 The Clarinet BBoard
|
Author: ruben
Date: 2021-05-04 12:37
Dear friends: I have been using a little cloth that is supposed to keep your glasses from fogging up when you wear a mask, which we all do these sad days. I thought I'd try it on the tone-holes of my clarinet that amass a lot of water. You simply rub the inside and the rim of the tone-hole a bit with the cloth. It seems to work, but I have to experiment with this technique a little longer. The brand: Varionet. There may be other brands of cloth, or sprays that work just as well or better. Your feedback please.
rubengreenbergparisfrance@gmail.com
Post Edited (2021-05-04 12:47)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: OneWatt
Date: 2021-05-04 16:53
Sounds like the cloth is impregnated with a compound similar to something called "Cat Crap" which is rubbed on the inside of ski goggles to keep them from fogging up.
It's basically a very thin, waxy substance. Not sure I would want that on my toneholes, as our may attract/accumulate dust and debris over time?
- - - - - - - - - -
Israel = Ancient Hebrew for "Wrestles with God"
Klarinet = Ancient Greek for "Struggles with Reeds"
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: ruben
Date: 2021-05-04 18:57
OneWatt: There is nothing visible on the cloth. Maybe they have actually put nothing on it (apart from snake-oil)! But then again, I can't see very well because my glasses are fogged up. ha ha!
rubengreenbergparisfrance@gmail.com
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: LFabian
Date: 2021-05-05 02:35
A small 3” x 3” chamois or micro cloth works. In rehearsals I keep my swab out hanging from my stand behind the folder to do the whole clarinet.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: JTJC
Date: 2021-05-05 12:49
I used a chamois pull through years ago and found it left deposits inside the tone holes so don’t use that material anymore.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: ruben
Date: 2021-05-05 15:49
I'm not so much talking about clearing the water out, but rather about preventing the pool from building up.
rubengreenbergparisfrance@gmail.com
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Djudy
Date: 2021-05-05 19:10
The water is going to be present in your breath and then inside the instrument no matter what you do. It would seem to me that the answer is to get it to slide all the way down and out efficiently. Now everybody says don't oil too much or it will ruin the pads, but it seems as if a well-oiled bore, like a well-seasoned skillet, would have a greater ability to pearl off condensation so it wouldn't get in the tone-holes in the first place. Maybe a little silicone based swabbing just at the location of the puddling ? (I'd like this to work as I have 2 clarinets that I'm fond of and that puddle, but since I haven't been able to rehearse in over a year this problem has been the least of my worries.)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Chris P
Date: 2021-05-06 00:10
Could it be silicone or something similar?
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Slowoldman
Date: 2021-05-06 00:37
I would suggest a food-safe gel/grease, such as McLaughlin Sanitary Petrol Gel.
But any grease will get swabbed away fairly quickly (and grease up your swab, to boot).
As annoying as water in tone holes is, the best remedy may still be: "Swab early, swab often."
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Philip Caron
Date: 2021-05-06 01:24
Maybe there could be small lightweight electric fans in each tone hole, all blowing inward.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2021-05-06 05:05
I appreciate looking at newer solutions to age old problems, particularly because the use of hydrophobic chemicals and textures is a pretty new field.
I picked up a box of five "Nano Magic - Anti Fog Dry Cloths"
The listed ingredients are:
o propylene glycol butyl ether
o fluoroaliphatic oxyethylene adduct - listed within patented anti-fog formulation
o 2-(2-butoxyethoxy) ethanol
The other two ingredients may play a role in the hydrophobic properties but may just be part of what makes the second listed one stay on the cloth or glasses or both.
I have applied to the throat "A" and "G#" tone holes, the two lowest side key tone holes, the "C#/G#" tone hole and the lower joint sliver key tone hole. These have been giving me some trouble of late and I will report back any success or problems in the next few days.
I'm sure Phil's comment was meant purely to be comical.
....................Paul Aviles
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Tony F
Date: 2021-05-06 09:04
For years I've been using a silicone spray intended for automotive use. I apply it using a long QTip in the tone-hole and around the edge inside the bore.
Tony F.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: LFabian
Date: 2021-05-06 10:54
Swaying while playing makes the water go where you don’t want it.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2021-05-06 11:50
I meant to share something like this earlier:
http://materialintuition.com/2015/07/what-is-a-hydrophobic-material/
Check out the video a little lower on the page, particularly starting at 1:57.
I would LOVE to see a clarinet pad constructed with a covering made from a material that has an architecturally hydrophobic surface. It's not the presence of moisture per se, but rather "water adhesion" that is the issue with "blocked" tone holes.
..................Paul Aviles
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: ruben
Date: 2021-05-06 16:08
Dear Paul: Please let us know what your conclusions are. Maybe different brands have a different chemical make-up.
rubengreenbergparisfrance@gmail.com
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2021-05-11 19:36
What I did was to wipe the top of the aforementioned tone holes and the chimney of the tone holes with the lens cloth. On the first practice session I looked down at about the twenty minute mark and had a little rivulet coming out of the top joint "C#/G#" key, but there was no blockage of the sound. About another half hour later there was some traditional sound interference. My thought here is that once there is ample water present, the effect of the anti-fog cloth become nullified. However, it took another couple of days before I had some water issues with some of the side keys and I still don't have any blockages of the throat "A" or "G#" keys (but I fear that it won't take long for a blockage to re-appear).
The anti-fog clothes for glasses then do work some on a short term basis but I don't think it will be a longer term solution. Considering the effort to remove the keys to apply the cloth directly to the surfaces in question, there seems to be too much effort for the short duration of the relief.
Here I'll add that I spoke to a good repair tech about the "hydrophobic" idea and he had no specific direct comment. He did offer up the fact that a number of oboe players use a wedge under keys with water problems (not under the pads but along the key between the axle and the pad) to hold them open while in the case. This allows all the moisture in the tone hole to dry up and gives you a better shot at not having the problem then next day.
I looked more closely at the Ultra Ever Dry product and thought about how that may be the answer, but there is more to the problem than just the expense of $180.00 US dollars for the two part system. Since the hydrophobic surface is "spikey" (like a bed of nails), it may prevent the pad from being air tight against the tone hole if applied to the pad. An experiment might be in order but if it does not work, you'd have to replace the pad. Further, any experiment with the body of the clarinet itself could be quite expensive if it means that the applied product is not removable, particularly if it were to cause some serious unpredicted problems.
This whole path toward the Ultra Ever Dry product may be a solution in search of a problem and not worth the pursuit. I would also discourage anyone from trying that willy nilly without the understanding that whatever instrument (or portion of it) it is applied to could result in a total loss.
Still an interesting idea.
...................Paul Aviles
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: ruben
Date: 2021-05-11 20:18
Thanks for the update, Paul! The cloths that are supposed to keep your glasses from fogging up don't work entirely on glasses either. But a 30 per cent improvement is nothing to sneeze at and maybe that's what you got on your water-logging tone-holes
rubengreenbergparisfrance@gmail.com
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2021-06-03 00:04
Just a further update on "wedging keys open."
I've had great success with this method of keeping water out of the keys. I have cut little wedges from what is basically a rubber cane bumper. Cork wedges made for this or fashioned from wine bottle stoppers would be great as well.
Remembering to put them in at the end of the day (or end of practice session) was not so hard. However, remembering that they are IN there at the beginning of practice was a bit harder for me. I'd find them on the floor later or initially thought my clarinet had developed a catastrophic leak! After a few weeks, I'm into the routine and all is going well.
Who knew oboe players were so smart?
:-)
.............Paul Aviles
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: ruben
Date: 2021-06-03 10:05
Paul: Thank you and I will try this. I always knew oboists were smart. -smart, but neurotic.
rubengreenbergparisfrance@gmail.com
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: fbjacobo
Date: 2021-06-09 23:54
I have a unique solution to the problem: I taught myself to be comfortable holding the clarinet rotated at a slight angle, thus letting the condensation travel down the bore without getting in the tone holes. I rarely get water in the holes now.
CASE CLOSED Musical Instrument Case Repair Service
Jacobowitz/Larkin Duo
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Late_returner
Date: 2021-06-10 03:51
I dont know about new tricks but I have an old book Treatise on the Clarinet by Rudolph Dunbar (1939 ) where he recommends preventing water flooding C#/ G# by "before playing take a moistened piece of broom-straw and draw it down the inside of the bore, passing near but avoiding the C# hole.
He says this will direct water away from the hole which sounds probable but I have yet to try.
I can only guess that a broom-straw would be like a farm yard straw, to distinguish it from a waxy drinking straw that they may have used in the 1930s
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
The Clarinet Pages
|
 |
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
