 The Oboe BBoard
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Author: my58vw
Date: 2006-01-17 06:35
Hello all again,
Well I got back from RGB, needing a bit more than I thought, but got everything including 12 pre gouged and shaped cane, 5 staples and quite a bit of other stuff. Well I I have been left with is major frusteration.
I can not rie the stupid cane onto the staple without the cane splitting. I am soaking the cane, tieing it like the instructions say but it never wants to close. The gaps are even and all, but when the string is looped and pulled tight the cane breaks... and I can not afford more cane right now. I am about to the point of just saying screw it and going back to the POS machiene reeds... at least they play.
I don't know, I am just frusterated with the stupid reed stuff!
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Author: my58vw
Date: 2006-01-17 10:39
On the fifth attempt I got a reed tied and even as far as a very hard C crow, but it fell apart :( . I am hoping my teacher will be back from maternatiy leave this week and can work with me on it...
Thanks again
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Author: d-oboe
Date: 2006-01-17 13:46
How long have you been soaking your cane? It needs to be soaked until it sinks, and is very waterlogged. Sometimes, if I'm short on time, I'll even leave the cane in the water for a day or two.
Don't give up yet!!! Sometimes it takes a while to really get home reeds going.
-If you aren't sure if oboe is your thing yet, maybe make one reed a week. Consider it an ongoing project, but don't expect to use the reeds for your actual playing.
-If you do want to pursue oboe (maybe not professionally, but even to take it in university) make one reed a day. And then, once you get a playable reed, stop relying on store bought reeds. Go so far, even, as to ceremoniously break all old reeds once you make your first usable reed. It's something to be proud of!
Take a look at this webpage:
http://www.public.asu.edu/~schuring/main.html
Go to "Notes for beginning reedmakers"
It should provide some useful insight...
D
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Author: Shelley
Date: 2006-01-17 15:01
To keep cane from splitting while tying, scrape the end of the cane, about 7-10mm from the edge to thin it out.
I do not recommend oversoaking your cane- sure, it won't split, but you may create problems with tone production later that can't be remedied.
Good luck!
Cincinnati, OH
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Author: my58vw
Date: 2006-01-17 17:29
I have been playing for about six months or so now, and at 23 years old it is a different situation. I am currently playing with the orchastra with the university (second chair) and with the wind ensomble. I am not leaving the option of adding or taking courses specfically in music (performance).
I found this morning that if I soak the reed for about 10 minutes until it sinks it seals better and I was able to get one reed to actually a crowing stage (well until the string came off and I lost the reed), although it was VERY hard. I don't know if it is related but one side of the reed and eventually both had a tendency to flask instead of shave (proper technique, no pressure, sharp knife). That flaking I believe was the downfall of it all.
I will hopefully be back with my teacher this week and we will be on our way, as for professional, I am not even looking that way right now!
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Author: d-oboe
Date: 2006-01-17 18:13
In argument for soaking...
I would rather soak the cane more, and have it not split, than split 10 reeds because of "potential" intonation issues. Of course, you wouldn't want to soak it for a week. But, cane is very durable, and once it has completely dried (this can take a week or longer, especially for the cane under the thread) it should be back to normal.
d
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Author: dlynnb2006
Date: 2006-01-17 20:59
As for your string tying issue, if you don't have any fish skin for it, use some clear nailpolish to seal the string. this will help hold the string in place and prevent leaks
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Author: oboeblank
Date: 2006-01-17 23:53
Here are some things to try...
I usually soak my cane for twenty minutes in hot/warm water and tie. Whether you let the cane sink to the bottom or not, I would not exceed twenty minutes of soaking.
Try "feathering" down the ends of the cane. Besides giving the reed a nice contour, it helps the reed seal and the because the end is slightly more flexible, or thinner, you run less of a chance of splitting the cane up to the top.
Wax your thread. Stupid thing to say, but sometimes we are in a rush to make reeds and we forget to wax.
When you tie the cane on, [lets take an arbitrary tie off length of 73, your will be different probably] tie two or three turns below the end of the tube, and then slowly pull the string tight. It sounds like you are expecting the cane to seal from the first loop of string and that will make your cane crack everytime. Try for now try to tie the reed on straight up and down and flush with the oval of the tube. Both sides of the reed should close at the same time when you pull the string. Then cross the thread over and wind towards the tube, keeping the string taut.
Finish with a couple of half hitch knots-thread going over thumb and index finger, passing underneath the first joint of the middle finger and the reed goes through the loop created between your three fingers. Make sure that you keep your finger on the last turn of thread, if you let go all of the hard work will have been for nothing.
If you have waxed your thread sufficiently there is no need to use nail polish, but many people like the added protection-or maybe the fumes! [haha]
Hope some of these tips work for you.
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Author: cjwright
Date: 2006-02-07 07:06
I would agree with Cincinnati. Bevel both ends of the shaped cane first. 20 minutes in warm or hot water should be enough for it to sink. If you soak for more than an hour, you will risk the piece of cane warping when it dries. This would make it leak out of the sides more.
Also, I don't know if you've gotten this far, but if the openings of the reeds seem to be too open, then scrape a bit off the tip, but don't clip it. Let the reed dry for a day and come back. This encourages the opening to settle down a bit more.
If the openings seem too small and you can't seem to get enough opening, then make sure you scrape a bit off the tip and clip it THE FIRST DAY YOU WRAP IT. Similarly, this encourages the opening to perk up more. (But if you oversoaked the cane, it will just warp it. Hence the comment about soaking cane for more than a few hours.)
Just a word of advice.
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Author: Hotboy
Date: 2006-02-16 17:57
I understand how frustrating it can be...there have been several good comments about soaking and feathering the cane prior to tying, but here's one technique that worked for me: I ran the tap water until it was as hot as it could go, then put the cane in that temperature water. When the cane had sunk all the way to the bottom, it was ready to tie.
Regarding gaps that leak, you might find the following helpful.
You have to understand the the REASON(S) for tying your reeds at a certain length, and you must EXPERIMENT until it works for you, no matter how many instruction books you read.
Also, take note that different manufacturers make staples with different shapes to them...that is, the opening at the blowing end can be larger or smaller than other manufacturers, and also a different shape (more oval vs. more elliptical). The Prestini staple is different from the Loree staple, which is different from the MCW and RDG, etc. You should really have a mandrel that is made by the same firm that makes the staples for best fit.
The KEY issue in avoiding gaps is how the width of the cane matches up with the end of the staple. The shorter you tie the cane on, the more cane there is to wrap around the staple at that crucial point: the end. Therefore, if you are still getting a gap on both sides, one or more of the following three things is true:
1) The cane's shape is too narrow to be tied at that length on that staple. SOLUTION: tie it shorter, buy wider shaped cane, or buy smaller opening staple.
2) You have not wrapped the thread all the way to the end of the staple. SOLUTION: after you have made your initial 3-6 wraps, roll the mandrel toward you until the thread is wrapped up to the very edge of the staple.
For optimum sealing, I have found that the top-most wrap should straddle the end of the staple, that is, the top-most wrap should be "half on" the staple and "half off" the staple. Note that if you wrap the thread too far, you will squeeze and crack the cane because there is no metal to support the pressure of the wrapped thread.
You didn't mention whether you do this, but I have found that making a pencil mark on the cane to indicate the end of the staple is a tremendous aid in making sure you wrap the thread to the EXACT proper location.
3) The staples you bought have a relatively larger opening. This is neither good nor bad, but different-sized openings make your reeds feel, sound, and play diferently. SOLUTION: buy staples that have a smaller opening from a different manufacturer.
I would advise, at first, keeping your staples the same and finding the shape of cane that works with that staple.
Dane
Bay Area, California
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