 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: ez
Date: 2009-08-13 07:48
Is it like violin that the older (drier) the clarinet is, the better the sound produced?
Or do they have other reasons why professional violins become more expensive as they become older and clarinets become cheaper?
I understand we are to oil the clarinet to avoid it from being dry (For violin, the drier it is the sweetest the sound becomes)
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2009-08-13 09:00
I saw a History Channel show that put forth the notion that a global cooling caused by a volcanic eruption caused the wood of trees to become more dense for ten year period or so. These dense woods were used by Anton Stradivarius. So maybe its not just old violins as much as CERTAIN old violins and much can be said to be the same for clarinets.
Of course one must ensure the bore is made true again on old used horns and bore oil IS a must to keep the wood moisture resistant.......you don't blow a violin.
.................Paul Aviles
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Author: skygardener
Date: 2009-08-13 10:18
A big problem with woodwinds is that the keys develop more and more problems. Also, the keys on older instruments were made of much softer metal than today, so they don't stay in good regulation for nearly as long as today's instruments. Some people that really love their old instruments might be inclined to replace some of the keys, but most people would just rather spend the money on a newer instrument.
I was using a Buffet from 1896 that had a wonderful sound, but was nearly impossible to keep in regulation. It basically need an adjustment of some kind every 20 hours of playing. After that, I got a pair of Festivals from 1985, I did an overhaul once and didn't have to do anything again for 10 months.
Made my life much easier.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2009-08-13 11:48
Although production methods have improved over time, the attention to detail in a lot of new instruments is very much lacking in comparison to a clarinet made around 50 years ago by the same company.
With regard to Stradivaris, I remember seeing an electron microscope image of the timber he used, and a modern violin. The pores in the wood on the Stradivari were open, but on modern instruments they were blocked which could be one of the aspects in what makes a Strad sound the way it does.
I did a concert a while back (Tchaikovsky Violin Concerto) and the soloist http://www.ruthpalmer.com/ was playing a Strad - it cut right through when the orchestra was at full tilt and projected through the hall very well even in the quietest passages, so with such a dynamic range you can see why they're the instrument of choice by the leading players.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: Rob Vitale
Date: 2009-08-14 02:22
lets not forget that violins don't have streams of water running through them every time their played.
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Author: eefer ★2017
Date: 2009-08-15 04:05
I have a quite a few clarinets that have increased considerably in price since they were new, most notable an Evette and Schaeffer by Buffet from 1963 that cost $175 new. It is off being replated and overhauled at the moment. I would stand it up to any R-13 out there. It is a better horn than my own R-13 from the mid-60's. If the clarinets are truly quality and properly maintained (kept "clean", in good repair and the wood cared for), they should not lose value. My R-13 cost $350 in 1968 and is worth many times that today.
Too often I see people run a swab through a clarinet and think they are taking care of it by drying the inside before putting it away. All that moisture that gets smeared along the length of the bore when the swab is pulled is full of minerals and other things that can and will destroy the wood over time. Swabs (silk for me) need to be washed every week or so (I have eight or ten of them and replace them everyday with a clean one). They are simple to wash and dry in minutes. I also use a damp clean one every week and pull it through to help clean the minerals, germs, etc. from the inside of my instrument. I never used to oil the bores of my clarinets, but I do now before a performance because I think iT adds to the sound quality, but that is my own opinion. I will say though, that whenever my clarinets go out for service, I always get comments on how clean and new they "look", even though they are out of adjustment.
Clarinets aren't in the same class as violins, certainly, but they don't have to be a drain on the wallet if they are cared for properly. An old Bundy clarinet that has been kept in good condition is worth more today than when it was new.
Nancy Buckman
AACC Symphony Orchestra
Opera AACC
Early Music Society of Northern MD
(and a lot of other ensembles, too)
nebuckman@gmail.com
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Author: OldClarinetGuy
Date: 2009-08-15 06:45
"Although production methods have improved over time, the attention to detail in a lot of new instruments is very much lacking in comparison to a clarinet made around 50 years ago by the same company".
I am curious as to why you think that. Of what detail are you speaking ? Having played for over 45 years I think the newer intermediate and professional level clarinets are better than ever. I find the intonation much better, the keywork to be more durable and more exact, the pads and springs are of much higher quality.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2009-08-15 08:37
Compare the keywork on a new clarinet and an old one, and the amount of hand finishing on the old one will put the new one to shame. A new clarinet may play better and have better tuning, but new ones have spent far less time in the hands of the makers.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: skygardener
Date: 2009-08-15 13:58
"Compare the keywork on a new clarinet and an old one, and the amount of hand finishing on the old one will put the new one to shame."
Couldn't one also say that the advances in production methods have negated the need for the amount of hand finishing that was once necessary?
But there is a loss of the "feeling" you get with older instruments. It's different when you look at an older instrument and you think that each step was worked by someone's hand and was looking at it with their own eyes to check each little thing. Someone that had spent years just learning how to do it.
It is very different from a clarinet that you feel was just carved out by a big machine. You might call it a "sterile" feeling.
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Author: Hank Lehrer
Date: 2009-08-15 15:13
Hi,
This is really an interesting thread. But let me add the saxophone to the discussion.
I have a Mark VI alto and tenor and they play very well and are built like tanks. My Selmer Super 80 alto and Yamaha YTS 475 are my backups that can easily become #1s for me. But these newer instruments seem lighter in construction, are not as artistically engraved, but play almost perfectly in tune for a lot lower price.
It also seems that student and intermediate woodwinds are now much better than anything we had in the 1950s for beginners or advancing players. Manufacturing techniques seem to have made a huge quality difference in comparison to what was available years ago.
HRL
Post Edited (2009-08-15 15:26)
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