 The Oboe BBoard
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Author: oboi
Date: 2012-01-07 08:40
I am very pleased with my new Fox 500, but the problem is I can't play it for more than a few minutes a day (or at all) without my wrist and thumb joint pain flaring up. Because I expect to do a lot of playing over the new few months (including some EH parts), I'm sort of desperate for a solution ... quick. Mind you, the EH isn't the only issue. My day job is exclusively on the computer, so I am either at my desk typing or working on my laptop on my lap at home. I get flare-ups due to mouse or too much laptop use. It dies down after I reduce usage for a few days. Then, for my oboe playing, I have recurrent RH bottom joint pain every few weeks that lasts a few weeks. Sometimes I end up playing with the bell on my lap.
So now bring in this big kahuna of an EH and I think I am screwed. The first thing I did after trying an EH out (I still am getting used to the whole playing of such an instrument, not just my new EH) was get a FHRED. BOOM, instant improvement. At least I can hold the thing up. However, it's very jiggly because I tend to do hand contorsions (i.e., play), so it twists/tilts. I just realized the tilt is largely affected by my not putting my thumb on the thumb rest....which comes to problem #2. I have tiny child hands. I am only 5ft tall and have the world's shortest pinkies. So in order to actually reach C# and Eb, I have to position my hand lower and stretch. First thought is to buy an adjustable thumb rest. However, even the adjustable thumb rest on my oboe I already overextended it, and looking at where I want to place my thumb on the EH, it's an even bigger span, so I suspect that won't work. Am deciding whether to glue a piece of cork or eraser to the existing rest. Then, I read a thread on this forum that said that one could try holding the horn farther out at an angle rather then close to the body. Actually that feels much better! More weight is put on the LH, which I do not have problems with. That could work! Then I realized no matter what angle I hold the horn, if I put my thumb *anywhere* on the horn, it hurts my joint and wrist. If I leave it hanging in mid-air, it doesn't hurt. Of course, that means I can't control the swaying of the horn at all and I'd probably screw up half of the notes
So I'm sort of wondering what to do or try first. It doesn't help that most of my EH solos are in Ab+, which have the *evil* left Eb, the bane of my existence even on the oboe, and also the horrible RH pinky keys. Without any changes, I will have to restrict EH playing to 5 minute spurts, lest I permanently injure my hand.
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Author: WoodwindOz
Date: 2012-01-07 15:22
I also find I have to hold the EH further out than most. Make sure you have a bocal that is at an angle that allows you to do this.
I played with a clarinet player who had an older style support. It attached to the thumb rest, came out from the horn perpendicular and ended with an arc that sat around the abdomen. I have no idea where one is available (perhaps you may know someone who can manufacture something?) but this would prevent the swaying that your thumb cannot.
Perhaps also look into someone who can add plates to those pinky keys to extend them so you don't have to stretch?
Rachel
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Author: ohsuzan
Date: 2012-01-07 19:20
Is a neckstrap a possibility?
I'm not quite as petite as you, but also have very small hands (barely reach an octave on the piano without working at it). I've tried the various supports for English horn, but didn't like any of them.
What DOES work for me is the Ridenour Thumb Saddle http://www.ridenourclarinetproducts.com/Thumb.htm. It's made for the clarinet, but works very, very well for me on both oboe and EH, to help with hand position and redistribute the weight of the instrument.
It's made to go over a regular thumbrest (i.e., one without the neckstrap eyelet), so I just sliced a groove into the top of it with a razor blade. It fits snugly, stays on, and most importantly, keeps my hands well positioned and relaxed. My teacher even liked it (and she is a purist's purist when it comes to things oboe).
And it's cheap!
Susan
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Author: Wes
Date: 2012-01-07 20:14
About 20 years ago, I had some tendonitis in my right arm, causing some pain when playing the EH and the clarinet. For practicing at home, I rested the bell of the EH on a cardboard box setting on the floor. With some stretching and weight exercise the problem went away, however.
Also, there was a peg that could be mounted on the EH which rested on the floor. It may have had a ring that clamped onto the bell ring of the EH, easy enough to make. Good luck!
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Author: WoodwindOz
Date: 2012-01-07 20:30
Forrests sells those pegs. As someone who has played a lot of bass clarinet, the idea of a peg for EH (especially as I am so short there is little distance between bell and floor) is appealing as you can hold it at whatever angle you want.
If you could then find a thumbrest with more of a hook (like those you find on saxes and some bass claris), you don't need to use your thumb at all.
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Author: huboboe
Date: 2012-01-07 23:37
Having destroyed my right thumb joint by hanging oboes and English horns off of it for fifty years, I've tried every type of support known including a few of my own devising.
By far the best I've come across is made by the Chicago Reed Company. It takes all the weight, yet is not rigid like a floor peg. I give it 5 stars!
Let Grover Schiltz, former EH with the Chicago Symphony, tell you about it:
http://www.chicagoreedcompany.com/wrist.html
Good luck in your efforts to keep playing...
Robert Hubbard
WestwindDoubleReed.com
1-888-579-6020
bob@westwinddoublereed.com
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Author: borris
Date: 2012-01-08 01:07
All my problems, being pretty similar of yours, mysteriously went away when i switched to the Marigaux EH. And of course, the neck strap is a must for mi.
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Author: huboboe
Date: 2012-01-08 01:54
Lucky you! If they come back, be sure to look at the Chicago Reeds thingee. It's a good one!
Robert Hubbard
WestwindDoubleReed.com
1-888-579-6020
bob@westwinddoublereed.com
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2012-01-08 06:14
Marigaux cors have reasonably close finger spacings as far as cors go, so that could account for something. I think the finger spacing on Rigoutat cors is closer still.
I use a sling when playing cor for long periods but if there's aome quick changes and the duration(s) spent on cor isn't particularly long, I don't use the sling in those cases as that saves the worry of not being able to unhitch it quickly.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: kimber
Date: 2012-01-08 14:09
Since you have already have your EH - and probably don't want to trade it in for a different one - talk to your favorite repairman about altering some of the lower keys to accomodate your smaller finger reach. I don't think it is as much $ as we tend to be afraid of. At least you'll know your options.
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Author: oboi
Date: 2012-01-15 17:40
Thanks for the advice, everyone. Fortunately, the pain has lessened. I guess my 1.5 month hiatus in playing really affected my muscles. Still, it's been a challenge. I am now holding the horn more out. My silly attempts at making a thumbrest have stopped. My teacher has advised me not to clamp down on the horn as much, which has also helped. I am having my thumb rather free now and with the the sharper angle that I hold it now, it is balancing better on the FHRED. The wrist is less twisted in this position.
I had a chance to try my friend's Howarth XL cor for a minute or two without support and it felt pretty good.
If the thumb saddle can work in tandem with the FHRED, that might be a possibility. The WRIST looks very interesting, although I can easily see that toppling one of my stands (excuse to buy a nice new portable stand, though!).
I see Forrests is selling a new EH stand that takes all the weight off of the wrist. Only problem is with a stand like that is that I can't quickly switch between instruments within a single piece of music, as I need to do so now.
Neck straps I am sort of averse to because of neck pain (and again of needing to strap it on within a few seconds!).
I have to get myself to a city with an expert repairman and a supply of these doodads to try. But that won't happen for a few months at the very least.
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Author: Oboelips
Date: 2012-01-18 18:15
I too, have small hands. Mine are double-jointed (another problem) And, I too, am in front of a computer all day. After decades of hand problems, the following things have helped me:
At the Instrument: Make sure wrists are kept ergonomically straight (no kinking of the wrists!)
Play moderately every day to build hand muscle.
If you must, resting the bell on the knees is not that big of a sin. I can tell you that I cannot tell the difference in my sound in the concert hall when I've had to resort to resting the bell on my knees (I've checked my orchestra's recordings).
For EHorn, my husband made me a 'peg' with a cello peg (adjustable) to which the ehorn bell is fastened with a leather loop (he's a leather artist). I've used it for years, and it really helps. The new ones in Forrest's are somewhat similar. This gets the weight off of my right hand, leaving me with only the 'reach' problem.
I know a lady who holds the Ehorn to her right, like a sax, with a neck strap. This puts it in a better position for keeping that right wrist straighter. She's always played beautifully, and it definitely works for her. If you have water problems now, this may make them worse.
At the Computer: You're doing this for hours a day, so it counts. Avoid the laptop keyboard. These just invite hand problems. Get an ergonomic keyboard (a 'wave' style). They take about 3 days to get used to, but your hands will thank you for years! You can even plug one in to your laptop.
Keyboard Height: As low as you can go--lower than the desktop. A keyboard shelf/tray under the desk will facilitate this. This will allow your hands/arms to rest naturally, without extreme twisting/kinking.
So you can compare, my hand is 6 1/4" from base of palm to top of tall-man finger. My pinky is (from bent knuckle) 2 1/2" long. Hope this might help.
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Author: oboi
Date: 2012-01-19 05:45
Is there a regular kind of adjustable thumb rest that also has the neck strap ring? I'm thinking at the very least I need my thumb to actually be secure to the instrument pain or not else I can't properly play the thing. But I need my FHRED, so I need a ring. I also want the rest to fit the existing holes in the horn.
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