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 Vandoren Black Master - Really fit on Boehm mouthpiece?
Author: Mirko996 
Date:   2019-05-27 20:55

Hi, months ago I ordered from a store different pack of reeds, 1 box of reeds vandoren blue measure 5, and 3 box of reeds vandoren black master german model measure 5, in this website it says this
cut can also suit the Boehm system mouthpieces, i tried one of vandoren black master using different mouthpiece (B40, 5JB, Buffet Crampon etc...) and I haven't received good, it looks like a reed for e flat clarinet, just a little bigger (I think it can be used on piccolo clarinet).
However two package was sent back, I toke a package of vandoren blue and the other I opened, so for my personal experience doesn't fit.

Today I searched these reeds for vandoren website, and i'm surprised to find these reeds with a major strength (5++, 6, 6+)

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 Re: Vandoren Black Master - Really fit on Boehm mouthpiece?
Author: Dan Oberlin 2017
Date:   2019-05-27 23:10

These were the only reeds I used when I played on Gigliotti mouthpieces (P34) a long time ago.

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 Re: Vandoren Black Master - Really fit on Boehm mouthpiece?
Author: Paul Aviles 
Date:   2019-05-28 01:25

For the record, the Vandoren Black Master and White Master reeds are sized for Viennese and German sized mouthpieces respectively. Many players DO use them on Boehm with the caveat being whether they cover the full window opening of the mouthpiece. Some Boehm mouthpieces have a window too wide to accommodate these reeds.

I have used the White Master reeds on Boehm with great success (smallest of the two) but had to be careful to center the reed over the window to get adequate coverage.


Just a quick aside: The German cut Legere reeds (small, German sized reeds of the White Master dimensions) are the third best Legere reeds on Bb Boehm clarinet (after the European Signatures and Signature Soprano Sax reeds).




.................Paul Aviles



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 Re: Vandoren Black Master - Really fit on Boehm mouthpiece?
Author: Micke Isotalo 2017
Date:   2019-05-28 23:46

Sounds strange. The tip width of the Black Master reeds should be the same as on the "Blue box" reeds. I just checked a BM Traditional reed against a "Blue box" one, and the only differences was that the BM was shorter in total length and the bottom end of the BM was slightly narrower (thus the sides of the reed are slightly v-shaped, as on the Rue Le Pic's and V21's). However, I couldn't see any difference at all in the tip width.

A typical tip width on both Austrian (as the BM) and French cut reeds is 13 mm, while on German cut reeds it is typically 12 mm.

While the dimensions of Austrian and French cut reeds are either the same or very close, the strength markings are not. In my experience, an Austrian cut reed is typically about 1,5 strength grade stiffer compared to a French cut reed. As an example, a Black Master #3 would be about the same strength as a "Blue Box" #4,5. Thus your BM #5,0 would be equivalent to a "Blue Box" #6,5 - if such ones existed. About the same applies to German cut reeds (as the White Master) versus French cut ones.

Thus if a "Blue box" #5,0 is your usual strength, a BM #5,0 should have been very, very stiff for you.

Could it be possible that you got fake reeds? There should be a printed code on each reed which you can verify on the Vandoren Web site for authenticity. Or that you got White Master or Eb-reeds wrongly labeled as Black Master reeds, or in the wrong package? What does the label on the reed say?



Post Edited (2019-05-30 10:52)

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 Re: Vandoren Black Master - Really fit on Boehm mouthpiece?
Author: Clarinet_GAS 
Date:   2019-06-02 13:48

I've heard a lot of people playing on black masters with no problem. Never tried them myself, but I've used white masters on my b45/b40, portnoy BP02, and Fobes Debut with no problem.

I might be wrong, but aren't black masters just a rue lepic 56 for german system mouthpieces? Or rather rue lepic 56 was made because french system players loved the black masters...

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 Re: Vandoren Black Master - Really fit on Boehm mouthpiece?
Author: Paul Aviles 
Date:   2019-06-02 17:21

I may be thinking of an "older" Black Master, but I had used Rue Lepic for years as my 'go to' and I would never even dream of using the Black Masters. The Black Masters I recall from the '80s where just very stiff, very brittle and thin sounding - for me. Rue Lepics have more "back bone" but where never as brutish.



..........Paul Aviles



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