 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: drews1949
Date: 2011-05-18 16:42
Tom Ridenour makes a very compelling argument with regards to his professional line of clarinets. This prices are amazing - a professional Bb and A for about $1,000 and $1,200, respectively. His points are made very clear on his website, but how do the instruments really perform? Do they measure up with the other top-of-the-line instruments on the market?
DS
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Author: SteveG_CT
Date: 2011-05-18 17:17
They are excellent as far as intonation and tone go. The main complaint I've heard is that the material the keys are made from is on the soft side and as a result it can be more difficult to keep in regulation.
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Author: JJAlbrecht
Date: 2011-05-18 18:25
What Steve said. Some of the keys bend easily if you drop the horn or knock it over, but otherwise, they are great instruments. I had the 576 BC Bb instrument, and it played great for me! Intonation and tone were almost perfect. I did NOT like the mp he shipped with it. Others have tried the piece with similar reactions.
Jeff
“Everyone discovers their own way of destroying themselves, and some people choose the clarinet.” Kalman Opperman, 1919-2010
"A drummer is a musician's best friend."
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2011-05-18 18:59
Tom Ridenour's clarinets have had a mixed reception on the board. Some players love them and prefer them over all others. Some players don't like them at all.
There were complaints about durability and quality control on earlier models, but these seem to have been solved, at least for the Bb and A clarinets that he has personally adjusted. His bass clarinets haven't been discussed recently, but there were many complaints.
A larger question is Tom's design philosophy. He strongly prefers a clarinet with a very even response and tone that can be played without embouchure adjustment. All Ridenour-designed clarinets I've tried had had excellent intonation and a perfectly even scale. For me, though, the improvements have come at the expense of stuffiness, high resistance and inflexibility. This is entirely a matter of personal preference. After all, Larry Combs plays wonderfully on Leblanc Opus clarinets, which Tom designed.
Some of it is about mouthpieces and reeds. I prefer a slightly open lay and medium-soft reeds. Tom prefers a close lay and harder reeds, and he is dismissive of those who don't step up and push against the resistance.
For more, see http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/read.html?f=1&i=324049&t=323764 and http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/read.html?f=1&i=26326&t=26308.
For a discussion of variations and styles of blowing see http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/read.html?f=1&i=178610&t=178489.
Ken Shaw
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Author: clarinetcase
Date: 2011-05-18 21:55
I own a set of Ridenour Lyrique clarinets. I purchased them for outoor concerts and when I play places with temperature problems, little heat in winter, no air conditioning in the summer. I use the Bb a lot. The A receives occasional use which makes it perfect for my needs. Both have good intonation and sound beautiful. I use a Grabner mouthpiece with a Rovner ligature. I have received many unsolicited compliments on my sound when playing his instruments. I had a low budget and not much money for repairs, so these are perfect for me. I am an amateur who returned to playing after 25+ years of not playing. However, I did play professionally in my local area when I was much younger.
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Author: Bobby McClellan
Date: 2011-05-19 03:12
I have 2 of his horns, The basset A and the BBb Contra. Both of which play quite well and intonation is great. The Basset I just do not get much time to play around on to ger used to the fingerings to the low C. The BBb contra has become my main instrument. I hope he puts them in to actual production. I think they would serve people well as an "auxillary" horn for people that cannot shell out the $$ for a Leblan or Selmer contra.
Bobby M. McClellan
Flowood, MS
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Author: Barry Vincent
Date: 2011-05-19 07:47
I have the Bb Lyrique RCP 576 BC "Professional" and it has an excellent tone & intonation but the keywork is not very ergonomic if that's the correct word. However I don't find that the keywork is 'soft' and it stays in adjustment quite well. I also find that this Clarinet is reasonably easy to 'blow'. I use one of TR's mouthpieces on it , the Eroica but it also responds quite well with the usual Vandoran mouthpieces. It came with two fat barrels , a 65 mm and a 64 mm but later on I ordered a 63 mm as well which is about the shortest that can be used and is handy when using one of the 13 series Vandorans.
It is my favourite Clarinet.
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Author: Bob Phillips
Date: 2011-05-21 04:06
I recently added a Lyrique A to my tool set.
I pretty much like it. The scale is pretty even, but NOT better than my Buffet RC Bb.
The key material is not fragile, and is not easily bent.
The regulation was disappointing in light of the raves that the instrument receives for careful set-up. I spent a couple of weeks adjusting cork cushion thickness and bending (not easily) a few of the keys. It has been tough to get a good compromise between intonation and stuffiness.
The side trill keys (on the A, I have not touched a Bb) are highly curved on their bottom side. Those graceful shapes gave me a lot of problems by causing the trill keys to bang on the Bb/Eb sliver key, the C#/G# left pinky key and the bridge mechanism. One example: trilling Ab/Bb in the clarion caused the two moving keys to click together.
The left hand C,C# keys LIFT their right hand mates --a much better mechanization than Buffet's infamous pinned connection.
The register key touch wraps around and lies close to the thumb ring. It is really handy --but it is so different from the Buffet's conventional design that, when I loaned it to a symphony player for a try-out and got it back a week later, I found myself "leaking" the reg key all over again--as I did for the first few days I had it.
My pro friends very much like the Lyrique's sound.
From the player's end, using my well-developed Lee Livengood faced Vandoren M30/13, things are not so wonderful. The response is very nice, and the altissimo register is so easily accessible that I'll use the Lyrique for unaccompanied solos that run into the high notes.
But, it feels as though the horn has a muffler on it. I have yet to test it in a large hall, but it doesn't feel like it has the punch needed to carry to the back wall.
I think it is a good deal, a very good deal; and I'd recommend it over undertaking the search-for and re-building of a used Buffet A.
Bob Phillips
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Author: feadog79
Date: 2011-05-21 14:20
I've had my Lyrique Bb for about three years now. I've never had a problem with the keywork; nothing has needed adjustment for the time I've had the instrument so far. Intonation is good, and the scale is very even.
The instrument does have a different response than the R13 I used to play on. I have received nothing but positive compliments regarding my tone, however. I don't think that there's been a problem with projection, either. I played "Fiddler On The Roof" this spring, and no one had a problem hearing me.
I definitely did NOT like the mouthpiece that came with the instrument; I played it once, put it in a drawer, and forgot about it. The Grabner K13 seems to be a perfect fit for me with the Lyrique.
Joe W.
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Author: GLHopkins
Date: 2011-05-21 20:24
I have one of Tom's C clarinets, and I'm pretty impressed by it. Granted it is only a toy for me, but I can see where this clarinet could be played in a professional situation without having to worry.
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Author: Claire Annette
Date: 2011-05-22 00:18
The last I had read on his site, Ridenour was promoting the Arioso Cs. I e-mailed him two or three weeks ago with questions but still haven't heard back from him.
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Author: JJAlbrecht
Date: 2011-05-23 22:03
Call the number on his site. He's usually quick on response to e-mails, but it may have been lost.
Jeff
“Everyone discovers their own way of destroying themselves, and some people choose the clarinet.” Kalman Opperman, 1919-2010
"A drummer is a musician's best friend."
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Author: Bobby McClellan
Date: 2011-05-24 22:28
Claire,
Let us knwo what you find out about his Ariso C clarinets.
Bobby M. McClellan
Flowood, MS
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Author: drews1949
Date: 2011-05-24 23:56
I ordered an Arioso Bb a few days ago. I would have ordered an A as well, but they are out of stock until "mid-June" as I was told. They commented that the Ariosos are just names, and that they are all set up by TR, and are exactly the same as the Lyrique. They explained that the Ariosos were machined by another company, and purchased and set up by TR, when he left that company, he purchased all their Ariosos when they subsequently went out of business. I'm very curious how the whole line of instruments will compare with my set of Greenline Toscas.
DS
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Author: grenadilla428
Date: 2011-05-27 15:13
I play-tested the Lyrique for about a week.
I tried it out in the practice room and in orchestra rehearsals. I played it back-to-back with my current instrument, playing scales, exercises, and excerpts on one, then the other. I let a seasoned colleague try it in ww sectional - he thought it was a good instrument but didn't seem enamored with it. I even set up a blind listening test where I played the same etude and excerpts on both instruments for a listener.
The result: my instrument and the Lyrique sounded about the same.
The conclusion: For someone looking to purchase their first pro-quality instrument, the Lyrique may be an excellent choice, but you should try it first. I've recommended it to students, and at least one actually went with it. For someone looking to purchase a second instrument (back-up for repairs, outdoor instrument, etc.), it's an excellent choice.
In my case, I was looking at possibly replacing my pro-quality instruments with something different, and with my very modest budget, I was not willing to pay for an instrument that I and the listener found to be about the same as my current instrument. It would have been a lateral move.
That being said, it played well and sounded very even.
On a side note, the register key felt rather awkward for me. I wonder if he'll consider offering a standard register key rather than the ergonomic one.
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Author: feadog79
Date: 2011-05-27 17:05
The register key felt very, very awkward to me at first. I considered replacing it with a standard key, but never did. I got used to it eventually, but it WAS irritating when I first got the instrument. I don't think the "ergonomic" key is really beneficial...just different. I can play just fine with the key now, but it would make much more sense to have a regular key to begin with.
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Author: Bob Bernardo
Date: 2011-05-28 03:51
I tried his A clarinet and it played very well in tune. It is simply amazing that a horn can play so well in tune.
If I wasn't trying to match it to the Buffet Bb, I would have bought it without a second thought.
He is a really nice man and will try anything to make every player happy. It's by far the best professional clarinet, based on price. You can buy an A, Bb, C, and maybe an Eb for the price of a Buffet Tosca. Don't forget, he also makes some killer mouthpieces to match his horns.
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Author: Kontra
Date: 2011-05-30 19:11
There's no doubting his clarinets... Excellent quality and a great price. I also got to hear a Lyrique bass at an honour band I played at and it sounded nice.
But you have to ask yourself something. Why is he SO against wood? He's written an article or two on the inferiority of wood. Has he felt this way the entire time he's played clarinet? Has he always felt like wood was holding him back? Or has he felt that way since he started selling hard rubber clarinets? But hey, he could have honestly tried them and liked them more than grenadilla. But he constantly promotes hard rubber over all others, and I've even heard customers talk of him telling them that their R13 is junk. And now he's about to offer wood clarinets, after all that? I don't know, it all just seems a little weird to me. I cant wait to try out his wood ones though. If they're anything like the Lyrique, they're worth trying out.
Post Edited (2011-05-31 03:13)
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Author: JJAlbrecht
Date: 2011-05-30 20:37
Actually thereare several possibilities.
First off, when Tom was at Leblanc, it might be that they were unwilling to make top-line clarinets out of anything but wood. They caould get much more money for one in grenadilla or rosewood, than for a clarinet made of hard rubber, given hte attitudes of many prospective buyers, who "grew up" believing wood was the only way to go.
This might also explain his venturing into a wooden model htese days.THere are any number of people who simply refuse to believe a hard rubber clarinet can perform as well as a more expensive, wooden one. THis may be a way to market clarinets, using his designs, to those who have been resistant to his other models,
I am speaking purely on speculation. I have no firm info from Tom Ridenour about any of this, and it just a guess on my part. I do admit to being a satisfied customer, and have owned a Lyrique 576 bc.
Jeff
“Everyone discovers their own way of destroying themselves, and some people choose the clarinet.” Kalman Opperman, 1919-2010
"A drummer is a musician's best friend."
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Author: Kontra
Date: 2011-05-31 01:19
I do believe he is making the wood ones because of some people's ignorance toward hard rubber, to expand his market. I'm just saying it seems a little weird that he would talk so bad about wood, then market it. But I do think thats why he is. Will he still keep up the Grenadilla myth?
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Author: drews1949
Date: 2011-05-31 01:24
Where is the information that he is producing wooden clarinets now? It's not on his website, and I spoke to one of his employees only about 10 days ago and he didn't mention it.
DS
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Author: Kontra
Date: 2011-05-31 02:36
Tom's video on "How to assemble a clarinet."
Cut to around 5:00 is where he mentions the wood clarinet he will be marketing.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=90OyOdS7MAA
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Author: Kontra
Date: 2011-05-31 03:36
I look forward to trying them out. Maybe he'll sell a few of the prototypes like he did his Contra.
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Author: SteveG_CT
Date: 2011-05-31 05:45
DavidBlumberg wrote:
> He's a great designer, the Wooden Prototype has metal protective rings on
> each end - that's a great feature.
In the comments section below the video he says:
"Metal end caps are a dumb idea. I said the clarinet was a prototype. In the production model I asked they be omitted. "
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Author: Kontra
Date: 2011-05-31 16:07
He just replied to my email and said his wood model will be for sale within the next 3 weeks, and his Contra hopefully in the fall.
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Author: Bobby McClellan
Date: 2011-05-31 21:20
I am glad to know that he is moving ahead with the contra, I have the prototype and it has been a solid instrument.
Bobby
Bobby M. McClellan
Flowood, MS
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Author: drews1949
Date: 2011-05-31 21:36
I wonder how much he will charge for the contra, speaking of which.
DS
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Author: Kontra
Date: 2011-05-31 22:46
I don't know for sure, but when he advertised the prototypes on his website I think he said he envisioned the sales price at somewhere around $4000. Hopefully it will be less...
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Author: Bobby McClellan
Date: 2011-05-31 23:46
I remember the same thing that the contra would retail for about 4000.00. Still not too bad of a price. remember that it is a 2 piece straight body as opposed to the Vito/leblanc plastic that is a 1 piece straight body.
Bobby M. McClellan
Flowood, MS
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Author: Kontra
Date: 2011-06-01 08:51
Yes, but it's still $300 more than the LeBlanc, and people usually buy the paperclips anyway. But who knows, he may sell a lot of them. That's just way out of my price range.
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Author: Claire Annette
Date: 2011-06-01 16:23
I received an e-mail response from Ridenour regarding the availability of the Arioso C special that had been announced on his site:
"We ran out of Arioso C's about a month ago. The Lyrique C should be back in stock in about six weeks."
For what it's worth, there are at least eight of his clarinets that are owned by people in my town:
One C (an instructor)
One Bb (a university saxophonist)
One Bb (a med student's)
Bb (three of our community band clarinetists, including me)
Bb (two of my own students)
Every one of us is very pleased with them.
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Author: cxl
Date: 2014-06-04 19:10
Early 576 BC weaknesses should be improved?
I heard libertas is excellent.
les.cxl@gmail.com
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Author: cxl
Date: 2014-06-07 20:29
576 BC which year was the first to start selling?
les.cxl@gmail.com
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Author: Tom Ridenour
Date: 2014-06-07 21:52
Late 2005 or early in 2006.....without referencing our records that's the best answer I can offer.
Ted Ridenour
Ridenour Clarinet Products,
rclarinetproducts.com
sales@ridenourclarinetproducts.com
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Author: Klarnetisto
Date: 2014-06-17 21:48
Tom, has the Ridenour company any plans to make more contra clarinets?
Klarnetisto
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Author: Barry Vincent
Date: 2014-06-18 02:27
cxl
"Early 576 BC weaknesses should be improved?
What were those weaknesses ? I have a 576BC and am not aware of any.
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Author: Tom Ridenour
Date: 2014-06-18 19:26
Contra clarinets? It's possible but I can't say when and it's not definite either. If we do produce one it will be a BBb.
Ted R.
Ridenour Clarinet Products,
rclarinetproducts.com
sales@ridenourclarinetproducts.com
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Author: sistaskriket
Date: 2015-05-05 16:58
I own several clarinets, LeBlanc Sonata, Buffet E13, LeBlanc Cadenza Backun and since a year ago also the Ridenour Lyrique 576. I am sorry to say that it has not become my best friend, not by far. I prefer all the other clarinets and use the Lyrique only for homework practice and outdoor playing.
Why is that: IMHO the springs are much more resistant than on the other clarinets wich makes it more difficult to play. But worst of all is the throut tone Bb when fingered with any of the lower joint holes. It sounds bad if it sounds at all, very different from any of my other clarinets.
If there are any adjustments to correct this I would be very grateful to know.
Best regards
HB
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2015-05-05 18:15
The springs are easy to adjust. If you don't feel comfortable about doing it yourself, any repair shop can do it. I prefer my springs as light as possible.
The fact that the throat Bb sometimes doesn't sound at all is almost certainly due to fluff or crud in the register vent tube. Take the register key off and run a dampened pipe cleaner through it until it's clean.
The throat Bb is bad on all clarinets. To the standard fingering, try adding your two ring fingers and the low F key with your right little finger.
Ken Shaw
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Author: Johan H Nilsson
Date: 2015-05-05 21:11
It might not be the springs that need adjustment but the pillars that are pointing in the wrong direction. Then the pivot screws will be misaligned too and the keywork stiff and uneven. I had to adjust two lower joint pillars on a 576B I bought second hand.
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Author: dibble
Date: 2015-05-05 23:47
For me, my Lyrique has nice action but I can't get past the weakness of the lower register. Tom wrote that he favored the "solo" register over the low notes. I can see the reasoning behind that but the lowest part of the horn is one of my favorite parts. Leslie Craven puts a wooden barrel and bell on his lyrique to increase the sonority of the lower register. I just tend to reach for my wooden horns for this reason. I do, however, like the lyrique for playing outside because of the material's stability. Just my experience....
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Author: TomS
Date: 2015-05-06 03:57
The Lyrique Libertas has good center and growl in the lower register, but perhaps not as much as some other designs ... I think some of the sonority was forfeited in exchange for much better tuning, (e.g. the low F is not flat, at all).
Hard rubber is less dense and lighter than Blackwood, and this partially accounts for the warmer sound with less edge. A heavy wooden bell might add some additional center and ring to the low register. Remember that the Ridenour bells are carefully designed to match the overall acoustics, so beware if you purchase a Backun (or any other) bell. I think it's crazy that a bell costs 70% the price of a RCP-576bc!
My "pinch B-flat" is less fuzzy on my Lyrique clarinets than any other clarinets I own or have played. On any note lasting over 1/2 second, I use resonance fingerings anyway ... you must have a mis-adjustment or some crud in a tone hole ...
The Lyrique Libertas has locked key posts, so any turning and binding is eliminated in this design.
You will notice that some current student to semi-pro clarinets produced in wood, have no locked key posts! I guess if the posts are threaded and have a drop of Locktite applied, they should stay in place ... but that's a cheap way to go.
Tom
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Author: GLHopkins
Date: 2015-05-06 06:37
Are there any world-class clarinet soloists playing Lyrique clarinets? I've seen that Leslie Craven has given the Lyrique good reviews, but he plays Leblanc last I heard. He may have moved to Backun.
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Author: TomS
Date: 2015-05-06 21:47
I've had a suspicion that the Ridenour and Backun designs share some great playing characteristics ... since many that played and loved the Leblanc Concerto and Opus now play Backun.
I think you will find quite of few "world class" clarinetists playing Tom's horns, at least part time. You might find many more "world class" musicians playing his stuff, if he had them produced in France, tripled the price, called hard rubber "wood", and payed for endorsements. His "C" clarinet is especially well used professionally.
IMHO, sometimes I think there is only a nickels worth of difference between "world class" and some amazing workaday musicians, hidden in smaller orchestras and institutions of learning.
Tom
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Author: TomS
Date: 2015-05-08 22:14
Yeah ... I wonder if it was premature for Tom to discontinue his G1? According to Ted Ridenour, they sold a hundred rubber horns for each wooden one ... just not enough interest. A shame!
Tom
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Author: KenJarczyk
Date: 2015-05-08 23:04
I may not be "World Famous" or even "World Infamous" but I do get around! Played all over this World of ours, from Beijing to LA to NY, I stay quite busy, and my first grab for a clarinet is the Ridenour Libertas. Got to say I really like that horn! Absolutely in love with his C clarinet, too!
Ken Jarczyk
Woodwinds Specialist
Eb, C, Bb, A & Bass Clarinets
Soprano, Alto, Tenor & Baritone Saxophones
Flute, Alto Flute, Piccolo
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Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2015-05-10 22:32
The G1 felt like playing on a really good German Clarinet. Like it even more than Wenzel Fuchs Clarinet, but then again, I don't play his system.
Big finger stretch too on his Clarinet!! (Yes, he handed it to me to play).
http://www.SkypeClarinetLessons.com
Post Edited (2017-03-09 20:31)
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Author: seabreeze
Date: 2015-05-11 05:45
The finger stretch (especially in the right hand) on the Oehlers is a lot like the finger stretch on the simpler Albert system that was popular among the old New Orleans jazz players. I tried to play an Albert in high school but my hand rebelled and I settled on the much more comfortable (for me) Boehm.
If Ridenour's G1 plays that close to a good Oehler, maybe he should try re-marketing it as "the nearest you'll get to the German sound on a Boehm." Considering all the American players who love the German sound but don't want to be bothered with the Oehler keywork and the very high price of a really good Oehler, there should be a firm market niche for something like the G1. It would be interesting to compare a G1 to the new Uebel Boehms, especially the Uebel Superior model.
Post Edited (2015-05-11 09:10)
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Author: KenJarczyk
Date: 2015-05-12 18:24
One probably can always aquire a Ridenour wood horn on E-Bay, only they're called Opus and Concerto horns by LeBlanc!
Ken Jarczyk
Woodwinds Specialist
Eb, C, Bb, A & Bass Clarinets
Soprano, Alto, Tenor & Baritone Saxophones
Flute, Alto Flute, Piccolo
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Author: Merlin_Williams
Date: 2015-05-13 12:17
I'm using my Ridenour Lyrique on a cruise ship gig right now. The intonation is far better than anything else I've tried - and it handles the extremes in temperature and humidity without causing me any worry about the possibility of cracks. I played a set on the pool deck in 40C temps, then a set on an air conditioned stage at 20C on the same day.
Jupiter Canada Artist/Clinician
Stratford Shakespeare Festival musician
Woodwind Doubling Channel Creator on YouTube https://www.youtube.com/c/WoodwindDoubling
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Author: sistaskriket
Date: 2017-03-09 18:48
Hi, funny how one can change ones mind .
When I bought the Lyriqye a year ago, Tom ensured me that in a couple of month the Lyrique would become my favorite clarinet among all my clarinets.
In the beginning I was not happy at all with the Lyrique.
Now one year later it is the only clarinet I play :-)
All the other clarinets are stuck in their cases. Even the Backun Protegé. And my Buffet E13 is sold.
So my advice: Give your new Lyrique some time to become your friend. It will be your best friend after a while.
Best Regards
Sistaskriket
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Author: CapnCheapo
Date: 2017-03-11 03:55
I've had the Lyrique C for about 5 years which gets used in symphony more than I would have expected. I've owned a Lyrique Bb since January that I use as a backup/outdoor horn. I will say I am not a fan of how they are initially setup-- both instruments arrived with leaks, wildly uneven spring tension erring on the side of way too tight, and some tuning problems.
However, after good overhauls by my local tech I wouldn't hesitate to use either in any situation. In that price range you really can't go wrong. Unfortunately there are techs who refuse to work on them, including my "main guy"...
Post Edited (2017-03-11 04:08)
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Author: seabreeze
Date: 2017-03-11 04:32
With Ridenour it is always fun to take the long view and look at a variety of his designs. There will always be some players who prefer Ridenour's older wooden clarinet models for Leblanc. With the Esprit, Sonata, Ambience, Infinite, Opus, Concerto and more, there's lots to choose from and compare. Each of these has its own strengths and personality. Any of them might be a good buy in a used clarinet if the price is right and they are in good condition. The Infinite and the Ambiance, for example, have more of a centered somewhat brighter sound than the Lyrique.
Post Edited (2017-03-11 06:53)
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The Clarinet Pages
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