitone down. Another semitone wouldn't hurt it.
I have personally taken all the strings completely off a piano to fix several cracks and refinish the soundboard. You just have to do it evenly ( all the C's then all the D's etc) so as not to put an unusual strain on the frame.
There used to be transposing pianos where a lever shifts the entire keyboard sideways to play in different keys. Irving Berlin apparently had one since (legend has it that) he could only play in C. If that's true he probably had to change gear in the middle of Cheek to Cheek.
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Author: chris moffatt
Date: 2015-03-05 17:40
Can you not find sheet music for your duets that is already written a tone up for clarinet (it is after all your clarinet that is transposed not the piano). I've rarely had problems with this. Or as suggested above DIY.
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Author: derf5585
Date: 2015-03-05 20:15
Irving Berlin had two such instruments. One was donated to the Smithsonian Institution in 1973, and is on display in the National Museum of American Jewish History.[1] Berlin never learned to read music, playing his songs entirely by ear in the key of f-sharp, employing his “trick piano” to do the work as necessary.[2]
from
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transposing_piano
fsbsde@yahoo.com
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Author: derf5585
Date: 2015-03-05 20:19
"Can you not find sheet music for your duets that is already written a tone up for clarinet (it is after all your clarinet that is transposed not the piano). I've rarely had problems with this. Or as suggested above DIY"
Someone at a party plays piano and brings their own music but there is no transposed part. But you do want to join in.
fsbsde@yahoo.com
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Author: Sylvain
Date: 2015-03-05 20:53
It'll probably be cheaper for you to buy a C clarinet than for a piano to be tuned down a step. The plus side is that you'll end up owning a C clarinet
--
Sylvain Bouix <sbouix@gmail.com>
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Author: derf5585
Date: 2015-03-05 21:21
It'll probably be cheaper for you to buy a C clarinet
Why are clarinets pitched in B-flat and not in C?
Should clarinet fingering be taught for a C key (know what I mean?) So if you see a concert C you really figure a D
fsbsde@yahoo.com
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2015-03-05 21:40
The reason why clarinets have specific fingerings for each note regardless of the fact it's not the actual Concert Pitch note is so each member of the clarinet family can be played using the same fingering, so whenever you see a written C, you use that same fingering on all clarinets to keep things simple instead of having to learn different fingerings for each different clarinet.
Same rules apply to all the other orchestral woodwind instruments that are made in a variety of sizes - except recorders where there are two fingering systems for the various sizes depending on which size recorder you're playing. Garklein, soprano (or descant), tenor and great bass are pitched in C whereas sopranino, alto (or treble) and bass are pitched in F.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: Dibbs
Date: 2015-03-06 14:05
Chris P wrote:
> ... - except
> recorders where there are two fingering systems for the various
> sizes depending on which size recorder you're playing.
> Garklein, soprano (or descant), tenor and great bass are
> pitched in C whereas sopranino, alto (or treble) and bass are
> pitched in F.
>
Fortunately for clarinet players doubling on recorders, you just have to think clarion fingering for the C pitched ones and chalumeaux fingering for the F ones.
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Author: Joe M.
Date: 2015-03-06 16:44
Spot on Dibbs. I recently started playing a Meinel descant and a Yamaha alto recorder. Surprise, surprise. My clarinet fingerings worked as you describe - except for the half holes of course.
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Author: Joe M.
Date: 2015-03-06 16:57
I also have a Yamaha keyboard/synthesiser and transposing to Bb takes two clicks. I use it all the time with the built in clarinet sounds.
May I also suggest that you can transpose everything as easily as I can. Capture the sheet music with a scanner and PhotoScore into Sibelius First - a nice inexpensive package which runs on most everything - click a few times to use the inbuilt transposer, which works like a charm, and print the transposed score. Voilà!
The total cost of this solution, including software, scanner and consumables couldn't buy you a decent mouthpiece let alone a C clarinet.
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