 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Dano
Date: 2007-04-30 16:00
I keep reading "Avoid this Ridenour bass clarinet" but never get a reason for not liking it. Anyone have experience with this bass? I tried checking the search engine here but I seem to only get posts that morph into bass clarinet design and preferences of register keys instead of why the Ridenour bass should be avoided. Is the register key the only reason to avoid this inexpensive horn?
Post Edited (2007-04-30 16:01)
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2007-04-30 16:11
The general feelng I get is that the keywork is on the soft side and can go out of regulation easily, the ergonomics aren't all that brilliant and is somewhat lacking in the tone department.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: sherman
Date: 2007-04-30 17:18
There are actually four basses out there in question:
The TR-147 bass. it is a student bass, plays and sounds well but like the tuning could be better. It is an old version and has been discontinued.
The Arioso bass: a student instrument similar to the 147. It's okay but a careless student could easily abuse it mechanically.
The 147/Arioso low C bass. Acoustically it is excellent but the mechanics were problematic, and despite efforts to improve it it remains problematic.
This instrument is no longer sold.
The Arioso/Lyrique RCP 925-e bass to low Eb, with an Ab/Eb left hand key and double register key, and adjustable neck. It is a terrific horn and mechanically sound, with full professional features..
The instrument that has caused the confusion and problems is the low C bass. they showed themselves unable to make an adequate mechanism. If they did there would be nothing close to it on the market.
Hope this helps.
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Author: David Spiegelthal ★2017
Date: 2007-04-30 17:28
I don't fully agree with sherman's opinion that the Arioso low-C bass clarinet is 'acoustically excellent' -- the one I bought a couple of years ago (and sold after a month) had some significant intonation problems and a basic sound which I didn't like at all -- besides the keywork which was, as noted, rather awful.
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Author: Pathik
Date: 2007-05-01 05:34
Terry Stibal said (in a different thread):
"Oh, and don't be tempted by the inexpensive Ridenour bass clarinet..."
I am curious to know more about this bass clarinet, as I am considering
buying one. Why shouldn't I be tempted? What's wrong with it? I presume that you have personal experience with it, and have played it, or at least
tested it, to make such a statement. I am now of course refering to the
bass clarinet to low Eb that Tom Ridenour presently advertises on his web site, the Lyrique Bb Bass Clarinet RCP-925e, and NOT any other older model that he might have been offering previously. Has anyone else on this BB tried it? Anyone care to share their impressions? Thanks in advance.
Pathik
Post Edited (2007-05-01 05:44)
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Author: Terry Stibal
Date: 2007-05-01 14:01
I've written pretty extensively about my encounter with the thing, which occurred during our evacuation from the Houston area during Hurricane Rita. I got to once over one up in Dallas at the H & H "main location", where they had one on display.
All of my horns were buried in the back of the van at the time, so I did not have my mouthpieces or reeds to actually play it. So, I am not competent to comment on the tone/timbre/what have you. However, mechanically the thing was a train wreck waiting to happen.
This was a fresh from the box, never been used, "unblown" horn that had just been put on display the previous day. Despite that fact, there were two keys on the lower "joint" that were binding and not operating correctly.
Even more distressing, there was one key (left hand little finger F/C, I think)that could (with very moderate pressure from the left little finger) be forced from its seat lower down on the joint and made inoperative as a result. It appeared to be too short for the purpose that it was designed for, and barely made enough contact with the second component lower down on the "joint".
The horn felt "spongy" and imprecise, not just on the long "clapper" style keys but also in the axle keys covering the "holes", these operated by fingers 1, 2 and 3 on each hand. In particular, the right hand third finger key felt like you were never going to reach "bottom", so much flexibility was there in the key and linkage
This is probably attributed to the use of "cast" keywork rather than "forged" - indeed the keys did have that "all in one" look about them that is evidence of the use of casting. However, I did not go over it with a magnifying glass, only with my fingers.
Finally, the register mechanism did not appear to function correctly (as far as proper movement at the proper time as the "hole" fingers were lifted with the register key pressed). Again, I wasn't able to test this by playing the horn, but my decades of experience with bass clarinets leads me to believe that the thing should open at a certain point in the fingering cycle. On the instant horn, it did open but the other vent did not fully close - maladjustment perhaps, but indicative of poor quality control nonetheless.
Based upon the mechanical issues alone, I would not have recommended it to a student (had I still been teaching such animals at the time). The worst Vito or Bundy that I've played was considerably better in the mechanical department, for some other benchmark with which to compare that particular horn.
I have considerable respect for Tom based upon my previous dealings with him back in the 1980's, so I don't attribute the issues noted above to him directly. (And, nothing that I've said reflects either well or poorly on the tone of the instrument, which I could not play due to my buried equipment.) Instead, I think that he got sold a bill of goods by whoever was responsible for the production of that particular instrument.
leader of Houston's Sounds Of The South Dance Orchestra
info@sotsdo.com
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Author: Pathik
Date: 2007-05-01 15:13
Thanks for the input. It's interesting to read about your experience, but it seems you are talking about the Ridenour BC147 bass clarinet? As far as I know, the BC147 is no longer available (see Sherman's post above in this thread). What I am interested in is the new Lyrique Bb Bass Clarinet RCP-925e, also made by Tom Ridenour. With the exception of what Sherman wrote in the above post, so far I haven't seen any comments about this bass clarinet anywhere, and I would have expected quite a few people to have at least tried it by now, but maybe not?
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Author: Dano
Date: 2007-05-01 21:55
Thank you for clearing that up, Terry. I WAS talking about the BC147. I see some of them for sale at very low prices and wondered why they were not snatched up quickly. It seems that Ridenour makes great leaps with every generation of clarinets. I would expect his new line to be better than the past lines.
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Author: David Spiegelthal ★2017
Date: 2007-05-02 02:43
Just remember that (to the best of my knowledge) Ridenour has his instruments made "to his specifications" in mainland China, and I believe this applies to all the different iterations he has sold --- thus the quality of the instruments really depends on what the Chinese factory can do and how well Tom can control it. So far, I'm not convinced that he has sufficient control over the metallurgy and workmanship of the instruments they make for him, but perhaps they have finally reached an acceptable level. I haven't tried any of his recent clarinets and I'll admit they've gotten generally good reviews from folks that have played them.
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Author: Dano
Date: 2007-05-02 03:09
I have one of his Bb Lyrique clarinets on the way. I am very open minded when it comes to the "made in China" statement. Let's see what happens.
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Author: sherman
Date: 2007-05-02 14:17
David:
I believe that you have hit the nail directly on the head of any problems with the Ridenour Clarinets.I play one, and it is still the best instrument I have every played, bar none. From the aspects of:? Basically the sound is beautiful,better in my mind than any I have played. 2. The intonation is as good as any horn, with the exception of alitissima F#, which is flat with the basic fingering, though with an available 4 or 5 other fingerings available more or less conveniently.
3. Exceptionally the low e and f are intune, not flat , really flat on some, and 4. the 12th above are aso intune. 5. the high c is intune. 5. the scale is even to begin with. 6. the ability to make large intervals with minimal angst, and qvetching is notable.
There are other notable betterments , however I have found that there are a couple of things lacking which must be noted as well:
The keys are not soft or hard or soft-boiled, but they seem placed not quite correctly and the thumbrest sucks, though I have placed all kinds of things on it and they all help. So, it is my belief that these negative aspects of the horn need to be made more amenable, which will come I'm sure with time, as many things begun in China in a somewhat roughshod manner have straightened to a highly acceptable degree. Basically it is a great horn, with the exceptions and the leveler is the price, which is pure giveaway. I have a set, the A being the best horn I ever put my fingers to, and the Bb is also quite acceptable. The price for the 2 was under a thousand dollars. Tom has adjusted my Bb several times, at no charge, but he cannot change the keys, an irritant. But the horns are better than any French clarinets, or Japanese, and my point if I may, is that students do not have a lot of bucks to spray around or to ask their fathers or mothers for,or to borrow, so the choice is easy.
Davd S. is absolutely correct.
Sherman Friedland
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