 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: JJAlbrecht
Date: 2011-03-07 16:21
These bozos are going to destroy the DSO.
I spoke with a member of the orchestra this weekend. In addition to the percussion section leaving en masse, a number of the core string players were not at concerts this weekend, because they were in Chicahgo and Cleveland, auditioning for places in those orchestras.
(Mis) Management will not be happy until they destroy the entire ensemble.
Jwff
“Everyone discovers their own way of destroying themselves, and some people choose the clarinet.” Kalman Opperman, 1919-2010
"A drummer is a musician's best friend."
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Author: clarinetwife
Date: 2011-03-07 19:24
Perhaps someone could clarify -- is there usually a mechanism spelled out in the CBA between the union and the orchestra about how and when a situation goes into arbitration?
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Author: clarinetist04
Date: 2011-03-07 21:28
Is it possible that the orchestra is so bankrupt that they don't stand a chance of making it out of their debt even with binding arbitration?
i.e. maybe income is down so much with the collapse of Detroit that even paying the players a passable wage is impossible. Could that be it?
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Author: JJAlbrecht
Date: 2011-03-07 22:09
Anne Parsons, the head of the executive board, is still pulling in around $300K a year, abndshe isn't managing the Orchestra at the moment, as there IS no orchestra! If they want to save some bucks,they should stop paying her!
Part of the problem was the way they mismanaged their money. Example: THey raised X millions of dollars to renovate Orchestra Hall, which would have been sufficient. Instead, they went into hock for a ton more money to add to the building, turning it into the Max Fisher Center. They never had enough money for that, but they ordered the construction to start before the economic downturn began,and donations never caught up with the debt. Should the musicians suffer for bad decisions of the management? They should have been trying to find more major donors over the past couple of years, but their development department is pretty abysmal.
Jeff
“Everyone discovers their own way of destroying themselves, and some people choose the clarinet.” Kalman Opperman, 1919-2010
"A drummer is a musician's best friend."
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2011-03-07 22:47
JJAlbrecht wrote:
> Example: THey raised X millions of dollars to renovate
> Orchestra Hall, which would have been sufficient. Instead,
> they went into hock for a ton more money to add to the
> building, turning it into the Max Fisher Center. They never
> had enough money for that, but they ordered the construction to
> start before the economic downturn began,and donations never
> caught up with the debt. Should the musicians suffer for bad
> decisions of the management? They should have been trying to
> find more major donors over the past couple of years, but their
> development department is pretty abysmal.
>
> Jeff
>
Us Americans spending more than we make? Overspending a budget? Going into debt? Are you SURE that's what happened cause that doesn't sound like us....
Alexi
US Army Japan Band
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Author: JJAlbrecht
Date: 2011-03-07 22:52
I know, Alexi...I found it almost impossible to believe, myself!
Jeff
“Everyone discovers their own way of destroying themselves, and some people choose the clarinet.” Kalman Opperman, 1919-2010
"A drummer is a musician's best friend."
Post Edited (2011-03-07 22:52)
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2011-03-08 00:20
Lelia -
It wasn't Bogie. It was Claude Rains as Captain Renault:
Rick: How can you close me up? On what grounds?
Captain Renault: I'm shocked, shocked to find that gambling is going on in here!
[a croupier hands Renault a pile of money]
Croupier: Your winnings, sir.
Captain Renault: [sotto voce] Oh, thank you very much.
[aloud] Everybody out at once!
Ken Shaw
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Author: clarinetguy ★2017
Date: 2011-03-08 01:00
I think JJAlbrecht is right, but I'd like to add one detail. If I'm not mistaken, they had all or most of the money they needed for the Orchestra Hall addition. However, management stupidly decided not to use all of the funds they had for the project, and they decided to invest the rest. Bad decision! Here's a link to the whole story:
http://www.detroitsymphonymusicians.org/themaxthemax.html
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2011-03-08 01:29
The stupidity in investing is based on 20-20 hindsight. If the funds hadn't been invested and the market had continued to boom we'd be talkimg about the mis-management of the funds and all the money that could have been made.
At this point the banks who guaranteed the bonds are ready to call their loan back. If that happens the orchestra as I know it in my home town will be gone, and it will take a long time to get something back to replace it.
-
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Author: Lelia Loban ★2017
Date: 2011-03-08 12:52
Ken Shaw wrote,
>>It wasn't Bogie. It was Claude Rains as Captain Renault:>>
Thanks for the correction -- and I call myself a movie critic! Yeesh.
But seriously, moving from Casablanca to Titipu, this whole mess looks as if it belongs in an alternate universe. "Here's a pretty how-de-do," only in the latest version from Detroit, Ko-Ko cuts his own head off, Yum-Yum gets buried alive, Katisha marries the Mikado, Pooh-Bah arrests himself, Nanki-Poo wanders off looking for a job as a singing waiter and when the operetta gets made into a movie, it's a slasher flick. Topsy-turvy.
Hey, boys and girls! Don't miss the thrilling sequel, coming soon to a concert hall near you! Nurses will be standing by in the lobby in case you FAINT FROM FRIGHT!
Lelia
http://www.scoreexchange.com/profiles/Lelia_Loban
To hear the audio, click on the "Scorch Plug-In" box above the score.
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Author: DougR
Date: 2011-03-08 14:32
The link from Clarinetguy is important reading, but I'm not smart enough to figure out from that account whether there's actual villainy involved, or merely hapless, credulous amateurism that placed too much faith in outside advisors, or what. There certainly was some sort of fever going around the financial community in the early to mid '00s that turned regular people into riverboat gamblers, but i have a feeling there's a lot more to the story.
The thing that seems clear to me is that "management" is out of credible ideas, and is looking to the orchestra players to bail them out. Were I in that position, I'd be reluctant to show my face in public, let alone draw down $300k a year.
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2011-03-08 15:02
This post was premature; the reports out of a rejection by the DSO is INCORRECT.
Talks are still going on; one board member rejected the proposal, not the entire board.
Nothing is a done deal yet.
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Author: clarinetwife
Date: 2011-03-08 16:02
DougR makes a good point about the atmosphere a few years ago. I have two family members who serve or have served on boards for various nonprofits (not musical -- school, church, environmental). When big plans involving big debt arose, one of them was the only one to express concern and vote against the plan. Being proved correct is cold vindication in a situation like that. The DSO situation just sound like a colossal mess.
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