 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: SamuelChan
Date: 2012-05-30 09:15
Hello clarinettists, amateurs or professionals alike. I wonder if many of you have experienced this:
After playing for about 30mins in only with rest, (as in not putting the clarinet on my lap or stand), my right thumb will get quite tired, and sore. Due to that, the tension on my right hand increases greatly, and I cannot play with ease, or even do a proper, in tempo chromatic. I will tend to rush or slow down.
I bought a thumb saddle from a dealer before, however, I feel my thumb hates the saddle, and decides to be sore faster!
My thumb rest has a cork pad on it, so I'm not sure what is causing the sore thumb. I put the middle bone ball of my thumb to the thumb rest.
Also, my clarinet I a selmer signature. I'm thankful it's weight is almost nothing compared to the elephant recital in therms of mass, but after holding an R13 from another friend who complains of sore thumb too, I get very very comfortable at the weight of the R13. Haha!
So, could this problem be weight, or placement of thumb? I forgot to add, the thumb rest doesn't cover the thumb completely, it only holds 3/4 of it.
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Author: Clarimeister
Date: 2012-05-30 09:34
I too had this problem playing. I found out the reason why my right hand would get so tired is from the way the thumb rests sit on the clarinet! I read that many people have had their experienced technicians redrill the holes for the screws and move the rest higher up. This solved all my soreness problems in my right hand. The thing is that you want the clarinet finger position to feel as natural as possible. Hold you arm out forward, relax your hand completely and just raise your hand up with your wrist. Relax your fingers as well, the pull of gravity will allow you fingers to drop a bit as you raise your hand with your wrist. That is the natural curvature of your fingers. Now just open the space between your thumb and index finger so the clarinet fits, and thats about where the thumb rest will comfortably fit. This worked miracles for me. Takes some getting used to, but the end result way outweighs the cons.
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2012-05-30 09:47
Couple questions: Has this started recently after ANY change to how you hold the instrument or after a repositioning of the thumbrest on the horn?
Do you just let your thumb sag under the weight of the horn or do you make a conscious effort to hold your thumb out perpendicularly to the length of the horn?
I'll just throw out some stuff to see if it sticks.
With ME, I read an article in one of the clarinet magazines that arbitrarily suggested that moving the thumbrest UP the horn lends itself to a better hand position. After a few months I started having all sorts of hand pain to the point I went to the big Kooiman thumbrest to relieve this issue. Turned out that I let the thumb sag under the clarinet and moving the thumbrest up the horn (from a position opposite the center of the the first and second tone holes to a point opposite the bottom of the first tone hole) caused me to have my index finger higher than the bottom side key. So to get to this key I was pushing up with my thumb all the time to reach it !!!!! Silly
So always make sure that your RH index finger can hover just over the last sidekey.......... no problem.
On the other side of this issue is the rearranging of how you point your thumb. As suggested by Elsa Ludwig-Verdehr, you can achieve a hold that distributes the weight through your skeletal system better if you take a 'thumb up' posture. That is, if you draw a line from the base of you thumb to the tip of your thumb that points more toward the ceiling than the floor. The BIG difference here is that you THEN need to have the thumbrest higher on the horn (I now place mine opposite the middle of the first tone hole !!!!).
Finally, I have always placed the thumbrest more between the tip and the point you use.... or even more the tip as of late. You might try just moving closer to the tip of the thumb (this even gives your fingers a better, less curved approach to the clarinet).
...............Paul Aviles
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Author: Campana
Date: 2012-05-30 14:06
As an older (actually, ancient) clarinet player, I've encountered problems, such as yours that are medical rather than technique based. So, for what it's worth, the nerves feeding the hand muscles pass through the carpal tunnel in the elbow. This can narrow or get inflamed, squeeze the nerves, resulting in muscle atrophy in various parts of the hand. Look at the web of skin between thumb and forefinger...is it nice and meaty or just a bit of skin.
Without muscle support your thumb will soon ache, even if it's postioned optimally.
Visualize a skinny person sitting on the edge of a chair with his legs straight out and his heels on the edge of another chair. Place a 10 Kg weight on his knees and his knee joints will be screaming with fatigue in seconds. Visualize the same set up with a body builder with calves like other peoples' thighs and thighs like other peoples' waists. That 10Kg weight will never reach or be felt by the joints.
For me, it has happened to both arms, the left was remedied by surgery, the right I've improved by targetted exercise.
Probably not your problem, just something to consider as a possibilty.
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Author: Bob Bernardo
Date: 2012-05-30 18:52
A lot of people have problems. Sometimes left handed people have more of a problem. You can get a neck strap and change the thumb rest to hold the strap. You can also set the horn on your knee but the low notes may be slightly out of tune and stuffy. You can move your body forward just a tiny bit so the bell somewhat rests on your knee without cutting off too much of the air going through the bell.
I had a student with CP, cerebral palsy, sort of a muscle issue and or similar to a stroke. This of course can vary greatly from severe, wheel chair bound, to mild. This student had a very mild issue to his right hand so we opted to use the knee. He wasn't able to perform solos standing so in my opinion there was nothing wrong with him sitting. He is a very good player that really loved music. He decided to play the sax as well and with the strap and he had a great time. He plays the sax most of the time now. Needless to say he can stand without any trouble.
Designer of - Vintage 1940 Cicero Mouthpieces and the La Vecchia mouthpieces
Yamaha Artist 2015
Post Edited (2012-06-05 22:03)
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2012-05-31 00:42
Samuel -
I know from experience you can't "tough it out" with this kind of problem. If you do nothing, it only gets worse.
You need to see a physical therapist who specializes in musicians, preferably wind players. The therapist will quickly see where the strain is and be able to suggest how to relieve it -- usually by moving the thumb rest higher and adjusting the position of your hands and arms.
Ask your teacher or one of the wind players in the Singapore Philharmonic to recommend a therapist.
There's no reason to avoid resting the bell on your knee. Prohibitions on this are, in my opinion, pure superstition. I've been resting the bell on my knee for 55 years, and Robert Marcellus held the bell between his knees.
Likewise, there's no shame in using a neck strap. Ricardo Morales and Mark Nuccio use them, and so can you.
For many years, I've done without cork on the thumb rest and slipped a short length (1") of silicone (not rubber) surgical tubing over it. You can get it cheaply at a surgical supplies or medical equipment store.
Good luck. Let us know what happens.
Ken Shaw
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Author: DrewSorensenMusic
Date: 2012-05-31 01:08
I second resting the instrument on your knee. I have done this for years, it does not sacrifice tone, and keeps your right hand free to be expressive, not a clamp.
Also, as most thumb rests go, it is probably at the wrong spot on the instrument. I find that the most comfortable position for the thumb rest is at the balancing point on the instrument. try holding the instrument parallel with the ground, and then moving your thumb along the instrument until it will balance itself almost completely by it's own weight. In my opinion, this is the most comfortable position for the thumb rest, because you will only have to deal with the weight of the instrument, and not the torque caused by keeping the instrument balanced.
In the mean time, you should be stretching and building wrist strength.
Stretch by holding the hand being stretched with your other "free" hand. Bend it back until you feel it pull, don't overdo it, and hold it for maybe 10 seconds. Then bend it forward for 10 seconds. Repeat for the other hand. You can also stretch the fingers and thumb if you like for dexterity sake, but it won't help the weight problem.
To build strength, with your wrist facing up, hold a light weight (maybe 2 to 5 lbs) or the clarinet case (with or without clarinet in it) with your fingers. Extend the weight as far back as it will got, then return it to it's original position. Ideally you would want to do 8 to 12 reps and then not be able to continue. Do 3 sets. Repeat on the opposite hand.
Second weight exercise: With your wrist facing down, grip the same weight. Extend as far forward as possible, then return to it's original position. 3 sets, each wrist.
Good luck.
Drew S.
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Author: bethmhil
Date: 2012-05-31 01:38
As Ken so rightly said, playing through the pain will make the pain worse and increases the risk for injury. I used to have this same problem when I was in my last year in high school, but my teacher at the time (so idiotically) said that the pain only happens when you're out of practice...
I ended up having to take 2 months off from playing due to tendinitis, and three years after the incident, I still can't play without a neckstrap. Don't underestimate pain-- you have no idea how much damage you could be doing.
BMH
Illinois State University, BME and BM Performance
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Author: SamuelChan
Date: 2012-06-01 16:22
Hi guys,
I've experimented over the last few days of practice. Maybe that's yesterday. Haha! I realised adjusting the thumb rest slightly higher does wonders to my thumb tension. Also, I discovered my thumb is less pain when sitting down, most comfortable when the bell is between my knees.
I also noticed no difference in tone or tuning when the bell is between my knees.
So, to summarise, my thumbrest was slightly too high at first. A few days ago after I adjusted it lower, it was slightly too low. Now it's comfortable, and yes I do follow Tom ridneour's 'Thumb Up' method.
Thank you guys for all the help given. greatly appreciated!
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