 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: ruben
Date: 2026-01-27 13:24
A recent topic made mention of a new clarinet that has been made by Fox, the fine American bassoon maker. Has anyone out there tried one out?
rubengreenbergparisfrance@gmail.com
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Author: m1964
Date: 2026-01-30 01:32
IF I were looking for a new instrument, I would want to try it first but none of Fox dealers around me (1-1.5 hr drive) show it in stock.
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2026-01-30 08:54
Music and Arts is listed as a Fox dealer. In past experience I had luck asking a Yamaha dealer to bring in a Yamaha clarinet for trial. Perhaps Music and Arts would be willing to do the same for the Fox clarinet. I would assume there are not that many out there so sending them around will probably be the accepted way to have folks see them.
..............Paul Aviles
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Author: ruben
Date: 2026-01-30 18:22
I see that its price -just over 4000 dollars-is quite reasonable; well below Buffet and Selmer's. Are these clarinets entirely manufactured in the US?
rubengreenbergparisfrance@gmail.com
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Author: David H. Kinder
Date: 2026-01-30 19:40
Yes, they are only manufactured in Indiana.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p1Ool42gji8
Ridenour AureA Bb clarinet
Ridenour Homage mouthpiece
Vandoren Optimum Silver ligature (plate 1)
Vandoren Traditional #5 reeds
ATG System and Cordier Reed Trimmer
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Author: m1964
Date: 2026-01-31 09:26
Ruben wrote:
"I see that its price -just over 4000 dollars-is quite reasonable; well below Buffet and Selmer's. Are these clarinets entirely manufactured in the US?"
The R13 can be bought in the US for about $4200-$4500.
I see Selmer Presence (an equivalent of an R13 in Selmer's world) selling for about $4500 or $4800 with left Ab/Eb key. Selmer has their Evolution system bore too.
Fox, at $4200, needs to be at least as good and probably better than the two models above, since its re-sale value and long-term reliability are unknown.
And, as Donald noted, will they make an A?
If they lowered the price, maybe there would be more buyers...
I've spoken to many community bands/wind symphonies player who told me their band mates use R13 mostly (it's like a gold standard), or Selmers 10/10G, or play cheaper instruments like Bundy or US Selmer.
At $4200, I'd be looking for a used Prestige or Festival.
However, one cannot underestimate feel of a new (and unique) instrument, so I suspect there will be Fox buyers at some point.
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Author: donald
Date: 2026-01-31 12:35
Apparently no plans to make an A clarinet, but that could change (that could BE changed with some pressure/interest maybe?)
I suppose they want to see if the Bb is competitive... the best way to do that WOULD be to lower the price- but the cost of French instruments will probably rise pretty soon so maybe they are banking on THAT happening...
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Author: David H. Kinder
Date: 2026-01-31 13:28
If I were Fox, I would need to show what we're capable of producing first. You make a 'splash' with your potential at a given level and price point.
Then you expand your product offering. An intermediate and student level Bb would be obvious followed by a matching A to their initial offering.
While oboe makers can make great clarinets, there isn't necessarily a great track record for sales. Howarth made a really nice pro-level clarinet and stopped making them some time ago. I'm sure there are other examples.
Ridenour AureA Bb clarinet
Ridenour Homage mouthpiece
Vandoren Optimum Silver ligature (plate 1)
Vandoren Traditional #5 reeds
ATG System and Cordier Reed Trimmer
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Author: clarnibass
Date: 2026-01-31 20:34
The nice thing is they use actual real mechanical improvements in their advertising.
Statistically, how many clarinetists who are playing and/or are in the market for a $4,000+ clarinet need an A clarinet too?
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Author: kilo
Date: 2026-01-31 20:48
I thought the Fox video on the Sweetwater site was very informative.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p1Ool42gji8&t=4s
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Author: donald
Date: 2026-01-31 23:29
David Kinder - Oboe maker Marigaux also made an excellent clarinet. The Howarth clarinets maybe sold more than you thought, just outside your "sphere of awareness", did that occur to you? After all, they did keep making them for decades....
clarnibass- high school kids buying a clarinet so they can get into all-state might then want to get an A clarinet when they go to Uni, without having to replace their Bb to get a match... Also, probably a great number of pro players won't even bother considering the Fox clarinet UNLESS they know there'll also be an A clarinet.
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Author: ruben
Date: 2026-01-31 23:52
For years, hardly anybody playing Selmer series 9 or 10 or 10S played a Selmer A clarinet, which was considered substandard. So a Fox A clarinet could wait and people could go on playing the A clarinet they are now using. For years, I played Selmer 10S and Buffet A clarinet.
rubengreenbergparisfrance@gmail.com
Post Edited (2026-02-01 00:26)
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Author: graham
Date: 2026-02-01 02:11
Why not just go for it? No need for the “nobody got the sack for buying IBM” approach. An A of a different maker will do fine or Fox may launch one. Have one on approval. If you don’t like it, return it.
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Author: David H. Kinder
Date: 2026-02-05 23:55
Michael Lowenstern just dropped his review video on it:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gBBCKUQ1MlA
Ridenour AureA Bb clarinet
Ridenour Homage mouthpiece
Vandoren Optimum Silver ligature (plate 1)
Vandoren Traditional #5 reeds
ATG System and Cordier Reed Trimmer
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2026-02-06 02:49
I certainly appreciate that there is "an assessment." However I don't believe however well intentioned that one can divorce themselves from HOW they play to arrive at any truly objective result (bells and whistles not withstanding).
I wish that Mr. Lowenstern would have just done a purely SUBJECTIVE assessment such as "it was fun to play," or "that was a lot of work!" Then of course there are the all important comparisons to the playing CHARACTERISTICS of the other professional line horns. Does it play more like (or FEEL more like....) a Selmer or a Buffet, or a Yamaha or a Uebel? As it stands we can only assume that he was not subjectively thrilled with the horn because that was what his "objective numbers" are showing.
It is concerning to hear that the twelfths come off wide. This is one area that others trying this horn should address when making their own assessment. It is also an area where how you play influences the final result. For now I'll just have to assume Mr. Lowenstern was not happy with how it played and that would be more meaningful to me. Of course as a dealer of various brands it is quite courageous even even offer the computer test......so that's saying something.
............Paul Aviles
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Author: Ed
Date: 2026-02-06 04:26
Paul makes some good points. Analytical data can tell you some, but it misses the personal.
Looking at the charts, it is interesting that some clarinets like the R13 would look like an inferior to others yet has been used with great success by many players for decades.
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Author: kilo
Date: 2026-02-06 05:59
In the video from Fox, about 3½ minutes in, Melanie Wong discusses intonation, and differentiates between clarinets that play rigidly in tune as opposed to instruments that have flexibility and can be adapted to their tonal surroundings. I don't know how widespread that feeling is in the higher echelons of performance, but Michael explained that he was trying to play as straight as possible, without making all sorts of personal adjustments on the fly. In other words, playing mechanically, not "artistically".
I've only owned three professional clarinets, a CT, a Series 10, and my current Buffet. They all had their tonal quirks, for which I developed quirky fingerings, and I believe this is a common approach to irregular intonation. As is discussed, when playing in a wind ensemble, no two players will have the exact same intonation. Players need to tune to their section, soloists need to be in tune with their accompanists, the pitch of held notes needs to be approached differently than pitch in staccato passages. Anyway, I got the sense that the makers feel that the new instrument can be played in tune but individual players may need to make some adaptations to be truly satisfied with the sound. I think I've done that on every instrument I've played, new of used.
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Author: m1964
Date: 2026-02-06 08:41
It took Buffet about 40 years to improve R13 from their introduction model, that had some tuning and tonal problems, to their current well-rounded model.
Selmer is now also producing very nice clarinets that compete successfully with offerings from Buffet.
Uebel, with their unique tone and undisputed quality is also up there, with Yamaha being not far behind (IF behind).
I am asking myself: who is going to buy a new unproven model when you can get such nice instruments from the well-established brands?
If the Fox is serious about their clarinets, why not introduce the A, at least available as a special order?
IF I were looking to upgrade my student clarinet, a used high-level instrument would be my choice, or, at least, a well-established model with predictable re-sale value.
***I am looking at a new Fox for $4200 and a used Tosca for $6000 (at a very good shop). I think Tosca wins.
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Author: David H. Kinder
Date: 2026-02-06 09:40
m1964 wrote:
> It took Buffet about 40 years to improve R13 from their
> introduction model, that had some tuning and tonal problems, to
> their current well-rounded model.
And even then, they introduced a new 'Vintage' model that was more of the original placement of the register key.
(Always interesting when a manufacturer makes something new and calls it 'vintage'.)
Ridenour AureA Bb clarinet
Ridenour Homage mouthpiece
Vandoren Optimum Silver ligature (plate 1)
Vandoren Traditional #5 reeds
ATG System and Cordier Reed Trimmer
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Author: ruben
Date: 2026-02-06 12:27
David Kinder: In restaurants, you have the dish of the day. Buffet and Vandoren have the model of the month.
rubengreenbergparisfrance@gmail.com
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Author: ruben
Date: 2026-02-06 18:06
Thank you for sending us to this excellent, exhaustive-but not exhausting review: really luicid and objective and well-meaning.
rubengreenbergparisfrance@gmail.com
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Author: kilo
Date: 2026-02-06 18:36
(Note that David Kinder referenced the Earspasm review earlier in the thread.)
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2026-02-06 20:01
And once they launch an A clarinet, people will then be demanding they launch an Eb clarinet, then a bass clarinet, then a basset horn, then a basset clarinet, then a C clarinet, then a D clarinet, then a contra-alto clarinet, then a contrabass clarinet, then an alto clarinet, then a Z clarinet, then a Q clarinet, then a who-gives-a-flying-f**k clarinet ...
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
Independent Woodwind Repairer
Single and Double Reed Specialist
Oboes, Clarinets and Saxes
NOT A MEMBER OF N.A.M.I.R.
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2026-02-06 20:49
Ya know, both Backun and Uebel (the Uebel that made what one would call a perfunctory Oehler clarinet) were new upstarts on the scene until there was an endorsement from Ricardo Morales.
so
Mr. Morales...........any thoughts?
..............Paul Aviles
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Author: Ed
Date: 2026-02-06 23:57
I know they are working on an A.
I applaud them for their efforts. I am not sure if I ever plan to buy another clarinet, but these days I think I would be inclined to try a variety instruments and buy whatever plays well for me and have no concerns about brand or model. There are so many good choices these days. Of course, that is assuming I had the $$$. LOL
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Author: David H. Kinder
Date: 2026-02-07 00:21
One issue I have with the Earspasm review video is that he's introducing his benchmark evaluation. I think it's still highly subjective because it still depends on your own mouthpiece, ligature, reed setup. Mouthpieces can affect tuning greatly.
I saw Jay Hassler's interview with Julian Bliss. He plays on a Vandoren BD4 13-series. He says he always tends to play sharp and he's his own problem - so he gets equipment to compensate.
At least the old Clarinet Pages website (that I'll visit via the internet archive) he discloses his equipment (mouthpiece and barrel) to get the tuning that he gets.
Without that disclosure, it will be biased to his setup. (At least I know he doesn't use the 13-series mouthpieces because he doesn't sell them on his website.)
Ridenour AureA Bb clarinet
Ridenour Homage mouthpiece
Vandoren Optimum Silver ligature (plate 1)
Vandoren Traditional #5 reeds
ATG System and Cordier Reed Trimmer
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Author: Ed
Date: 2026-02-07 03:10
Yes, mouthpieces (as well as the reed that is matched to it) can change the pitch significantly. Different dimensions in the bore and baffle can be a problem. For example, over the years I have known a number of players who found the Vandoren 13 series to be quite flat in the throat register. Some used a slightly shorter barrel while I knew others that had the mouthpiece shortened. (some just played a little out of tune, LOL)
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Author: graham
Date: 2026-02-07 17:06
There needs to be another review. Eric Black?
Fox says that several players have helped develop it, so the intonation should be better than the results of this review (and the points made by others are clearly pertinent).
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Author: paulyb
Date: 2026-02-07 19:21
Comparing the Fox and R13 intonation graphs from Earspasm they both have pretty similar characteristics - flat throat tones and a generally in-tune clarion. In fact, if you tuned the Fox about 5-10¢ sharper you would have a pretty similar graph to the R13 (maybe this would be how the 65mm barrel plays?). This probably makes sense - the R13 is, by all accounts, the market leader in the US in this category so it makes sense for Fox to target that as the competition.
There are a few things that I don't particularly like about the "pure data" approach (though there are lots of things I *do* like about it). The discussion above about mouthpieces / reeds / players is definitely an issue and it would be really great to see evidence as to the repeatability of these results (especially between playing sessions and between different examples of the same clarinet model). The normalisation of the middle B to 440Hz doesn't make very good sense to me since that can be somewhat of an outlier from a tuning perspective - ideally I'd like to see normalisation that minimises the intonation errors across the range (i.e. choosing the "best" normalisation to minimise tuning errors as this is what's most important in a playing situation).
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2026-02-07 19:37
Very good point above. I tune the throat G without even thinking about it, and then add notes above and below until I am happy with the full range. I only tune concert “A”…… well, in concert.
………..Paul Aviles
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The Clarinet Pages
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