 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Ed Lowry
Date: 2021-03-21 23:05
Any thoughts on how to play C7 ![[C7]](http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/smileys/c7.gif) consistently would be appreciated.
In particular, reed (harder or softer than usual) and embouchure location, abdominal support, anything else? I'm using RT 1-0-0 1-0-0 with the Ab key and sliver keys on occasion.
I'm working on Gershwin's First Prelude, (James Cohn orchestration) which ends on this note, as a staccato, with no slurring up from lower notes in that register.
Thanks for any thoughts.
... Ed.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2021-03-22 00:53
Use the F#/C# key instead of the Ab/Eb key.
Sp. Th. xoo|xoo F#/C#
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: claricolin
Date: 2021-03-22 01:00
I recently learned to play C7 consistently by increasing the range of daily scales (especially chromatic). I think what helped me the most was focusing on voicing and staying relaxed.
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Author: cigleris
Date: 2021-03-22 01:42
Your fingering should be good. I would suggest first though to find the node on the reed which helps the harmonics speak. Once found one can achieve a much better control of the upper altissimo register.
Other options are of course reed strength, how much mouthpiece taken in. Instrument that’s not leaking etc.
Peter Cigleris
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2021-03-22 02:10
It'll speak much easier using the F#/C# key instead of the Ab/Eb key.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: SecondTry
Date: 2021-03-22 02:26
"Take in more mouthpiece," is what I heard as a student when asking the same question Ed.
In hindsight I found this answer not wrong, but lacking in 2 basic details: how to take in more mouthpiece without squeaking and how much mouthpiece is the right amount to take in.
Unfamiliar with your acumen on clarinet, apologies if this banter is all too familiar, but our embouchures should be grabbing mouthpiece as would a rubber band, not a vice grip. To restate, pressure on the mouthpiece should come from all sides, not just up and down. Doing so will, I believe allow players to take in more mouthpiece without squeaking.
The next lesson, again one you may have forgetting more about than I know, is how to determine how much mouthpiece to grab.
The answer is to keep on grabbing mouthpiece, following the first piece of advice, until you squeak; then back off a micron. There's your spot.
Of course fingerings, practice, and reeds, as mentioned, play into hitting C7 as well.
Good luck! 
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Author: kdk
Date: 2021-03-22 04:03
SecondTry wrote:
> The answer is to keep on grabbing mouthpiece, following the
> first piece of advice, until you squeak; then back off a
> micron. There's your spot.
This advice has become more or less dogma here on the BBoard, but I confess I find that spot uncomfortable. I don't really like the sound I get that way. I think the best advice about how much reed to take in is to listen to the result and find the spot that is comfortable in your mouth and produces the sound you want to hear. It may not even be the same place on every reed.
Your ears are the best guide in most things to do with playing an instrument.
Karl
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Author: Tom H
Date: 2021-03-22 04:59
I take more mouthpiece and adjust before the high C occurs. Depends a lot on the reed too. I have been practicing on my Legere (2.0) last 3 years and actually went from having little success up there to finding the high notes easier now than on my wooden reeds. Probably because the plastic reed plays the same every time. I am getting comfortable with high C# & D ("D7", still unsure why it's called that), even at times Eb and E.
Working up to these notes, try going up a major scale to them. Tonguing, then slurring. Then match with lower octaves to check intonation.
The Most Advanced Clarinet Book--
tomheimer.ampbk.com/ Sheet Music Plus item A0.1001315, Musicnotes product no. MB0000649.
Boreal Ballad for unaccompanied clarinet-Sheet Music Plus item A0.1001314.
Musicnotes product no. MNO287475
Post Edited (2021-03-22 07:51)
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Author: Fuzzy
Date: 2021-03-22 06:47
Thanks Karl!
I agree with you on this, but that makes us both heretics on the bboard.
Quote:
Your ears are the best guide in most things to do with playing an instrument. - a simple statement which (in my opinion) should be seen more often on the bboard.
;^)>>>
Fuzzy
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Author: SecondTry
Date: 2021-03-22 18:25
Karl:
I actually concur with you on backing off from the point where squeaking occurs when taking in a mouthpiece, to be...
...more than a micron
But this raises a point for me first raised by Tom H. above:
I was taught, right or wrong, that embouchure adjustments--at least in terms of how much mouthpiece we take in, if not for other things--should not be subject to change to hit notes in the highest of the upper written range of the instrument (i.e. around C7, not Mate Bekavac's stratospheric range far beyond C7.)
And yet, I'm in Tom H's camp, finding myself snugging up on mouthpiece at about this point in Spohr 1--much as the performer seems to not do so, even if her C7 isn't perfect, and even if she's awesome for her age:
https://youtu.be/cnw03oQPPPY?t=120
Does anyone have thoughts on this?
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Author: kdk
Date: 2021-03-22 19:03
SecondTry wrote:
> I was taught, right or wrong, that embouchure adjustments--at
> least in terms of how much mouthpiece we take in, if not for
> other things--should not be subject to change to hit notes in
> the highest of the upper written range of the instrument.
>
> And yet, I'm in Tom H's camp, finding myself snugging up on
> mouthpiece at about this point in Spohr
> Does anyone have thoughts on this?
>
I have a couple of thoughts.
First, I think rules about what to do or not do to produce a specific result can become the enemy of secure playing. They can function as starting points, because to do ANYthing you need to start somewhere. But from that starting point, you need to be result-oriented more than rule-compliant.
Second, more or less following from the first point, is that as we get older and more experienced, "I was taught" at some point really needs to be replaced by "I have found" or "I have discovered." Our teachers were simply players whose experience was important in guiding us in a starting direction. If you studied with more than one teacher as a young student, you realized sooner or later that they all did things differently. Sometimes the differences were subtle and sometimes they were fairly drastic. At a certain stage in our development, we gradually find ourselves having to take all that we were taught, discard what we find not useful, and synthesize the rest into a coherent, but IMO hopefully still flexible, approach.
Karl
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Author: Tom H
Date: 2021-03-22 21:16
kdk, Yes. Funny, although in less detail, your last paragraph is exactly what my H.S. private teacher told me in maybe 1971.
I later played with him and under his conducting many years professionally. He was fine player with a lot more "credits" on his perfomance resume than I. It was weird when HE once asked ME for pointers on tonguing. So I mentioned the "tonguing exercise" that yet another teacher, Russianoff, had shown me.
The Most Advanced Clarinet Book--
tomheimer.ampbk.com/ Sheet Music Plus item A0.1001315, Musicnotes product no. MB0000649.
Boreal Ballad for unaccompanied clarinet-Sheet Music Plus item A0.1001314.
Musicnotes product no. MNO287475
Post Edited (2021-03-22 21:21)
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2021-03-22 23:10
Did you try using the F#/C# key instead of the Ab/Eb key?
If so, how did you find it?
If not, then try it and then you can thank me later.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: SecondTry
Date: 2021-03-23 00:27
Good advice Karl....
unless you studied under Opperman, or Revelli's baton.
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Author: cigleris
Date: 2021-03-23 01:03
Chris,
I found that using the F#/C# key made it too sharp. The Ab/Eb worked better and the low F/C key is also a good alternative for pitch but can be possibly a little unstable.
Another good top C fingering is: th and sp XOO/XXX low E/B key
Peter Cigleris
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Author: EbClarinet
Date: 2021-03-25 01:57
There r several ways 2 handle this that no 1 is mentioning. More easily, u can just switch 2 Eb Clarinet with an expensive mouth piece and #4 or harder reed and just play the altissimo G a 4th below it.
Another way is to form your oral cavity so that there's an < o > shape inside your mouth. The tongue is going to have 2 b lowered on the back and just "voice" up 2 it. I don't know your set up so I can't elaborate more on what u should do.
With my technique, I can easily play the C#7.
https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/mbtldsongministry/
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Author: cigleris
Date: 2021-03-25 02:50
EbClarinet,
I think I do something similar, though I’ve never really analysed it but reed permitting I can get up to F7 with out much bother. Having a good feel for the partials really helps when playing up there.
Peter Cigleris
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Author: Ed Lowry
Date: 2021-03-27 02:21
Thank you everyone for your thoughtful advice and comments, which I've been playing with over the last week. My difficulty now seems to be inconsistent attack with an A-flat often speaking first.
I like the idea of playing on the E-flat clarinet, but it has its own difficulties at my level of expertise. The oxx xxx E/B fingering allows the C7 to pop out a bit more easily, but I'm not sure at this point whether that will continue to be true as I get used to adjusting my mouth/tongue and throat through greater practice. It's also a bit flatter than the xoo xoo C#/F# fingering I've been using, based on advice given on this thread, which helps.
I'm playing D'Addario #4 reserve classic reeds on a Lomax Chicago C11 mouthpiece attached to a Rossi Clarinet; I don't know if there's anything unique about that set-up as it relates to this part of the clarinet range.
Once again, thanks to everyone.
..Ed.
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Author: elmo lewis
Date: 2021-03-27 19:28
Try holding the clarinet closer to your body. This increases the pressure on the reed withouthaving to bite harder.
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