 The Oboe BBoard
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Author: bechstein
Date: 2010-08-13 23:31
I am close to arranging oboe lessons for my daughter who is 13 years old and will be joining the grade 8 junior band in her first year in high school. She has played oboe for one year and would like to continue. I now need to find her a suitable oboe. We live in the North West Coast.
As some of you may know from my earlier posts I have had many words of advice shared with me on this forum to help with our decision as to how to buy an oboe and the type of oboe we should be looking for. Thank you.
I now have a list of several teachers in my area and when I contacted one of the teachers they suggested to stay away from older wooden oboes because of tuning issues. I was a little surprised by this comment because of the many posts I've read about oboe players happily playing their older wooden oboes. This teacher suggested that it would be better to find a newer oboe (such as a plastic one) than to buy an older wooden oboe because older wooden oboe often cannot keep their tune. How much truth is there to this opinion? Now I am not going to bounce one persons opinion off another to cause any unnecessary disagreement but I would like to know some truths so that I don't risk venturing off in the wrong direction buying an oboe that never stays in tune.
Because of my budget of approximately $700-$1200, plastic oboes are a good possibility (such as a Yamaha YOB-241) but it was the older wooden oboes that I was very interested in - until this comment warning me about tuning stability issues with older wooden oboes. I've read that wooden oboes will sound a little better but are a little more fragile but that shouldn't be too much of a problem as long as she doesn't drop the instrument I suppose.
And so my question is, in my search for an oboe should I avoid all older wooden oboes (even if they are rebuilt) due to a risk of buying one with tuning problems?
Before buying our oboe I will be sure to contact these recommended dealers for advice:
www.hannahsoboes.com
www.norapost.com
http://www.oboes.us
I might also contact "Skip Hoitt Hoittoboes". Any recommendations?
Here are some oboes I have considered recently:
Yamaha YOB-241
Fox (such as a model 333)
Oboe Buffet Crampon (I saw one made of grenadilla wood close to my home here on the west Coast used for $1000)
Lesher (saw a used older wooden Lesher for sale in my area as well - but will wait for opinion of a teacher on this one.)
Cabart oboe (older model. this model was made before Cabart was bought by Loree)
Should I eliminate all older wooden oboes from my list?
I will be contacting the above mentioned dealers and just take their advice but should I mention that I am not interested in any older wooden oboes?
Thank you,
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Author: mschmidt
Date: 2010-08-14 01:45
It all depends on the oboe. The 1956 Laubin I tried a month ago was wonderfully in tune.
Both Hannah Selznick (www.hannahsoboes.com) and Peter Hurd (http://www.oboes.us) are wonderful people to work with and should be able to find you something good. They are both sensitive to the needs of younger students. I got my Lorée oboe from Hannah and my English horn from Peter. I also got my Marigaux from Nora Post. So you're checking with the three people I've bought instruments from in the last 6 years! Brian Charles (http://www.charlesmusic.com/) and Pat McFarland (http://www.mcfarlanddoublereed.com/) have also been very helpful to me, and my teacher strongly recommends Carlos Coelho (http://www.carlosoboe.com/).
Mike
Still an Amateur, but not really middle-aged anymore
Post Edited (2010-08-14 01:49)
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Author: ohsuzan
Date: 2010-08-14 02:14
Hi bechstein!
It seems like you are making good progress in your search for an affordable, good oboe for your daughter!
As far as older wooden instruments go, it depends on how old it is (there ARE oboes that are too old), and whether it was any good in the first place. That is why so many of us have suggested you deal with Hannah or Peter -- they simply will not sell you a bad oboe.
Hannah deals in Fox instruments (among others), and that may be a good way for you to go. As long as you get an instrument that has relatively complete keywork ( Bb, left F), I don't think you could go wrong with a Fox. I personally would choose Fox over Yamaha, because Fox is a double-reed specialist -- that's all they make.
On the other hand, Peter Hurd is a connoisseur of fine vintage oboes, and if he says a particular oboe is good, even though it is old, I will put money on it that it is good. I met a very accomplished oboist this summer who is playing a Jarde that she got from Peter, and it was absolutely a fantastic instrument, even though it is almost as old as I am!
I would stay away from Lesher and Cabart, and again, I would pick a Fox over a low-end Buffet.
You don't want to buy a pig-in-a-poke. I think that is what the teacher you reference is concerned about. But as along as you deal with the people you mention in your post, I believe you would be wise to hear their recommendations and not automatically exclude a certain category of instrument from consideration.
Susan
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Author: justme
Date: 2010-08-14 03:14
With the Fox plasic oboes you don't ever have to worry about your expensive oboe cracking, as well as it will be much less affected by humidity,etc. ( very stable).
If you could afford the Fox 300 it would be even better, no cracking worries and a good sound...
Justme
"A critic is like a eunuch: he knows exactly how it ought to be done."
CLARINET, n.
An instrument of torture operated by a person with cotton in his ears. There are two instruments that are worse than a clarinet -- two clarinets
Post Edited (2010-08-14 07:03)
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Author: WoodwindOz
Date: 2010-08-14 12:10
I learnt to play on an old wooden Cabart that I had overhauled. It was a beautiful instrument, and the tuning was excellent. It had two issues though - the mechanism was well worn, as it had been a school instrument, and it was not equipped with all the keywork I found I needed very early on, as I was primarily a band player. Left F and low Bb are essential to band - make sure to find an instrument with these features.
I think the Fox 333 (or 330 if you can get one for a good price) is the way to go. You will likely get a newer oboe (less wear and abuse) with less maintenance and the correct keywork. I have a 211 Yamaha (older 241) which I use for outdoors, and it is fine, but most oboists would grow out of it as their primary oboe within the first year of learning.
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Author: cjwright
Date: 2010-08-14 19:52
As a full time player and doctoral student, I currently play a CJ wood Loree, dating back to approximately 1960s. I have not had any problems with the tuning.
Older instruments can have tuning issues. For one thing, the bore over time warps and changes. This can be detrimental sometimes, or completely harmless other times. Rarely have I seen instruments become so wacky in tuning that they become useless, but it does happen ever so often.
Having seen many older instruments, and having had many fixed up for myself, I can say I've noticed three common patterns that cause for tuning issues
1. Buildup buildup buildup. When David Weber takes an old oboe that needs to be put back into shape, the first thing he does is take off all the keys, and wipe out all of the toneholes really really well with scrub brushes. Often times dirt and hard debris can build up in the tone holes, causing them to become smaller and thus flatter, and effecting the resonance.
2. Tonehole shrinkage. Sometimes I notice that certain toneholes shrink from their factory settings. Alvin Swiney knows every Loree tonehole factory size during the B's through D's series, and can tell you any size at the drop of the dime. My last oboe felt a bit flat in the left hand, and after consulting with Alvin and checking with the drill bits, they indeed had shrunk a bit. A few turns of the drill bits and I was back in business.
3. Hard crunchy pads. When cork pads become hard and inflexible, they absorb less of the vibrations and so the timbre of the note seems to be more forward. Also, as pads get older, thinner, and shrink up, there is more venting for a note, which can also cause tuning changes and timbre changes.
Now, having said all of this, back to your original question. You can't buy much for $700-$1200, but something basic like a Yamaha 241, but if your daughter is going to play for a while, she will grow out of that instrument after the first year or two. I'd suggest trying to save up closer to $1500-$1800 and purchasing a Fox 330 as a few mentioned up above, as that would get her at least to mid-high school.
Cooper
Blog, An Oboe In Paradise
Solo Oboe, Thailand Philharmonic Orchestra
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Author: jhoyla
Date: 2010-08-14 20:00
Old oboes do not "lose their tune[ing]" - that almost never happens to an oboe, unless the bore warps over time, or cracks.
Far more likely is that an older instrument will go "out of adjustment" - oboes are very fickle in this. They need to seal perfectly, and old pads, old bed-places, old buffer-corks - all of these can conspire to prevent an older instrument from achieving that elusive, perfect seal. Microscopic cracks can make it hard, sometimes impossible to regulate.
That said, new instruments are not a guarantee of perfect seal, either! In fact, a new instrument is bound to settle in and require adjustment, possibly more than a refurbished, old instrument.
Peter Hurd on his website makes mincemeat of the argument that old instruments get "blown out" (read his "buying an oboe" section). This is very rare. More often than not, an overhaul will return an old instrument to full-throated, easy-playing glory. So don't reject an old instrument just because of its age! I have a 35-year-old Strasser-Marigaux that sounds better today than it did new.
Plastic instruments are often recommended for younger children because they are, after all, more robust. They survive ill-treatment better than their wooden counterparts. In addition, if there is any chance the instrument will be played outdoors then plastic is an absolute requirement.
The other myth that needs shooting down is that plastic instruments are somehow inferior to wooden. I am firmly of the opinion that a plastic instrument should sound at least as good as a wooden one - except that none of the makers seem to invest the same care, attention and refinement to the manufacture of plastic instruments.
Buffet make a full-pro instrument called the "greenline" - it is made of composite material and should be acoustically identical to plastic in every way. Some of the finest soloists today play the greenline. Marigaux make a clear plastic pro-instrument called the "altu-glas", but I've only ever seen jazz oboists play them. We Oboists buy wood because oboists have always bought wood and we smirk just a little when plastic instruments are suggested. "Good for beginners", we say.
There are valid, aesthetic reasons for preferring wooden oboes - they look beautiful! But acoustically, plastic instruments should be on a par.
Composite decking can be shown to be superior to wooden decking in every way with rigorous, scientific testing, yet people still buy wooden decking and shellac it religiously year after year.
Go figure.
J.
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Author: bechstein
Date: 2010-08-15 01:58
Thank you everyone for all these helpful responses. This forum has been invaluable as we pursue beginning to learn the oboe. Thank you kindly. I will reply to each of the replies here:
Thanks Mike for recommending these suppliers. It is reassuring to know I am contacting well regarded suppliers. Thank you.
Susan, Thanks for the further information about the various oboe suppliers. I still will give them all a call and seek their advice. I feel much more confident with all the direction and contacts everyone has suggested to me. Thanks again!
Thanks Justme. I have been receiving many recommendations to consider a Fox oboe (especially the student model for our daughter). Sounds like a good option. Thank you.
WoodwindOz, thank for the tips about the Left F and low Bb and the recommendation about the Fox 333 or Fox 330 oboe. Much appreciated.
Cooper, thanks for all the information you wrote about the tuning issues that are relevant to older wooden oboes - and older oboes in general. This has been very helpful - especially your recommendation of the Fox oboe as well. Very helpful and much appreciated! Thanks! I also checked out your website. I might try ordering a reed from your website in the future. Thanks!
jhoyla, I have not finished reading your reply - will do so after dinner! Thanks!
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Author: ohsuzan
Date: 2010-08-15 02:50
bechstein --
Just a suggestion about a way you might proceed, so you can get the benefit of all the effort you have already put into this endeavor:
When you contact Hannah and/or Peter, one thing you might do is ask them to read the two threads you started, so you do not have to "reinvent the wheel" in explaining to them your thought process.
I know that Peter sometimes checks in on this board already, and I would not be surprised to know that Hannah was around.
Susan
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Author: bechstein
Date: 2010-08-15 05:51
jhoyla, interesting view. Enlightening. Thank you.
Susan, good idea about quoting these threads. Very good idea. Thank you!
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Author: GoodWinds ★2017
Date: 2010-08-17 15:27
I have a Jarde probably dating from the 1930s and it works fine;
in fact, it needed less repair/maintenance than my newer (c.1970s) instrument.
GoodWinds
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Author: heckelmaniac
Date: 2010-08-25 07:21
Some further thoughts on this topic:
Please read Ron Fox's take on the notion of oboes "blowing out" to be found in the Double Reed Journal "An Interview with Ron Fox" Part II, DRJ Volume 32,
No. 2, pages 108-109.
In my opinion, oboes do not "blow out"- if anything, oboes "blow in." Over time, moisture absorption by the a wood fibers of an [untreated] oboe bore will cause the bore to contract ever so slightly, perhaps only by 1/1000th or perhaps 2/1000 of an inch. This is enough to change the playing characteristics
from when the oboe was new. Fortunately, a handful of highly skilled oboe voicers exist who can re-ream the bore of a "blown-in" oboe, usually with
excellent result. Will the oboe [after voicing] be exactly the same as the owner perceived it to be when new? Likely not, though a good chance exists that it will be close, and at times the owner may like the re-reamed oboe even better than it was when new.
It is possible to ruin (by enlarging the diameter of ) an oboe bore by overly aggressive swabbing [with "pull through swabs," or swabs made of rough or coarse material] over the course of many years, to the point that the only cure would be to install a plastic sleeve liner.
One of the oboes in my collection at present is a Loree "CC" series from
1912. It is the full "Buck Rogers" model, with all the modern keywork, except
3rd octave and F resonance. Due to the bore design, an F resonance is not necessary on this oboe. The wood is extremely dense, tight grain. No cracks.
This oboe absolutely "sings"- it has a very full throated, extremely resonant "core" to sound, though without being a "reed trumpet." The voicing is very even, and the scale is excellent. Though the wall thickness is not quite [say] that of a 1960s B series Loree oboe, the sound has elements of both "dark" and "bright' in the timbre. This oboe has not even remotely become "blown in," or "obsolete."
I find that the quality wood employed [within say the last 15 years] by many of the major European makers nowadays is exceeding poor in contrast the wood used previously. Many new [recent, late model] oboes now routinely experience warping in the bore to the point where they will not seem even remotely to play the same after a mere six months use. And the late model oboes not only crack with much greater frequency, many of the newer instruments
"explode" with a myriad of cracks, often though many tone holes.
It should be mentioned though in any discussion of cracking:
one of the best preventative measures to eliminate the likelihood of
cracking of any wood oboe instrument is to warmup ["incubate"] both joints
underarm, under shirt, jacket, sweater, for a full five minutes, no matter what the season or inside or outside temperature may be. See first paragraph "Care of Oboes and English Horns" on the oboes.us website.
I find that treating oboe instrument bores with 4 of 5 coats of Thompson's Waterseal to be a great help for oboe instruments old or new. This treatment
has two benefits: it helps prevent cracking by preventing the fibers of the wood
from absorbing moisture thus expanding, placing pressure [stress] on the structure, and also preventing "gurgling" in the octave vents and the tiny vent risers for C (B#) and Bb (A#). I have treated the bores of many, many oboe instruments belonging to professional, amateur, and student.
To date, I have not has even one player mention perceiving even the slightest difference in the sound after their instrument had been treated. I have not had
even one player say they wished the treatment could be reversed.
Again, this is simply my observation, based on my own experience.
A note about Jarde' oboes. Jarde' was an excellent maker overall.
Roland Dupin worked for Jarde' back in the late 1950, and considers Jarde'
to be be one of the very best oboe makers of his time. A professional model Jarde' oboe exists called the "Gomberg model." Once in a while I will find a Jarde' oboe I find somewhat "indifferent." I send such "indifferent" Jarde' instruments out for revoicing, and they almost always come back playing beautifully. I believe that the "Jarde'" oboes d'amore and English horns were made by Orsi for Jarde', and the final voicing was accomplished by Jarde'.
Peter Hurd info@oboes.us
Oboes.us
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Author: JRC
Date: 2010-09-10 19:49
Hi Peter,
Possible shrinkage of wood from losing moisture is so small relative to the overall dimension (diameter and length) that its affects to the oboe acoustics have to be minimal. Beside, its expansion and shrinkage due to temperature (from summer to winter and one geographic location to another) is about similar magnitude. The size change would affect intonation more than sound quality. But, a change in acoustic properties of the inner wall due to change in moisture content of the wood or chemical interaction between wood molecules and chemicals in air may be more significant. In this case, affects to sound quality is a larger factor than intonation.
I would dare guess that it would all depend on what the oboe was exposed to. Effects of leaving it out of case in Nevada desert for a year would be more detrimental than leaving in case in Florida for 50 years. I wonder what a long exposure to air pollution would have to the wood molecules. My first impression is that it cannot be good. Well kept old oboe may be as good or better than a modern oboe displayed in open air at a store for a long time.
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Author: heckelmaniac
Date: 2010-09-12 03:29
Hi JRC,
I can not comment on the possibility of shrinkage from the result of wood drying out over time. My thinking is that moisture ABSORPTION by the fibers of the wood inside the bore over the years may cause the wood of the bore to expand inwards, in effect making the bore ever so slightly smaller, thus "blowing in." This is why I recommend treating the bore with (say) Thompson's Waterseal- it prevents moisture absorption in the wood, and thus helps prevent cracking and also almost completely eliminates the possibility of gurgling in the octave vents and the tiny C (B#) and Bb (A#) vents. I especially recommend this treatment for "adverse" climes, such as Alaska, Nevada, Texas, Dakotas, etc.
I absolutely agree- much better for an oboe to leave it in its case in Florida for 50 years, than to expose it to the Nevada desert for a year.
I just now have home a 1908 Loree oboe, with all keys except left F and F resonance. The bore is in near perfect condition, very straight, and even much of the original polish (shine) is in evidence. The oboe has lived almost all of its life in New York State. The wood does not seem to be "dried out" at all as far as I can tell. Even with the pads in "deplorable" condition, this oboe sings, and will be well worth the effort to overhaul and add a left F. Seems to have a sound somewhat reminiscent of an early" 1970s "C" series Loree. Though the 1908 oboe is not as heavy in weight as a modern "C series, the sound is for sure not overly "bright" in timbre.
Of course, if you can find an all "synthetic" oboe that sounds exactly (or nearly) like a wood oboe, no worries about the possible changes over time in wood! The Marigaux "Altuglas" is sensational. The new oboes made by Tom Hiniker of cast Acrylic- also sensational. Tom is making an oboe, his own take on the BE-BK Loree oboes, in cast Acrylic for me now. Loree made (from the early 1970s through about 1983) a few dozen oboes of a mottled gray and white plastic. Amazing instruments. R. Dupin has recently started making an all synthetic oboe that is developing a following throughout Europe and Scandinavia. And Bulgheroni made a precious few (very rare) all synthetic oboes for Ben Storch ("Gordet") that possess a lyrical, singing voice indistinguishable from a wooden version.
With best wishes,
Peter
Oboes.us
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Author: JRC
Date: 2010-09-12 14:47
Hi Peter,
You always have wise tale to tell. I appreciate that. I recently bought a Rigoutat serial xx (1960 vintage) from Bulgarian dealer through ebay. You may remember that I was looking for open ring old oboe and tried one of your Kreul. This one is open ring top joint and padded middle. The condition of the oboe was not good. It appeared have been kept in case most of the years. Smell of mold and cigarette smoke was overwhelming. Apparently the previous owner was a smoker however old he might have been. Quick touch here and there got it playing enough to test the condition. It had good intonation and still had that Rigoutat classic bore quality; fruity sweet tone.
Some of the original shine was still evident on the wood, no cracks/chips larger than a mm or two. I made a major investment to completely overhaul it with well known oboe technician (recommended by many including you); left F key, new silver plating, new rods, new springs, and complete repadding and adjustment. He did a good job on keys but you cannot really tell plating quality for few years. But he did a terrible job on padding and adjustment. Probably it was not due to his lack of skill but he did not think I deserved his best. I had to go to a second tech to get it done right. Now I have my dream oboe. 50 years old but plays like new. It responds very differently to different reed. I can actually make my own sound. I tried a few new oboes; few Lorees and Howarth, before I bought this Rigoutat. I was very much surprised that these new oboes had its own sound and leaves little room for a player to shape his/her own sound. All my reeds (a wide range of different characters) sounded pretty much the same. They tell me that the oboes today gives you basic sound that is very tolerant to wide range of reed one might use. Even a bad reeds sound good enough to get one going. Great thing for a beginner!! I am not sure I would would be happy with manufacturer's concept of sound. Now Manufacturer is increasingly take up creating unique oboe sound than a player. I am not sure it is a good thing. A globalism is in the making... Oboe players are increasingly becoming the soldiers. OK that is another subject...
Bottom line is that "blown-in" or "blown-out" probably be a myth. It is all depending on how the wood is preserved. Loosing moisture and surface deterioration are the two dominant factors affecting the acoustic properties of the inner surface. If one sees the original shine of the oboe, it is a good indication that the wood may not have deteriorated too much. If the surface of the wood looks dry and the wood grains starts to show, it is a sure sign that characteristics of the wood may have changed, regardless of age.
I must caution you on applying sealant. I do not know any any sealant that does not leave a thin layer of film. Actually that is what you are hoping to get when you are applying the sealant. It would be a very very thin layer so you would hope it would not affect producing sound in any way. I would give you an example. The pitch goes up when the oboe is warmed up, because the dimension of the oboe changes a little due to thermal expansion. We are talking about probably 10 degree F change. Thermal expansion coefficient of the wood is very small. So we are talking about very small change in dimension. I did not run the numbers but I would dare say that it is about the similar order of magnitude as the thickness of the sealant film. It would affect the intonation mostly, especially from the top joint. But I would worry more about the acoustic property of the sealant layer. Unless it is the same as the finished surface of the wood, it would change the timbre because it would have different mechanical and acoustic properties. It would affect more in the lower joint.
Every oboe manufacturer have their own secrets of finishing the wood surface, especially the inner surface. If you change that, you changed the tone characteristics of the oboe. I do not know if any manufacturer of the oboe would offer a reconditioning service to refinish the woods surface, that would ensure maintaining and restoring the integrity of the tonal quality of the oboe while protecting it against the element. But I do not know of any manufacturer who offers such service. Probably we should encourage them.
So this is my five cents input to this thread.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2010-09-12 15:23
I've been tempted by several instruments but when I see they're located in Bulgaria that sets the alarm bells off. So would I be wise if I were to buy an instrument from Sofia and can rest assured I'll actually get it delivered? I've heard a lot of horror stories and also been taken in myself (although that was an Italian 'seller'), so I wouldn't want that to happen again.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
Post Edited (2010-09-12 15:24)
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Author: JRC
Date: 2010-09-12 15:30
I bought it under the condition that I will try out for 2 weeks and if not satisfied, I will ship it back only paying the shipping. ebay and Paypal stood behind it. It worked out! Actually shipping cost was not outrageous.
Long live ebay!
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Author: Jeltsin
Date: 2010-09-15 11:01
I have two Yamaha oboes (YOB431B and YOB821) and both sounds rather good. One difference between them is that I adjust the new one (YOB431B) six times/year but the old one (YOB821) twice / mounth.
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Author: JRC
Date: 2010-09-15 12:16
That is extremely unusual. I have one about 75-80 years old. Once I got it adjusted, it stays adjusted for many years and I had to make minor adjustment few times a year. Bumper cork gives in now and then. One 60 years old just got it adjusted professionally. I expect the same. I keep them in case all the time unless I am in playing sessions. I habitually swipe the moisture off often during playing session.
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Author: jhoyla
Date: 2010-09-15 18:14
Players with an extremely light touch need far more regulation than heavier players.
If you have powerful fingers you may easily get a perfect seal, even if the adjustment is a tiny bit off.
J.
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Author: JRC
Date: 2010-09-15 22:53
True. A heavy fingers have limitations in agility in general.
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Author: Jeltsin
Date: 2010-09-16 06:21
The adjustments I talk about are minor adjustments for both of my oboes.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2010-09-16 14:42
The silencing material and density of pads plays an important part in the stability of regulation. Using cork under adjusting screws is no good as it's too fragile and screw tips will chew through it, so using a firmer and more durable silencing material is best, but choose a material that keeps mechanical noise down to as minimal as possible.
Gasket cork (tech cork, gummi-kork, rubco, etc.) cut to 0.3-0.4mm thick sheets is pretty good as it is hard wearing, though it can become noisy over time. It does have some amount of recovery but on the whole is reasonably stable for use where fine adjustments are needed.
Thin leather (ie. from sax pads) can become too hard and noisy over time, and plastic such as nylon or Teflon (in sheet form or as adjusting screw tips) is too hard and noisy and Teflon can be crushed easily if too much pressure is applied to it.
When adjusting keywork I usually make the fingerplates slightly lighter than the vent keys they close as finger pressure is usually greater than remotely linked keys. So LH2 will close with slightly less pressure than the C vent above it when tested with light finger pressure, likewise with LH3 and the Bb vent.
Same applies to the RH2 fingerplate as that has to close both the F# and forked F vents - the vents closing with more pressure than RH2 and RH3 closing with lighter pressure than the F# vent as well.
If your oboe has the low B-C link, regulate the low C, B and Bb so they close together (just by pressing the low Bb touch) but getting progressively lighter as they go towards the bell. Without the low B-C link, make the bell key pad close with less pressure than the low B pad. The Eb and low C pads should close together as should the low B and C# pads.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: jhoyla
Date: 2010-09-16 14:50
Chris hello,
I was taught exactly the opposite - that is, the vents should seal less well than the actual fingerplates! As measured with cigarette paper, the vents should "hold" the paper, but the fingerplates should "grip".
Your reasoning is very sound, however. Next time I have a regulation issue I'll try it your way.
J.
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Author: mschmidt
Date: 2010-09-16 20:30
I have tried it his way, and it doesn't work! At least for me, with my Marigaux and my EH. But then, he's a pro, so it must work, somehow....
Seems like the sort of thing that would work with greater finger pressure.
Mike
Still an Amateur, but not really middle-aged anymore
Post Edited (2010-09-16 20:38)
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Author: mschmidt
Date: 2010-09-16 20:36
I found that my EH needed CONSTANT reregulation until John Peterson at RDG went over it, filing pad seats, recentering pads, and replacing a few pads. Now I don't need to mess with it nearly as often.
No instrument is leak-proof--it is a matter of whether the leak rate is great enough to disrupt the standing waves in the instrument. So if you have a leakier instrument, you can always be just below the critical leak rate, and the slightest maladjustment can put you over the top and give you problems. The more you get rid of the "background" leaks, the less you'll notice minor maladjustments.
Mike
Still an Amateur, but not really middle-aged anymore
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2010-09-16 22:43
By 'slightly lighter' I mean marginally lighter so both pads close together, but the fingerplates close with slightly less pressure than the vent keys they control when tested with the thinnest cigarette paper feeler gauge. Finger pressure will always be greater than pads closed remotely (via a linkage and adjusting screw) and no-one plays with an excessively light touch otherwise they won't be able to seal the holes in the fingerplates.
If they're the other way round with the vent keys closing with lighter pressure, the danger is if the silencing material under the adjusting screw tips compresses, the vent keys won't fully close.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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