 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Ravi2000
Date: 2015-12-08 06:35
I'll be auditioning for a All State band in New Jersey this weekend playing vonWeber's Concertino Op. 26. The piece is currently a mess in my brain and frustrating beyond anything - so many hits and misses, my confidence levels are fluctuating so bad that I have a splitting headache. The staccato stuff is absolutely murdering me, I have a fast tongue but my fingers can't get coordinated and I don't have time to go and fix it.
Anyway, I have 3 options to pick from:
1. Play the sixteenth passages dirt slow and nail every note. Seriously, even at 100 bpm my articulation still sounds like a draining bathtub.
2. Play it up to speed and sound even more like a draining bathtub with a 5% chance of sounding decent.
3. (My current choice) Remove all of the staccato and play it up to speed or even faster with everything slurred. It's All SOUTH Jersey and I'm very much shooting for first chair, what are the chances another high school student will be able to play the sixteenth notes perfectly? I can play them just fine, my tongue and my hands just refuse to sync up.
Any advice is greatly appreciated, I need all the help I can get.
THE ABOVE IS THE ESSENCE OF MY QUESTION BUT WHILE I'M HERE THERE'S ANOTHER LESS URGENT ONE BELOW
Recently I've been concentrating a lot on jazz tenor sax moreso than clarinet. I'm currently playing on a Vandoren V6 mouthpiece with Vandoren Jazz #3 reeds. The reed to mouthpiece thickness is enough to almost fit my tongue in between and I prefer that a lot more. This is kind of a dumb question but is there a way that I can get my clarinet to feel more like a sax? Whether it's a certain kind of mouthpiece or a certain kind of reed that someone can suggest, I don't care. I feel like the difference between my sax and my clarinet embouchure has grown a little too much over the past year or so. My clarinet specifically feels like it isn't able to cope with the amount of air I'm putting into it, leading to a really unnatural feel. It sounds just as good, but my airflow seems really restricted and I'm not sure how to fix it.
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Author: qualitycontrol
Date: 2015-12-08 06:48
Playing a bit under tempo, but very steady and with the proper articulation, is definitely the best bet. It's what they want to hear. If you play it too fast and sloppily, they won't know for sure that you don't play it the same way when it's slow.
Under 100bpm is fine for an audition, especially if it's your best bet. It will be a broad allegro, but those passages around 85-95bpm will still have some oomph to them if you articulate them very clearly and precisely. Make sure to really emphasise the 16ths that fall on each beat to really give the lines a pulsation, a direction. If there's any amount of phrasing and direction, that will make up for a lack of speed.
I always find perfect, crisp staccato sounds quite a bit faster than badly played staccato—if you take two passages, one perfectly played at 90bpm and one badly played at 100 or 105, the first one will sound faster because it has more direction.
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Author: nbclarinet
Date: 2015-12-08 06:55
I agree mostly with the above poster. Nailing the articulation at a slower tempo will always sound better than missing it at a faster tempo.
Still, depending on the passages you're referring to as well as the edition you are using, you may not need to do so much staccato tonguing. Ive seen plenty of editions of Weber with downright ridiculous articulations. Remember that often composers of that era would not include very many articulations as that was considered up to the performer in many instances, meaning that the articulations are often editorial on the part of the publisher. So..... I suggest you listen to some recordings, see how professional players are articulating, and then decide where and if slurring is appropriate.
Cheers,
NB
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Author: Bob Bernardo
Date: 2015-12-08 07:12
What clarinet setup are you playing on? Some players that play the saxes often use a more open clarinet mouthpiece. Added the clarinet is much more resistant, so be careful with trying to match the volume of air. This can screw up your clarinet sound a lot.
Don't make any instrument setup changes now.
It's always best to slur, compared to wrecking a passage. With the Concertino sometimes you can slur 2 note tongue 2, then slur the rest of the 16th note passage. When you hit the last top note you can try tonguing it and accenting it. When you start the run start the first note with confidence. It's almost like you are holding it very slightly. This actually shows the judges that you have complete control over the instrument.
When your fingers and tongue don't line up it's almost always, like 95 percent of the time or more, your fingers are late and your tongue is ahead of your fingers. Often players think that their tongue is too slow.
Most judges know the Weber pieces well, along with the Mozart Clarinet Concerto. These are played all of the time at auditions, so it's best to play the piece as clean as you can. Forget about the other players. Worry about your rhythm most of all. Keep the tempo steady. Don't play some of the hard parts at 100 BPM then suddenly pick up the speed to 120 for the easy parts. So slur with confidence if needed.
Hope this helps, best of luck, and let us know how it went.
Designer of - Vintage 1940 Cicero Mouthpieces and the La Vecchia mouthpieces
Yamaha Artist 2015
Post Edited (2015-12-08 07:22)
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Author: kdk ★2017
Date: 2015-12-08 07:23
Does All South Jersey require a specific edition with the articulations in that edition? Pennsylvania adjudications do, and judges are supposed to take points off the score of a student who does different articulations from the specified edition.
I agree that a little under tempo with accurate articulation is likely to produce a better score than either "up to speed or even faster with everything slurred" or "dirt slow and nail every note." In fact, "even faster" may lose points even if you articulate it - there's a point at which it becomes unmusical and, usually, sloppy if you put a premium on speed with no attention to much else.
Problems syncing your tongue and your hands are caused either by uneven fingering that won't sound right even slurred, or an approach to tonguing that isn't under control - often you have only one fast tongue speed and if it doesn't fit the music, you're in trouble. The long-term solution is to learn how to tongue with control and make sure your fingers are moving efficiently so the passage work is even. In the short term, you're best off finding a tempo that works, whether it's the one you think will impress the most or not, and play as cleanly as you can.
As for tonguing into the tip opening, it's a good way to shred the tip of your tongue. The tip of the reed is quite thin. Getting your clarinet to feel like a sax is probably not a useful goal. They're different instruments in too many ways. It may be a little like trying to make English and French sound more like each other - you'll end up with heavy accents in both languages and you won't sound like a native speaker in either. If you try to make a sax - especially a tenor or (worse) a bari - feel like a clarinet, you'll end up with neither having a characteristic or attractive sound.
Karl
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Author: ClarinetRobt
Date: 2015-12-08 19:50
Usually the articulations indicated from a given edition is not necessarily set in stone, brilliantly mentioned above. Eg, if a section is written all tongued, in the clarinet world, since double tonguing is rarely an option, it's completely acceptable to add a slur...perhaps slur two, tongue two.
This fluidity with Weber can be a lot of fun for you (as well as helping you with your technique).
Peter Hadcock stated in his book "The Working Clarinetist" in orchestral passages with extended tonguing at 160bpm, which is virtually impossible without double tonguing, he simply added the occasional slur to let the tongue rest for an instant. With enough air support, you can tongue all day, by mixing up the articulation. He claims (I think, it's been forever since I read it) in the many years playing in Boston, he's never had a director say a word about changing the articulation. It should be noted, that if the clarinet is playing those straight sixteenths with say the strings, you'd never hear the clarinet adding a slur because the whole body of sound being generated by the orchestra.
So back to your point. As long as you indicate on the edition the changes you're making in articulations (at least in Texas solo competitions...I'd check if you're beholden to the edition's written articulation), it's doubtful a judge will care. I was taught to mix up articulations. For example, in the repeat in variation 2, play something different each time. It makes the performance more interesting for the audience. If I were you, play closer to performance tempos (if flawlessly executed) and add slurs to help expedite your technique. I would also add, going back to my thread on the board, make sure the style of the tongue notes is in keeping with Concertino (detached) and not legato.
~Robt L Schwebel
Mthpc: Behn Vintage
Lig: Ishimori, Behn Delrin
Reed: Legere French Cut 3.75/4, Behn Brio 4
Horns: Uebel Superior (Bb,A), Ridenour Lyrique, Buffet R13 (Eb)
Post Edited (2015-12-09 03:06)
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Author: Ravi2000
Date: 2015-12-08 22:40
In response to Karl, I was just using that as an example to illustrate how large of a tip opening I generally play on saxophone. I guess the basis of that question is whether or not there's a clarinet mouthpiece out there with a wider tip opening. An above post mentioned that you can't put the air you put into a saxophone into a clarinet, which I now know is very much the problem I'm facing. I figured I would just see whether there's a mouthpiece out there that has a wider tip opening to make jumping back and forth from one to the other a little bit easier.
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Author: Bob Bernardo
Date: 2015-12-09 03:24
What mouthpiece are you playing on now? There are a lot of mouthpiece makers that have larger tip openings, but you should be very selective here. Do you have a teacher?
One of the more popular mouthpiece makers is Vandoren. They make mouthpieces from close to very open. The M13 is about 1.01mm's to the B40 which is about 4.0mm's and very open.
I wouldn't make a change unless you are under the guidance of your teacher. The reasons are many. The main reason is your sound is not set and won't be for several more years, it won't be set even when you are in college, if you major in music. It will keep changing for many years. Good mouthpieces cost a lot of money, however the reason for asking what mouthpiece you are playing on now, may be a stinky one and it could be worth making a change now and stay with it for several years. If the rails and tip are dinged or chipped well you should look into another mouthpiece.
Designer of - Vintage 1940 Cicero Mouthpieces and the La Vecchia mouthpieces
Yamaha Artist 2015
Post Edited (2015-12-09 04:14)
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Author: Ursa
Date: 2015-12-09 03:43
Ravi, in response to your mouthpiece question:
1. As mentioned above, don't tinker with your setup right before a big audition.
2. You could try an inexpensive Brilhart Ebolin mouthpiece with a 5 (without a star) facing and use that to explore the possibilities of a more open mouthpiece that'll take all the air you can put into it. Cover the white bite plate with a black mouthpiece patch so it won't be obvious that you're using a non-classical mouthpiece.
3. You will likely discover that for jazz, pep band, and marching band, it will be great fun to use a setup like this. Like a tenor sax, you can just stick it in your face and blow--loudly enough to keep up with the most obnoxious trumpeter!
4. However, for concert band and orchestra, it won't make articulating any easier--plus you'll have to listen to yourself very carefully and utilize more precise embouchure control to maintain accurate pitch. Your section mates and director could be treated to some painfully flat altissimo notes while you're figuring out how to deploy this setup.
5. If your little voice is by now telling you that this may not be such a good idea, listen to your little voice.
6. If you try the Ebolin 5 anyway and find out that you wish you could keep most of the wide-open blow and wonderful projection of the Brilhart without giving up much of the articulation ease and pitch control of a classical mouthpiece, try a Vandoren B45.
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Author: Ravi2000
Date: 2015-12-09 04:41
I've been using a Selmer Student Model for the past six years, only a month or two ago did my parents finally invest in a Pro Yamaha. I've used a Rico Reserve X10 mouthpiece for the past 5 years or so. It isn't the horn, I promise. It's like playing a stick of butter, I love it. I'm using Vandoren Blue Box #3s and the mouthpiece has a 1.1 mm tip.
Does any of this change or reinforce the above statements?
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Author: Philip Caron
Date: 2015-12-09 05:30
I agree with the suggestions to select tempos that allow you to play the music well. In addition, keep in mind that most music can be effective at a range of tempos, and how effective it is depends on the musicianship of the performer. There are many examples of great musicians choosing slower tempi than usual and making great music still. An example that comes to mind is pianist Wilhelm Kempff playing Beethoven sonatas; he perhaps had a "smaller" technique than some of his contemporaries, but his playing of that music is pure magic.
So in the Weber, ask yourself what the music in question ought to do, what is important about the various passages, what will communicate to the listener, what will bring it to life. Then conceive how you can make those things happen. A little contrast here, a little emphasis there, dynamics, style, mood, etc. You can find answers at a slower than showy tempo. You can make it sound sprightly and fleet and light and effervescent even at moderato. If you do a few musical things clearly, the listeners / judges will be appreciative, and metronome speed will lose relevance.
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