 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: moltopiccolo
Date: 2007-04-14 00:01
I have an MM in flute performance, but I'm starting to get into doubling, so I need some advice about buying a clarinet. I buying an instrument to play in pit orchestras, so it needs to be pretty good, but since I don't actually play clarinet yet, I can't really play-test them. Plus, I don't really know what to look for anyway. So I'm basically looking for some suggestions on instruments that are good enough to play semi-professionally, without spending a fortune (I've got several more instruments to buy). I'm open to getting a used instrument, but I'd still like to have a couple of models and price ranges in my head, plus some advice on things to look for in an instrument (materials, specifications, etc). Thanks!
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Author: joeyscl
Date: 2007-04-14 00:57
I'm guessing buy a clarinet or flute or instrument for that matter is essentially the same...(?)
Gotta try it, see if you like it, and decide if its work the price tag...
1 question, how do you suppose go on doubling if you don't play the clarinet yet?
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Author: moltopiccolo
Date: 2007-04-14 01:43
Right... I was mostly looking for clarinet-specific advice. For example, with a flute, you can choose between a number of different materials, open or closed holes, auxillary keys, offset G, different headjoint cuts, etc. I'm looking for the same kind of specifications on clarinet.
I'm not really sure what you meant by your question, but as far as doubling goes, I am planning to learn to play the clarinet, which is why I need to buy one. I am expecting to learn fairly quickly, though, as I'm already a professional musician who plays multiple instruments, and I don't want to have to buy another instrument right away, so I'm trying to get some advice on how to get a good instrument before I get started.
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Author: SVClarinet09
Date: 2007-04-14 01:50
How much do you plan on spending? A nice used pro horn will go a long way for you. But the most important thing first is, make sure you start on a good mouthpiece with good reeds and ligature. Any clarinet will suffice for learning purposes if you have a good mouthpieces, reeds, and ligature. I suggest you try a Vandoren mouthpiece, with Vandoren reeds, and a bonade ligature. Your clarinet though for student models---I like Leblanc LP7214(very nice intonation) Vito 7214(almost identical to the Leblanc) Buffet B12, Selmer CL300, Yamaha YCL-250(these are the best IMO because they are sturdier than most and seem to have the same features as the rest) Now you might wanna try Tom Ridenour's Lyrique clarinets(made outta hard rubber). They have much praise on this board. You could also try a Forte clarinet which has gotten much praise here too. But IMO the most important part first is your MPC setup, kind of like a good headjoint means the world to flute sound. If you do by a clarinet, make sure it is checked by the technician to have all the pads seated, proper spring tension, etc etc.
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Author: moltopiccolo
Date: 2007-04-14 02:00
Thanks for the advice on ligatures, etc. That helps a lot. I'm definitely trying to go the used pro instrument route. I'm expecting to spend more than $500, hopefully less than $1000, but I have no idea if that's reasonable. I've been looking at what some instruments are selling for on eBay, etc., and I've found a couple of Buffet R13s for around $900. What is the difference between the R13 and the E11, because there are lots of those at lower prices. I'm assuming the quality is not as good, but are the differences in the specifications, and if so, are they important? Could you recommend any more instruments at the sort of lower-end but still pro level?
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Author: LonDear
Date: 2007-04-14 02:49
Check out www.ridenourclarinetproducts.com. I have no affilliation, but I do play some of his horns as do some of my associates, and they have even more on order. He has amazing pro horns in your price range, and there are many references that you can get by searching this website. I play flutes also (and other stuff), so I can relate. Flautists have to go with silver, as are all of mine, but clarinets don't have to be wood any more for a great sound. At the very least you can get a pro clarinet at a student price to learn on.
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Author: Koo Young Chung
Date: 2007-04-14 04:15
Cellist can't play violin and vice versa.
Pianist can't play pipe organ.
I don't know why you think you can pick up a clarinet and practice a few month and play in pit orch.
It won't happen.
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Author: moltopiccolo
Date: 2007-04-14 04:29
LonDear, thanks so much. I'll definitely look into those instruments. I really appreciate the advice.
Koo Young Chung, I don't remember saying anything about a few months, so please don't impose deadlines on me or put words in my mouth. If you look at the reed parts for pit orchestra music, wind players are expected to double - usually three or more instruments - and most start with one and then learn the rest, just like I'm doing. Just because you already play one instrument doesn't mean you can't learn another. Nice to see you supporting your fellow musicians, though.
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Author: D
Date: 2007-04-14 07:43
Have you thought about renting one for a few months, then buying one when you are able to test it properly yourself?
If you still have contacts from music school maybe you can find a clarinet player with a couple of backup instruments who could rent one to you for a while.
One of the things I had the most difficulty with switching from flute, is that the clarinet overblows in twelfths. So be very aware of this when the band leader/pit conductor etc asks for something up or down an octave. sounds silly, but it's something that you really really need to try a time or two in the privacy of your own home.
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Author: Synonymous Botch
Date: 2007-04-14 13:08
Try a Vandoren M13 or M30 for starters.
Get a Legere synthetic reed, so you won't need to deal with natural cane.
I recommend the Ridenour line of hard rubber clarinets (TR147/Lyrique) that have been tuned up by the designer, himself.
You can buy a decent clarinet rig for MUCH less than a hand made flute.
Clarinet is a good place to start, and you won't lay out alot of dosh as with the saxophone family. Get a few lessons under your belt to shorten the learning curve - you can already read charts, right?
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Author: pewd
Date: 2007-04-14 13:39
Jessica,
I'd suggest a Buffet E-11, with a Fobes Debut mouthpiece, and Vandoren #3 (blue box reeds). I disagree with the 13 series mouthpiece for a beginner - they will flatten your pitch a bit. Doublers usually need to learn to raise their pitch. Later, as your embouchure develops, you can move to a 5RV-Lyre or M13-Lyre mouthpiece. Good used E11's are well under $1000.
I've had bad experiences with the TR147 clarinets - many maintenance issues.
disclaimer: I buy/repair/sell used instruments, so I suppose that clouds my judgement a bit
- Paul Dods
Dallas, Texas
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Author: moltopiccolo
Date: 2007-04-14 16:12
Wow, no I didn't know that the clarinet overblows in 12ths... how strange! Well, that'll definitely be an adjustment. I may go the renting route initially - I'm planning to go to the music store today and find out about it. I teach flute lessons, though, and I find that, at least around here, renting isn't usually a good idea - it's really expensive, and the instruments are not in decent shape, even for crappy instruments.
Thanks for the info about the Buffet E-11 and the Ridenour clarinets, too. Those brands seem to be the consensus, so I'll definitely check them out.
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Author: moltopiccolo
Date: 2007-04-14 16:16
Oh, one more thing... I have vague recollections of friends in orchestra changing barrels mid-rehearsal - I'm assuming for pitch. Is there anything I should know about barrel length, etc.?
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Author: jane84
Date: 2007-04-14 16:46
If I'm getting you right, you don't want a beginner's model, but a (semi-) pro, right - one you don't have to upgrade? Then the E11 might be on the cheap side, depending how much you plan to spend. You're possibly looking for the step above that, an RC, f.ex - this is all Buffet-models. The R13 -? I've never heard of it outside this board, but I gather it's what most american orchestral players use (like to the Prestige over here). Buffet is the most common clarinet brand.
Then there's Yamaha, Selmer and Leblanc. (and small brands like Ridenour, which I have no experience with) Those all have instruments in the semi-pro scale. Look around their webpages, or this site.
A used instrument will of course bring down the price a bit, and they can be very good, especially if you get one from a pro. But clarinets don't usually increase in quality over the years, however.
Regarding mouthpieces, Vandoren is an available, relatively cheap, OK mp-brand (methinks), with many types to choose from - I think it would be wise to go with a beginner variant, if you've never played a reed instrument before. 5RV is an easy-playing mp used by many beginners/amateurs.
I would recommend Vandoren reeds also, for the mentioned reasons, try nr.2 to begin with, and try higher numbers when you feel it's time. The embouchure will probably be your biggest challenge.
Personally, I'm not convinced ligatures matter that much for a beginner, though I know some people would disagree.
Material: well, just avoid the cheap plastic things. Then there's wood (duh:) ;and greenline, more or less equal but less climate-sensitive (search the board for details) and the mentioned hard rubber-variants, which should be much of the same.
Not much differnece keywork-wise as on flute.
The prices and instr.-range you mention point towards a used horn. A new (semi-)pro cl. will probably cost you more, if the prices are at the same level in USA as here.
Whatever you decide, don't buy one without having it tested by a good clarinetist for intonation, sound, playability etc etc; preferably while you're there. All in all: ally yourself with a cl-playing collegue (?) for all these things!
-jane
(sadly enough, getting no money from this:)
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Author: D
Date: 2007-04-14 16:56
They weren't changing barrel, they were swapping from A to Bb clarinet or the other way round. This is generally done by swapping over the mouthpiece or the mouthpiece and barrel onto the other body. This way you play on a wet reed and a warm mouthpiece rather than a dry cold one.
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Author: moltopiccolo
Date: 2007-04-14 17:00
ohhhh, that makes sense. Okay, thanks. And Jane, thanks for your very succinct reply.
You guys have been really helpful. Thanks so much!
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Author: Bennett ★2017
Date: 2007-04-14 17:26
I'd suggest a different route; find a clarinet teacher. He or she can help you choose a suitable instrument and, even more important, get you started correctly with embouchure, suitable reed and mouthpiece, and set realistic expectations so you don't become immediately frustrated.
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Author: stevesklar
Date: 2007-04-15 19:18
I think shes also also asking about: (because sooner or later she'll read about it)
[1] "standard", partial and full boehm models (kinda like the offset G, gizzmo key stuff)
[2] mpc recommendations which in it self it a white paper like flute heads
[3] differences in clarinets such as bores - polycylindrical, cylindrical ...
[4] prices of new and use clarinets
[5] wood vs rubber vs plastic (basically stick with wood .. unless ..)
[6] then she'll find silver plated keys vs polished nickel
but then, she may be looking for a pure recommendation:
such as R-13, or say Leblanc Cadenza ..... so many choices that the best answer is to play test many (maybe rent a clarinet so that you can develop a "requirements" list), then play test some more. and of course, use the Search button on this board ... and as above mentioned, look at getting a clairnet teacher to help in all this decision making (and kick start to make sure you have the correct technique)
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Author: moltopiccolo
Date: 2007-04-17 01:48
Just wanted to say a quick thank you for allllll the help you all have given me. I have lots of good info to work with now. As a quick update - I've rented a student clarinet, just to get started, so that I can take my time buying one. Since I've moved recently, all of my clarinet-playing friends are on the other side of the country - but I've found someone here who's going to help me get started to make sure I'm doing everything right (I know from teaching flute that it's not fun to correct bad habits later!).
So for now, I'm compiling all of your info, and dilligently watching ebay, etc. to see what things are selling for, so I'll be well prepared. I'm sure I'll be back in the near future for more advice. You guys rock.
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Author: ABerry
Date: 2007-04-17 16:46
Jessica,
I agree totally with Bennett, find yourself a clarinet teacher and they will be able to help you choose a good clarinet, mouthpiece, ligature and reeds. All of these things are important in properly learning to play the clarinet. In the Portland area I'm sure there are many teachers, places you could check would be the Oregon Symphony, Portland Opera Orchestra, Portland Festival Orchestra, Portland State University, Universit of Portland... Any of these clarinetists would be able to help you...
Allan
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