 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Tony Pay ★2017
Date: 2016-06-22 18:48
I want to be clear – and it's why I've put it in a new thread – that this is not any part of a discussion about whether you should or should not use vibrato. Please don't make it that; it would just be to play into what my friend Michael McIntyre calls 'the dichotomization instinct' which is unfortunately just as prevalent here as it is in the rest of the world; see parts of:
http://www.atm.damtp.cam.ac.uk/people/mem/papers/LHCE/mcintyre-e-book-draft.html
(I suspect that Dan Oberlin in particular might find this growing e-book by a fellow mathematician/musician interesting, though it's an important read for anyone.)
All I want to do is to track down what is the evidence for the assertion that Mühlfeld had 'a big vibrato'. There is no mention of it, for example, anywhere in the entirety of the biography "Richard Mühlfeld, der Brahms-Klarinettist" Artivo 2007 pp395, though there is much citing of contemporary praise of his tone and phrasing.
Perhaps I should try getting in touch with Bruce Adolphe about the details of the part of his talk that deals with the matter. He mentions 'letters' and 'interviews notated down', for example. Here's the relevant part:Quote:
There had been some interviews with Mühlfeld, with members of the orchestra, and they're notated down and there's a description of Mühlfeld's playing, and one of the most famous descriptions says that he played with a BIG vibrato...we know from descriptions that Joachim hardly used vibrato except in expressive moments, much less than people do today; but according to the letters, Mühlfeld used as much vibrato as any string player of that time. The passage in Brymer's book that I mentioned in the other thread goes:Quote:
Just before World War II a question was put to a very old viola-player, sometime conductor of the Duke of Devonshire's Orchestra, about the playing of Mühlfeld. The old man had occasionally been called in by Joachim to play in his quartet, and on several occasions had played the Brahms Quintet with the great Mühlfeld. Of the clarinettist's playing he was most enthusiastic, saying that three things mainly stuck in his memory. "He used two clarinets, A and Bb for the slow movement, to simplify the gypsy section; he had a fiery technique with a warm tone – and a big vibrato." Asked again by a startled questioner if he didn't mean to say 'rubato' the old man looked puzzled. "No," he said, "vibrato – much more than Joachim and as much as the 'cellist." (It will be recalled that Joachim was reputed to play with little or no vibrato.) This account, while of no authority, does at least give one food for thought; it could be that the achievements of exceptional players (and Mühlfeld was certainly that) do not always take root in the years that follow their finest period. Has anyone got any ideas, or leads?
I should say again that this doesn't lead anywhere for me in terms of how I play myself. The interest is merely academic.
Tony
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Author: ruben
Date: 2016-06-22 19:33
Mühlfeld had been a violinist and, from what I have read, was self-taught on the clarinet. One would assume he reproduced, consciously or unconsciously, his violin vibrato on the clarinet. On the other hand, did violinists all use vibrato in late 19th century Austria and Germany? I have read that Fritz Kreisler was the one who introduced its systematic use, which musicians like Roger Norrington now deplore.
Have you, personally played Brahms on a Baermann clarinet? This is the instrument Mühlfeld used; a throw-back to the past in those days. I imagine he played differently from other clarinetists and this is precisely what Brahms found inspiring about his playing.
rubengreenbergparisfrance@gmail.com
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2016-06-22 19:54
Would that be a pitch (lip/jaw) or volume (breath) vibrato, or both?
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
Post Edited (2016-06-22 19:55)
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Author: seabreeze
Date: 2016-06-22 20:34
Other than the poorly documented anecdote about the old viola player and conductor given in Brymer's book, descriptions of Muhlfeld's use of vibrato would seem to be lacking. Alama Mahler-Werfel in her diary entries for March 29 and 30, 1900 recalls attending a rehearsal and performace of Josef Labor's Quintet for Piano, Clarinet, Violin, and Cello in which, according to Susanne Rose-breymann, the editor of the English translation of the diaries, Richard Muhlfeld played the clarinet part.
Mahler-Werfel's diary entry records, "It wasn't very exciting. To me it made the impression of a mathematical problem, carefully worked out. I can summon up little enthusiasm for such cerebral art." (p. 271, Alama Mahler-Werfel Diaries 1898-1902, Cornell U. Press, 2000).
She says nothing about the clarinetist's playing salvaging a mediocre work or stirring her blood, or whether he used vibrato or not. The entire performance--Muhlfeld's talents nonwithstanding, left her cold. Why bring this up? Because it, like so many other written contemporary accounts of Muhlfeld's playing, does not give enough information for us to tell how he sounded or whether he used vibrato or not. Could it be possible that he used vibrato when playing Brahms' music (or in general when playing for Brahms) and did not use it, for example, when playing Josef Labor's music?
In any case, Muhlfeld was able to work his magic on Brahms but not always on other musical audiences, including Mahler-Werfel.
Post Edited (2016-06-23 22:37)
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2016-06-22 21:32
I think Jack Brymer is very reliable. I've read his two autobiographies, From Where I Sit and and In the Orchestra, and his Menuhin series book The Clarinet and found them full of clearly observed and sharply expressed details that match my own experience exactly.
Thus I believe that he heard an old musician describe Mühlfeld's vibrato. Also, Brymer describes his surprise and asks a follow-up question and gets a confirmation. Calling the story unconfirmed is fine, but there are lots of one-off stories that there's to reason to doubt. Saying that it's "unreliable" is simple name-calling.
I began this by describing Gabetta's rich vibrato and Ottensamer's "straight" sound that made it impossible for him to match the cellist's intensity. This matches perfectly with my own experience working on the Brahms Trio. I eventually convinced the cellist to use vibrato as an expressive tool rather than part of her sound, and things went much better.
Whatever you think of Reginald Kell, I find his LP recording of the Trio to be excellent, with his vibrato matching that of the wonderful cellist Frank Miller.
Ken Shaw
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Author: Lelia Loban ★2017
Date: 2016-06-22 21:53
Tony, I'm not a professional musician, but as a writer and researcher, I share your unease about the sourcing of that anecdote Brymer describes. The passive voice construction bothers me:
>>Just before World War II a question was put to a very old viola-player, sometime conductor of the Duke of Devonshire's Orchestra, about the playing of Mühlfeld. >>
Who put that question? If Jack Brymer had written that *he* asked the elderly violist about Mühlfeld's playing, I'd be more inclined to trust the story, but from the way he wrote that sentence, it's impossible to tell whether Brymer might have heard the story second-hand, or third-hand, or worse.
Similarly, Brymer describes the reaction from "a startled questioner," once again without naming the questioner. Apparently this person knew enough to make a distinction between vibrato and rubato, but beyond that, we've got no clue whether this questioner was a musician, much less a competent musician. Oh, and, by the way, is the "startled questioner" in that sentence the same person who asked the question "Just before World War II..." earlier or did more than one person participate in questioning the elderly violist? And who was this "very old viola player," anyway? Do we know anything whatsoever about this anonymous violist's mental competence at the time when this anonymous interrogator (or these anonymous interrogators) asked these questions?
Information described that vaguely isn't dispositive.
Lelia
http://www.scoreexchange.com/profiles/Lelia_Loban
To hear the audio, click on the "Scorch Plug-In" box above the score.
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Author: Tony Pay ★2017
Date: 2016-06-22 22:08
Ken Shaw wrote:
>> I think Jack Brymer is very reliable. I've read his two autobiographies, From Where I Sit and and In the Orchestra, and his Menuhin series book The Clarinet and found them full of clearly observed and sharply expressed details that match my own experience exactly.
>> Thus I believe that he heard an old musician describe Mühlfeld's vibrato. Also, Brymer describes his surprise and asks a follow-up question and gets a confirmation. Calling the story unconfirmed is fine, but there are lots of one-off stories that there's to reason to doubt. Saying that it's "unreliable" is simple name-calling.>>
But, Brymer didn't say that HE was the questioner. In fact, the impression I get is that he wasn't. He would have been in his twenties at the time.
Who said it was 'unreliable'? I said it was "only by an unattributed viola player in Brymer's book. This urban legend should either be properly substantiated or killed off."
I want to know where Brymer either heard it...or read it... That might substantiate it. I'm sorry I never asked him about it.
If it's true, fair enough.
If it's just an urban legend, I want it gone. It shouldn't be available to bolster up spurious dichotomizing claims about the use of vibrato in Brahms.
I'm immune to such arguments – I make my own decisions about how we may best represent the music BY STUDYING THE MUSIC, as in Bruce Adolphe's video – but others are more gullible.
Tony
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Author: brycon
Date: 2016-06-22 23:46
If I remember correctly, Fanny Davies played the trio with Muhlfeld in London (with Joachim's coaching, I recall). But the only thing of performance practice interest are her rehearsal markings in the piano part. Did she write anything about Muhlfeld's playing?
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Author: seabreeze
Date: 2016-06-23 01:46
Bernard Portnoy wrote a little essay on Richard Muhlfeld in 1949 that reports praise for Muhlfeld's expressive pianissimo but says nothing about the use of vibrato. Let me see if I can find a copy anyway to reprint here. The essay was called "Brahms' Prima Donna." It does remark on the possible necessity for the piano to be retuned to accomodate the pitch of Muhlfeld's clarinet.
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Author: cigleris
Date: 2016-06-23 01:56
Musical Times May 1st 1892 regarding the London premiere (March 28th) of the Clarinet Quintet describes Muhlfeld's playing thus:
"Mr. Muhlfeld, of Meiningen, who had been engaged at the composer's special desire because he had created the part and knew its requirements, speedily proved himself an executant of the highest calibre. His tone in the lowest register is superb, and his phrasing absolutely unsurpassable for finish and beauty of expression."
George Bernard Shaw, " Bayreuth's Indifference to Beauty", The World, 1 August 1894
"... and on coming round the corner have found an old man playing a clarinet with an old slack reed as easy for his feeble jaws as the reed one cuts for a child in a cornfield. The tone produced by such ancient men and that produced by Lazarus in his best days (which was, I think, purer, if less rich, than Muhlfeld's) mark the two poles of my experience of clarinet-playing; and I have always found that in German orchestras the standard tone leans more to the man in the street than to Lazarus."
Judging by the review above I would be inclined to think that Mulhfeld's tone was without vibrato. We don't know if the "beauty of expression" refers to vibrato or not. George seems to back up the review two years later and we can assume that he was present at the Quintet premier. I may be mistaken but I don't recall reading that Lazarus played with vibrato. Shaw was a big fan and so would possibly have made that distinction if Mulhfeld did use vibrato.
Peter Cigleris
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Author: seabreeze
Date: 2016-06-23 02:15
Excellent quotes. George Bernard Shaw certainly had a great ear for words; his prose is powerful and melodious. If his ear for music (and he did write a sheaf of music criticism) was as good, one would expect him to hear and describe any characteristic as pronounced as vibrato. An old clarinetist who as a boy heard Muhlfeld play wrote a letter around 1956 to the Clarinet magazine describing his impression of Muhlfeld. It agrees with the assessment given in one of your quotes that Muhlfeld was impressive in the lower register but adds that he was less impressive in the higher registers. The old (American?) clarinetist goes on to say that Muhlfeld squeaked more than once during the performance and opined that Mulhlfeld would not be considered anything special if he were performing in the 1950s. (Ouch! Groan! Yes I know this question of historical relativism opens up a thousand cans of worms).
Here's the article from the Summer 1956 issue of the Clarinet (no mention of vibrato):
http://www.clarinets-oboes.com/Richard-Muhlfeld.html.
And here's Bernard Portnoy's "Brahms' Prima Donna" (also no mention of vibrato):
http://www.clarinets-oboes.com/Brahms'-Prima-Donna.html.
Finally, an extensive research paper by Emily Tyndall, "Johannes Brahms and Richard Muhlfeld's Sonata in F Minor for Clarinet and Piano" that reports on contemporary descriptions of Muhlfeld's performance but does not mention vibrato:
http://www.archive.org/stream/johannesbrahms00tynd/johannesbrahms00tynd_djvu.txt.
For whatever it is worth, when Charles Neidich plays Brahms on his boxwood copy of a Muhlfeld Baerman system clarinet, he does use some vibrato:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mKYH4vZzqDk.
Post Edited (2016-12-10 22:19)
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2016-06-23 07:17
I'll take the bait this once. I thought about the Brymer story carefully before mentioning it. I did so in the context of a discussion about the clarinet/cello balance in the Brahms Trio, and everyone (even Tony) agreed that it was a problem in the Ottensamer performance.
Although I'm nowhere close to Tony's playing level, I can hear problems as well as he can, and a big problem between Gabetta and Ottensamer was her continuous vibrato and his lack of it. Another big problem was Ottensamer's failure to play out where necessary, but the vibrato mismatch was certainly important.
Rather than calling names, let's talk about how to solve the balance problem in the Brahms Trio. I invite Tony to tell us about how he addressed the problem in his rehearsals and performances.
Ken Shaw
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Author: Philip Caron
Date: 2016-06-23 07:28
Two separate threads are getting conflated. It might be better to keep them separate.
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Author: Roys_toys
Date: 2016-06-23 13:33
On one aspect of this, I think any assumptions following from Jack Brymer writing in the passive tense (LL) may not be merited.
I am on holiday, no access to my stuff, but I do remember that JB also tells us elsewhere in Clarinet of "two clarinettists" using identically set up 1010s who play perfectly in tune with each other, but are a semitone out ( I think) when using each other's clarinet. I believe it is common knowledge that the "two clarinettists" were himself and Roy Jowett, but while he goes on at some length to use the story for the illustration he wants, identities or personal pronouns are never allowed to slip in - "two clarinettists" remains sufficient and they could just as easily be in Australia as in LSO.
So the passive tense used in the vibrato story may not warrant the assumption.
it was a gentler age where the writer should avoid direct reference to self whenever possible. In fact I remember when I was studying English around the time jokes about the capital I being the first letter to wear out on a typewriter.
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