 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Exiawolf
Date: 2016-07-20 05:17
Greetings!
I am getting really sick of myself and need help setting something straight. I have an awful horrible habit of switching between two mouthpieces I own on a practically weekly basis (Namely a B40 Lyre and and M15). I honestly don't know which one to stay with, and comments from my teacher and peers have not helped narrow the choices (Both are "good" and have different issues and slightly different sounds). Which one would be a better "learning" mouthpiece? One to stick with until I actually know what needs to be changed. I figure some of you teachers on this forum have experience in this area and a general "idea" on this topic.
Thanks
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Author: Tobin
Date: 2016-07-20 05:31
Hello Exiawolf,
It would be beneficial for many of us to know what types of music you perform and what ensembles you are a member of.
They are vastly different mouthpieces. Do you use two different set of reeds for each? What reeds do you use?
In short -- for me -- pick one. Sell the other. Learn to play the one you pick to the best of your ability.
James
Gnothi Seauton
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Author: Exiawolf
Date: 2016-07-20 05:38
Yes, I use different reeds for each (Could not imagine using the same strength on either one!) Strength 3 V12 on the B40 Lyre and 3.75 V12 on the M15. I mainly perform orchestra, wind ensemble, and solo works.
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2016-07-20 05:48
I think I may be repeating myself, but it is much better to have consistent time on one mouthpiece before you can even begin to appreciate what it offers. Until then you have only a superficial view of your equipment. I would suggest that you need to spend three to six months on ONE mouthpiece/reed combo before you switch up (if that would even be necessary at that point).
Additionally,
For classical music, I would advocate for the smaller tip opening mouthpiece because there is "built in" control of timbre and pitch with the smaller openings. The more flexibility you have with the pitch and timbre of more open mouthpieces is a double edged sword. Sure you have (maybe) more colors to chose from at the drop of a hat, but that comes at the price of having to be more actively in control to achieve the consistent pitch and timbre as you move through octaves within one particular piece.
...............Paul Aviles
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Author: CEC
Date: 2016-07-20 07:14
Flip a coin and get rid of one of them.
A nugget of wisdom from Daniel Bonade (this may be apocryphal, and is paraphrased, but is great advice nonetheless...):
"Take every mouthpiece you own down to the lake. Get in a boat and row out to the middle. Put on a blindfold, then throw every mouthpiece into the lake but one. Return to shore. Take the remaining mouthpiece home, then learn how to play it."
Post Edited (2016-07-20 07:17)
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Author: Jeroen
Date: 2016-07-20 13:46
Only 2 mouthpieces, well, it could be worse. Why bother? Just keep playing both. With time you will find out which one you prefer. May be depending on music and different acoustic settings you can still use both. There are a lot of players that switch mouthpieces to match different demands.
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Author: kdk ★2017
Date: 2016-07-20 17:19
Quintin, the difference in sound , which you describe as slight, isn't important. Both mouthpieces will allow you to produce a perfectly attractive clarinet sound. If the difference is slight to you, it's probably almost non-existent to listeners.
So, what are the "different problems" of each? You don't need to recite them here - some will no doubt be idiosyncrasies of the mouthpieces and some will be products of your technique. But when you identify them specifically, do any stand out as especially important in enabling your best playing or interfering with it? You will be better off with the mouthpiece that has the biggest "pluses" with "minuses" you can work around.
You're beyond the point where a "learning" mouthpiece is different from just a mouthpiece. We're all learning constantly. It's only the level of refinement we're working with that changes. Go with the mouthpiece that is most supportive. If there really isn't a clear choice in your practice room, then put them both in your case with a few appropriate reeds for each and test them out in real playing conditions. Pick the one that plays best for you in the real world.
It's possible that one works better in a band clarinet section and the other works better in an orchestra. If that's the case, I don't see what's wrong with using each where its strengths are.
Karl
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Author: ruben
Date: 2016-07-20 18:13
Many words of wisdom from the other people posting here. I would just like to add that with my double-lip embouchure, which I now use exclusively, I find I can more easily adjust to different mouthpieces and reeds and get the sound my conscious and unconscious mind is seeking than I was able to when playing single-lip. I think it has something to do with making very subtle adjustments of pressure, how much mouthpiece you take in, opening of the palate, etc, that are less possible with single-lip. Just an observation and let this not be interpreted as an attempt to convert you to double-lip.
rubengreenbergparisfrance@gmail.com
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Author: clarinetguy ★2017
Date: 2016-07-20 18:58
I agree with Karl's final comment:
>It's possible that one works better in a band clarinet section and the other works better in an orchestra. If that's the case, I don't see what's wrong with using each where its strengths are.
I only use one mouthpiece, but there are people who use more. I recall reading a few years ago about a famous player who has one mouthpiece for orchestral playing and another for chamber music, but I don't recall who it is.
Of course, you could always follow the lead of Henry Lazarus.
In the Lazarus entry in Pamela Weston's More Clarinet Virtuosi of the Past, she quotes Jack Brymer who "tells the story of one of Lazarus' pupils who said his master's drawing room table groaned 'under the weight of not less than fifty mouthpieces, all complete with reeds, which the great man used in turn as he felt necessary.'" (p. 155)
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Author: GeorgeL ★2017
Date: 2016-07-20 19:17
I am certainly in no position to advise you which of the two mouthpieces to play, but I would suggest that when you choose one of them, don't sell the other one; rather, wrap it in a distinctive package and leave it in your case.
Stuff does happen. If your first choice gets broken just before the big concert, it will be nice to have a spare.
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Author: Tobin
Date: 2016-07-20 22:56
The reeds for one won't really work on the other. Keeping a spare mouthpiece isn't a bad idea -- but a spare that far apart in its facing isn't really useful.
James
Gnothi Seauton
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Author: ruben
Date: 2016-07-21 00:38
Tobin: Are the facings that different? I didn't realize that. Thank you.
rubengreenbergparisfrance@gmail.com
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Author: ruben
Date: 2016-07-21 00:54
Forget it because European players play it?! -funny way of reasoning.
rubengreenbergparisfrance@gmail.com
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Author: ClaV
Date: 2016-07-21 02:19
European B40?
What about David Shifrin who played B40?
What about Ricardo Morales who played/designed MoBa very close in specs to B40?
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Author: tylerleecutts
Date: 2016-07-21 02:42
To add, Todd Levy has played the B40 for a long time.
As a student I would go with the mouthpiece that is less fussy with reeds and day to day playing. For me that would be the M15.
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Author: Tobin
Date: 2016-07-21 03:35
From the Vandoren mouthpiece chart, the B40Lyre has a 117.5 tip opening...the M15 has a 103.5 tip opening.
B40Lyre reed recommendation is 2.5-3, the M15 is 3.5-5 (for v12 reeds).
James
Gnothi Seauton
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Author: Mojo
Date: 2016-07-21 17:37
Seems like you have every reasonable suggestion a forum can generate. But not enough votes to declare a winner.
Do you play sax yet?
MojoMP.com
Mojo Mouthpiece Work LLC
MojoMouthpieceWork@yahoo.com
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Author: SarahC
Date: 2016-07-22 01:57
I have a similar combination of mouthpieces. I would say which one you like the tone best of.. and stick to that one. And I've noticed that different people swear by different facings and their tone. (jazz players like the B40, but more classical players are more toward the M15.) i would say the b40 usually gives a more open tone, but the m15 a more focussed tone? something like that.
but they are both good pieces. so if you pick one, you will come to love it, and know it inside out. So in a way, it doesn't matter which one you pick. They will both do the job
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Author: Tony Pay ★2017
Date: 2016-07-22 15:23
It may be at the back of your mind that you're SPOZED to be using just one mouthpiece for all your playing. But, why is this? You don't think like that about reeds, after all.
Some oboe and bassoon players even routinely change reeds between passages in a piece.
I play on many different instruments, with different fingering systems and different mouthpieces, so I have had to become used to being more 'multilingual' in my playing.
I think that the problem of confusion between 'languages', even for relative beginners on an instrument, is exaggerated. (Think how children adapt to parents with different mother tongues.) Rather, you learn to be more flexible, and this flexibility can bear fruit even when playing different sorts of music on just the one mouthpiece.
Use what gives the best results in given circumstances. What works well in a cathedral may not work so well in the open air.
Of course, that does require that you have some sense of 'working well' – but that's a deeper problem.
Tony
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Author: ruben
Date: 2016-07-22 21:24
The late French clarinetist Jacques Lancelot said he couldn't understand the present-day "embarras de choix" when it came to equipment. He himself, he said, had always played a Vandoren 5RV mouthpiece, Vandoren number 3 reeds and a Buffet RC clarinet. That was his sound and his identity; take it or leave it. It may have been his sound, but it wasn't necessarily the sound suited to the music he was playing. These days, we wouldn't like our Debussy to sound like our Brahms. Switching equipment certainly facilitates this search for a distinctive tone and colour for each piece we play. Technically speaking, I also agree with Mr. Pay: it gives you greater flexibility.
rubengreenbergparisfrance@gmail.com
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Author: Matt74
Date: 2016-07-28 01:25
I would definitely test my intonation on both. You might find one is much better than the other.
First test overall pitch. You should be pushed in all the way, or almost all the way, at the barrel. (A little room - like 1mm - to push in is handy if the ensemble is sharp, but everything plays better and more in tune with the barrel all the way in.) Push all the way in between the top and bottom joints.
Then, try the consistency over the whole horn, especially the throat tones. Play the one that's more in tune. Do this with the top and bottom joints pushed together as well.
- Matthew Simington
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