 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: halfshellhero
Date: 2013-08-18 05:18
A while back I posted on here asking about lower lip irritation - I think this was in part due to the wood fibers irritating my lip (synthetic reeds do help) and part to do with biting. After analyzing my embouchure and reading about embouchure and trying to decide what do do about my embouchure, I have some questions/confusion.
When I first began playing the clarinet, I had very little formal training and most of my learning was through trial and error, internet resources, and what little knowledge my trumpet playing band director had of the subject (which is something else entirely - I've had two band directors who have been trumpet players, and when they tried to give the reed players advice it was consistently bad/counterproductive, which is why I think beginning band should have more instrument specific instruction, but that's off topic).
So, when I was first beginning I played with what I consider probably my "better" embouchure. Mostly support coming from lip muscles, not teeth, tight corners, although my chin was a bit flabby. My band director (the trumpeteer) told me to "flatten my chin". No further instruction was given, just constantly "flatten your chin". So I did what my interpretation of "flatten your chin" was, which was to pull my bottom lip further into my mouth to get rid of the chin's "angle" I guess? You know that part of the chin where the gums and lip meet? I was trying to reduce the angle there because I thought that was what was meant by "flat". But anyway, I adjusted so when I played my bottom teeth were resting about where the red part of the lip meets the lower part of the lip.
Then my band director told me to smile while playing (again to "flatten" the chin). This caused air to easily escape my corners, and made hitting the high notes harder, which encouraged me to bite to get that extra pressure on the reed, as there wasn't much muscle coming from my corners or from my pulled in lip (I think the red part of the lip is the easiest to get muscle from).
I eventually learned to work around my defective embouchure and got really good at high notes/intonation/general technique, although I still got some comments about how my tone could improve. Mostly that I needed to concentrate on producing a more "centered" tone, and I was at a loss as to how to achieve that as nobody ever told me exactly what "centered" meant or how to achieve it. As you can tell, I get kind of frustrated at the fact that music instructors don't bother to define their terms, especially when talking to beginners as it just causes confusion. Especially when talking about something as abstract and hard to quantify as tone quality.
So I've experimented trying to fix my embouchure, and from what I can tell, the embouchure that seems to give me the best results is more or less the one I began with before all the teachers screwed up my idea of a correct clarinet embouchure. That is, bottom teeth in the center of the red part of the lip, lip exerting 99% of the pressure on the reed, top teeth resting on top of mouthpiece, bottom lip positioned just below where the reed meets the mouthpiece, chin pointed (I prefer to call it pointing or tightening the chin; the term flattening seems confusing and doesn't describe what I'm doing really, or what my chin looks like, although I assume this is what my beginning band teacher was talking about when she told me to "flatten" my chin).
The one area I'm still not really clear on is how the corners are. I get a better seal, more muscle, and better tone when I tighten my corners around the mouthpiece (kind of like making an "O" with my mouth), but I've heard two schools of thought on the subject. One that you should smile (or not necessarily smile, but pull the corners away from the mouthpiece). As mentioned above, this causes air leakage for me and encourages biting. But maybe I'm interpreting the term "smiling" wrong. The other school of thought ( I think this is the minority, though) is that you SHOULD form an "O" around the mouthpiece. I'm inclined to go with my own personal experience as that has been what's worked for me in the past rather than trying to please a well meaning but confusing and/or wrong band director. But am I okay using the "O" corners?
Also, since I've been trying to make changes to my embouchure (maybe a month or so is when I finally diagnosed the problem and tried to address it), the muscles in my mouth are WAY below the strength/stamina they should have for my playing experience. I can sustain the embouchure for a while, but eventually fall back into biting because I just don't have enough muscle to keep pushing up with my lip. I've been doing 10-15 minutes of long tones a day to try and develop my embouchure (especially in the clarion and altissimo). Should I switch to a softer reed for the time being to ease the transition?
Sorry that was such a long post; I feel like it's hard to describe embouchure in words and it's easier if it can be seen.
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Author: halfshellhero
Date: 2013-08-18 05:40
http://clarinet-saxophone.asn.au/wp-content/uploads/The-Clarinet-Embouchure.pdf
reading this article also made me wonder if I should try playing double lip?
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Author: ruben
Date: 2013-08-18 07:21
You took the words out of my mouth! Double-lip is the way to go. It's the most natural embouchure and enables you to open your throat and palate. Some people claim it gives you a smaller sound, but it's not playing double-lip that brings this about; it is the fact that when you do play double-lip, you tend to use a slighly softer reed (I personally use 3.5, just as I did with single-lip.) The only possible drawback I see is that it requires more regular practice, because the upper lip isn't as strong as the lower one and has to be kept in shape. I get a better overall feel of the instrument playing this way too. If you do switch to double-lip, it has to be done gradually: 5 minutes a day at first, then ten, etc.
Good luck and welcome to the double-lip society, I hope!
rubengreenbergparisfrance@gmail.com
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2013-08-18 12:15
halfshellhero -
You're doing it right. "Flatten your chin" means point the tip down and stretch the red part of your lower lip and the area below it tight and "dressy" -- that is, compact and firm, without biting.
The "smile" embouchure style is disfavored by almost everyone, for the reasons you describe -- it leads to leaks and fatigue. Put a little aardvark on your face.
I found an excellent embouchure video by David Etheridge on YouTube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WnRZ9CmOrHM. The buzzing ensures that your support is good and that you don't roll too much of your lower lip in over your teeth. When I tried it, most of the vibration was in my upper lip.
Brass players do this all the time, using a metal ring the size of the mouthpiece rim, mounted on a wand. See http://stores.intuitwebsites.com/windsongpress/-strse-Mouthpiece-Rims--fdsh--Buzz-Aids/Categories.bok. Really advanced brass players buzz without a ring, playing scales and arpeggios. One horn player told me that he could play any pitch with any valve combination. The valves only made it easier.
This doesn't apply to clarinet, of course, but matching your oral resonance to the pitch you're playing on the clarinet can make a big difference. It also makes you aware of the resonance inside your mouth, which you adjust with your tongue and soft palate and, to a lesser extent, your jaw. See my postings about the swab-up-the bell exercise, for example http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/read.html?f=1&i=158954&t=158878.
To get Etheridge's buzz, you need to make sure only half the red part of your lower lip is over your lower teeth and is stretched tight. Think about his triangle demonstration at the beginning of the video. When you do this, you get a strong, resonant, "orchestral" tone, as Etheridge does.
However, when I played this way in a woodwind quintet, the other players complained that I was too loud. When I rolled 2/3 or 3/4 of my lower lip in over my teeth and made the cushion thicker by making an aardvark face, everybody smiled.
On the other hand, when I play in an ineffective range (say the throat tones or the lowest clarion notes), I pull down with the tip of my chin, stretching my lower lip thinner and pulling it out to the Etheridge position. It also helps to bring the clarinet closer to your chest (without dropping your head).
Gino Cioffi was a master at this. If you can find the Boston player's version of the Strauss Serenade Op. 7, notice how effortlessly he dominates the ensemble at the spot about one minute in where he has the solo line beginning on clarion C.
You're doing it right. Now, find an actual clarinet teacher who can watch what you're doing and help you along.
Ken Shaw
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Author: Gordon (NZ)
Date: 2013-08-18 12:43
"...That is, bottom teeth in the center of the red part of the lip"
Not sure what you mean by that, because inside the mouth there is a lot of red lip.
I am but a mere analytical amateur accused a few times of a good sound. But my take is:
1. Using chin and smile muscles, pull the lower lip/skin tight and thin against the chin, with the lip slightly over the lower teeth, such that the centre line of the DRY red part of the lip is directly above the teeth. Or alternatively - individual difference - the line where the dry red part meets skin colour, directly above the teeth.
2. Place the reed on this thin, firm cushion of lip
3. Raise the jaw until the mouthpiece rests against the upper teeth.
4. Close the corners of the lips around the mouthpiece like a rubber band, in order to make a good seal.
5. Relax all muscles involved as much as possible without interfering with the sound and control.
The result is a THIN, firm cushion of lip between the teeth and the reed. (Unlike sax which needs a thick, softer cushion.)
If others disagree, I'm sure they will add their twopence worth. 
I think double-lip embouchure is rather an unrealistically hard and dissatisfying road for all but the most conscientious of players.
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2013-08-18 14:13
Referencing the Campione article, double lip is beneficial for developing a very nuanced sound ala Harold Wright or John Yeh. What makes it difficult for those trying to convert from a single lip is that there is often much more (and wrongly so) jaw muscle involvement (mainly because "you can") with single lip embouchure.
I like number 5 from above. Yes, you need to apply a certain amount of muscle involvement (in fact, besides using your core, or abdominal muscles, the upper lip, lower lip and cheek muscles are the ONLY stress involved in playing clarinet), but only enough to provide a good seal; a solid platform. One should not be exhausted in less than at least a few hours of practice (which is really two 50 min. sessions with two 10 minute rest periods).
Your SOUND comes from the use of AIR more than any other factor.
..............Paul Aviles
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Author: kdk ★2017
Date: 2013-08-18 14:20
Gordon (NZ) wrote:
>
> I think double-lip embouchure is rather an unrealistically hard
> and dissatisfying road for all but the most conscientious of
> players.
Playing double lip *can be* a very good learning tool in developing an effective , comfortable, controlled embouchure. But it doesn't need to be a permanent or full-time commitment. It can be used to provide a model from which to derive an effective single lip embouchure - once the double lip is set, duplicate everything about it except pull the upper lip back*against* the teeth instead of under them.
For some of us, double lip feels so consistently more natural than single lip that it eventually becomes habit and going back to single lip seems awkward. But I started playing double lip - at the suggestion of my teacher, Anthony Gigliotti, who played single lip his whole career - without any intent of staying with it - that just happened, and my results seemed better with it than without it.
Karl
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Author: kdk ★2017
Date: 2013-08-18 14:40
halfshellhero wrote:
> When I first began playing the clarinet, I had very little
> formal training and most of my learning was through trial and
> error, internet resources, and what little knowledge my trumpet
> playing band director had of the subject
Your wanderings since then are a textbook study, IMO, of why it's important at some fairly early stage of learning to play an instrument to study at least on an irregular basis with someone who plays the instrument competently. The two advantages are that the advice you get is directly applicable to the specific instrument (not indirectly by translation from the techniques of other related instruments) and that the teacher can provide a model by demonstrating live what all the technique is supposed to produce. Even at the college level, my clarinet teacher (Gigliotti - surely no slouch as a clarinetist) talked constantly about "center" and "focus" and I still would have had almost no idea what he meant, except that he also demonstrated for me during lessons, which gave me an entirely different perception from the one I had from listening to him play in the Philadelphia Orchestra from the amphitheater seats in Philadelphia's Academy of Music or (even worse) from the recordings of the time.
"Smile" is an approach I heard a lot about when I was growing up in the 1950s and '60s. I haven't personally read anything written more recently supporting it. And to reference the other comments about double lip, I'm not sure a "smile" is even possible with both lips under the teeth. But there are other important parts of technique, including, from what I've heard from my trumpeter son, articulation that are approached differently on different wind instruments, even though the management of air flow is common to all of them.
Even getting advice from an online source like this BB lacks the potential for providing a good model for applying that advice. We deal here entirely with words, while playing an instrument instead centrally involves physical action and non-verbal sound, neither of which can always be reliably described verbally.
Karl
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Author: Roxann
Date: 2013-08-19 02:33
As mentioned in your "lower lip irritation" post a couple of weeks ago, I have the same issue. And, after playing for 3 1/2 hours a day for the past week (I'm playing clarinet for a local musical production), my lower lip is sore, red, and peeling. My teacher has been working with me EXTENSIVELY on changing my embouchure. She describes the correct embouchure as "imagine your mouth is a purse with a drawstring" and you're to tighten all four corners of the drawstring (both sides of your top lip and both sides of your bottom lip). She describes the "flattening your chin" as "lower your chin to the ground." I had a tendency to bite with my lower teeth and the "lower your chin to the ground" has helped me eliminate the biting. The private lessons have been a tremendous help to me. I'm working with a graduate student who is getting her masters in music education and her instrument is clarinet. My tone has changed immensely and I'm actually getting compliments on my tone. I'm convinced the sore, red, peeling part of my chin directly below my lower lip is a result of having to play much longer than my muscles are ready for. My instructor mentioned to me that HER instructor (the clarinet chair in the BSU music dept.) had her work to strengthen the four corners of her mouth with what's called a "facial flex." It's an adaptive device that's used by burn victims to help strengthen their facial muscles after a bad burn. This device helped her develop the strength in the four corners of her mouth that is needed for a correct embouchure. I can't begin to tell you how valuable it's been for me to take lessons from a clarinet grad student.
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