 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: MarlboroughMan
Date: 2010-03-30 18:57
Does anyone else out there play on Fritz Wurlitzer clarinets? I've had a set for 25 years or so, when I played them in youth symphony. I switched to Buffets in college, for the usual professional reasons, but am finally switching back.
I'd be interested in hearing from anyone who has experience playing these remarkable instruments. So far I've been really enjoying the process.
Eric
******************************
The Jazz Clarinet
http://thejazzclarinet.blogspot.com/
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Author: RoBass
Date: 2010-03-30 20:30
Dear MarlboroughMan: If you repeat this question inside the www.klarinette24.de/forum it will be answered quickly. There are some more experienced Wurlitzer-players...
kindly
Roman
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Author: kenb
Date: 2010-03-31 01:26
Don't play them myself, but a friend did, and preferred them to his Herbert Wurlitzer Reforms.
Luigi Magistrelli plays Fritz W. Reform-Boehms - search youtube for a double concerto (clar.& flute). He also wrote a history of the Schmidt-Kolbe/Wurlitzer RB and German System clarinets for a recent issue of The Clarinet.
Post Edited (2010-03-31 22:01)
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Author: Hansdenijs
Date: 2010-04-13 19:05
Attachment: Reform Boehm history 2.jpg (274k)
I can recommend the earlier mentioned article about the history of the Schmidt Reform-Böhm system, free available as PDF on the site from Luigi Magistrelli http://www.luigimagistrelli.it/ under "interviews and articles".
A lot of my research results has been used in this article, published in "The Clarinet"
I'm playing a Fritz Wurlitzer set Reform-Böhm clarinets, made in 1964 as well as a lot of other Frit Wurlitzer clarinets in german sustems from E-flat till Bass clarinet. All his instruments in my possession are still of a very high quality in all aspects.
If you have specific questions about Frit Wurlitzer or his instruments I will try to answer you.
Hans de Nijs from Holland
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Author: MarlboroughMan
Date: 2010-04-13 19:33
Hans de Nijs,
Many thanks for responding. I'm playing on a pair of Fritz Wurlitzer Reform-Boehms (A&Bb) made c. 1952, and they are beautiful. They've been in my possession for about 25 years, but were in a state of considerable disrepair until I sent them to Neustadt in January. I've had them back for about a month now.
And thanks for the link above; I read it with great interest a couple of weeks ago.
Thanks,
Eric
******************************
The Jazz Clarinet
http://thejazzclarinet.blogspot.com/
Post Edited (2012-03-23 14:19)
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Author: Hansdenijs
Date: 2010-04-14 07:13
If you forward me the serialnumbers I can give you the precise year of manufacturing. Fritz Wurlitzer clarinets were the main choice of professional clarinettists from 1938 till about 1970 in the Netherlands. (Royal Concertebouw Orchestra etc.) Before 1960: mainly Schmidt-Kolbe system (principals e.g. Bram de Wilde, Jan Koene, Piet Honingh, later on with the start of Georg Pieterson as principal: Reform-Böhm from Fritz Wurlitzer). With the start of Fritz's son Herbert Wurlitzer after his removal to Western Germany (Bubenreuth and later Neustadt/Aisch) the younger generation in the Netherlands choosed for Herbert Wurlitzer R-B clarinets. It was in those days difficult to buy still clarinets from Fritz, who stayed in Erlbach till his death (Eastern Germany).
Nowadays R-B clarinets from Fritz in good conditions are scarce and very sought.
The top instruments of all famous German brands can be played for more generations if well maintained. For instance i'm playing a set original Oskar Oehler clarinets made in 1922, which are played for more than 40 (!) years by the pricipal of the Berliner Philharmoniker before Karl Leister (Alfred Bürkner). The same is valid for Fritz Wurlitzer soloist clarinetsfor which top quality wood and handforked mechanism was used.
At this monet I know about three professional clarinetttist in Holland which still use Fritz Wurlitzer R-B clarinets. The best known international soloist is Luigi Magistrelli (already earlier mentioned in this thread).
Fritz Wurlitzer has made about 2740 clarinets embossed with serial number.
He has made R-B clarinets during his whole active period (1936- 1974) in all pitches. The early ones have a wide bore diameter of 15,2 mm and asks for special mouthpieces. Later the bore diameter was diminished, about 14,8 mm). This kind of instruments can be played with modern mouthpieces e.g. Zinner with Viotto facing R N1 or R G3.
The percentage of R-B clarinets was about 15 % of his output, mainly for the Netherlands and Great Britain. He has made also few real Boehm system clarinets for export, but this type was by my knowledge not on the same level as the Reform-Böhm and Schmidt-Kolbe (soloist) clarinets.
greeting from Holland
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Author: MarlboroughMan
Date: 2010-04-14 10:35
Hans de Nijs,
Thank you for this fantastic information! Would you kindly contact me by email? I would then send you the serial numbers--and ask a few more questions.
THANK YOU AGAIN,
Eric
Cleveland, Ohio
******************************
The Jazz Clarinet
http://thejazzclarinet.blogspot.com/
Post Edited (2012-03-23 14:19)
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Author: spage
Date: 2010-04-15 09:34
Hans de Nijs,
I'm just wondering if you could date, or know someone who could, a pair of Schmidt-Kolbe system instruments. The Bb is marked
Schmidt // Mannheim
Wurlitzer // Fritz // Erlbach
also, to one side, D.R.G.M., and it also has most of the serial number.
The A just
Schmidt // D.R.G.M // Mannheim
They have some differences in the mechanism; I would be happy to take some photographs if you would like. I would really like to know more about them!
Thanks.
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Author: Hansdenijs
Date: 2010-04-15 19:21
Attachment: FW SK 454455 Ab Klein Haneveld 22.JPG (424k)
To give you precise information I need good photos. For this moment I can tell you that your instruments were made by Fritz Wurlitzer/Erlbach at the beginning of his career. The stamp of Ernst Schmidt / Mannheim indicates that he has finally tuned and controlled the instrument. The stamp of Fritz Wurlitzer was normally embossed on the bell, mostly with serial number (3 positions) and year of production (till 1941), the instruments were equipped mostly with a hole through the bell for the low E. Instruments from this period are very wide bored (15,2 mm) and needs special (cylindric bored) mouthpieces. So your instruments are made between 1936 and 1941. D.R.G.M. stands for Deutsches Reich Gebrauchsmuster (German Reich Registered Design). It stands for the Schmidt-Kolbe system patent.
I hope that this information is interesting for you.
greeting from Holland
Hans
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Author: spage
Date: 2010-04-16 09:32
Hi Hans,
Many thanks, that is very useful. I will try and get some good photographs and let you know then. Yes, both instruments have the vent hole in the bell and through the tenon of the bottom joint. With the Bb the Fritz Wurlitzer stamp is on both the bell and the top joint. There has been some damage, and what looks like sanding, to the wood on the bell so I am not sure whether the numbers are 2 sets of three or a set of two then a set of three. What I can see is
19[?]
304
where the [?] is the damaged area that may have another number in it - if so my guess would be a 3 or a 5. I have tried to get the alignment of the numbers nearly right.
I can't see any numbers on the A. The Schmidt stamp on that is somewhat different from the photo you attached (which looks like it has been overstamped?), as the D.R.G.M. is in the centre of the stamp.
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Author: Hansdenijs
Date: 2010-04-16 11:47
Attachment: FW Reform_Böhm AB 1941 04a.JPG (236k)
Attachment: FW Bas lage D 1938 07.jpg (47k)
I'm interested in your photos for my archive. Based on your information i can inform you that the clarinet with serialnumber 304 has been made in or around 1940. The D.R.G.M. stamp was a seperate one. it is used between the text Smidt and Mannheim, but also under this stam or beside it. (n the photo of my previous e-mail the position of the stamp D.R.G.M. was "corrected" by a second embossing. I have attached to examples of variations firstly from a Bass clarinet from 1938 and secondly from a reform-Böhm system clarinet from 1941.
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Author: spage
Date: 2010-04-16 17:47
Thanks once again! The people I bought the instruments from were the sons of the owner, who had died, and didn't really know how long he'd had them, or whether he'd bought them new or used. I am hoping to have a friend, who has a better camera than mine, take some photos soonish. I'll post a follow up here with a link to the photos when they're up.
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Author: Hansdenijs
Date: 2010-04-22 19:16
Attachment: Catalogus FW 1937 02a.jpg (237k)
Attachment: Bram de Wilde 01.jpg (300k)
Many thanks for the high quality photos of your very interesting set early Fritz Wurlitzers. The information about the B-flat clarinet with serialnumber 304 as given in an earlier mail is correct. Your photos supports my earlier information. The A clarinet has no signum of Fritz W. on the bell. Two possibilities: the bell is not original and replaced by a neutral bell in earlier times. Actually I don't think this is the case. It is known to me that Fritz has built in the first years after World War II (about 1946-1948) clarinets without his signum and serialnumber. The key-work of your A clarinet (full Schmidt-Kolbe system with extra side triller mechanism on the upper joint and 2 (!) fis"- gis" triller arrangements can be placed in this period. The bore is still very wide (15,2 mm). The sound of this type of clarinet was very appreciated by professionals. I have attached a fragment of the first advertisement of Fritz Wurlitzer clarinets in collaboration with Ernst Schmidt in 1937 with some early types of Schmidt-Kolbe instruments. Furthermore an early photo of Bram de Wilde, principal from the Royal Concertgebouw orchestra in the period of manufacturing of your A clarinet. Bram de Wilde played in his early years the same type of Fritz Wurlitzers as your A clarinet!
greeting from holland
Hans
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Author: spage
Date: 2010-04-23 16:41
Hi Hans,
Many thanks for all the information and for the interesting attachments to your messages. I now know a lot more about the instruments, including that they are older than I originally thought. It was very interesting to read about Fritz Wurlitzer not marking some of the just post-war instruments with his details.
I think, putting together your information with something that the sellers said, that their father (who owned them) must have bought them used and not new. I wonder how many owners they have had - but this I am sure I will never know.
Now I know more about them, I also know that I must learn to play them properly (they deserve to be played!). I am a Boehm system player so I have quite a lot to learn! As Chris (cearnsh on the Bboard, who photographed them) said to me, one thing that will be interesting to find out as we explore them is how much the extra mechanism on the A may make things easier by doing things automatically and/or make things more complicated by giving more alternatives.
Many thanks again.
Stella
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Author: Hansdenijs
Date: 2010-04-24 07:13
Attachment: Catalogus FW 1937 04a.jpg (315k)
Hi Stella,
This will be my last message on this topic. You possess for sure a set very special clarinets, worth to be revitalised and played. I wish you a lot of success in this learning process. It will cost you a lot of effort (as Böhm player) but will give you also a lot of satisfaction.
The tuning will be about a'= 440. Beware of the choice of the right mouthpiece. Hopefully is the mouthpiece on your photos an original one.
Take the standard tuning chart for Oehler system as basis (to be find easily on the Web). For the Schmidt-Kolbe system I have attached a tuning chart for Schmidt/Kolbe system (your system) from Ernst Schmidt himself. Only in German, but easily to follow.
greeting from Holland
Hans
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Author: spage
Date: 2010-04-24 20:20
Hi Hans,
This too will be my last message in this thread.
Just to say that, yes, I believe the mouthpiece in the photographs is original - it too has the Fritz Wurlitzer stamp. There are two other mouthpieces as well, and I expect these were bought to be used with the instruments, so we should be OK.
And finally, once again many thanks for the time you have spent on this, for your advice and now, too, for the chart which will make our lives considerably easier.
Stella
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Author: René
Date: 2010-04-30 13:05
Attachment: IMG_6358.JPG (209k)
Beste Hans,
Ik ben in het bezit van een Fritz Wurlitzer Bes-klarinet met Albert-systeem. Het serienummer is 130 en het instrument is jarenlang professioneel gebruikt door mijn vader. Zelf bespeel ik diverse instrumenten maar zal dit prachtige concertinstrument niet gaan gebruiken. Ik vind het zonde dat zo'n mooi instrument ongebruikt in het etui blijft zitten en wil het dan ook verkopen. Ik ben benieuwd of u meer informatie voor me heeft: over het instrument zelf maar ook waar ik bijvoorbeeld terecht kan voor een serieuze taxatie.
Ik zie uw reactie graag tegemoet.
Met vriendelijke groeten,
René
Post Edited (2010-04-30 13:10)
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Author: Hansdenijs
Date: 2010-05-04 18:56
Attachment: Catalogus FW 03.jpg (1083k)
Dear René,
I would like to answer in english because of the international character of this BBoard. The clarinet is a very nice Fritz Wurlitzer instrument, no albert system but a variant Oehler system. Fritz W. called it in his catalogue from 1956 his "neu entwickelte" clarinet. I have attached the page on which your variant is described in detail. The keywork is very complete with e.g. b-flat improvement, 5 thrillers on the upper joint, fis"/gis"triller and the famous resonance hole near the bell. An E/F improvement is not necessary due the bore and key work. This type of instruments were played in the sixtees and seventees by professional players in the military orchestras in Holland The serialnumber is probably 1130 (not 130) and is built in or around 1953. The keywork and camines of the clarinet looks still in a very good condition, but should be examined by an expert. I advice you to contact the firm "The Holzbläser" at Berlin (see Web) for further information about selling possibilities. The market in Holland for German system players is at the moment very small.
greeting
Hans
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Author: Nitram
Date: 2011-04-29 03:50
Hello Hans
I am an old timer and I remember Bernard Walton principal of the Philarmonia orchestra(London) playing on a set of what seemed to me Reform Boehm Wurlitzer clarinets which he had from the start of his career, se I beleive they must have been by Fritz Wurlitzer. I know he ordered a set of Herbert Wurlitzer clarinets around the 1960's which he did not get used to, perhaps the bore was smaller, anyway he continued until his death with the old instruments.Do you know anything about this ? Walton was a very fine player, there is a great recording of the Mozart with Karajan, recorded in the late 50's. I also met Bram de Wilde. He played with an Oehler type instrument,not Reform Boehm his sound was realy fantastic. I beleive very difficult to achieve that type of sound with a non Oehler type instrument.Would appreciate your comments.
Rgds
Nitram
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Author: Malawski
Date: 2012-04-02 09:08
Hello
A few years ago I got an old clarinet from my friend, playing from time to time I never checked what it is. Now, when some repairs are neccesary I thought that perhaps it would be easier to buy a cheap model for the students and get rid of that old junk. Out of curiosity I checked on the internet and saw that it might be an interesting instrument.
This is an old Oehler system clarinet, signed Fritz Wurlitzer Erlbach, serial number 152. Wooden parts are in good condition, mechanical parts for sure needs renovation.
Can it be valuable instrument?
Should i reperar it?
sold it? or just dump it?
I would be grateful for any information
Sincerely
Wojtek
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Author: MarlboroughMan
Date: 2012-04-02 10:39
You might have a rather valuable instrument on your hands. There aren't many Fritz Wurlitzer clarinets out there, and if the bore/wood is still in good condition, it could be a truly great instrument.
I don't know much about Fritz Wurlitzer Oehlers, and your SN is quite low, so there are no guarantees....but Fritz Wurlitzer instruments are highly regarded and top quality.
I suggest you send it to H. Wurlitzer in Neustadt/Aisch Germany and ask them whwther they think it can be fully restored. If it can, I'd have them refurbish it, then you can make a decision as to whether you want to keep or sell it.
The intonation can be a gamble on some old Fritz's....but you just might hit the jackpot too.
Eric
******************************
The Jazz Clarinet
http://thejazzclarinet.blogspot.com/
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Author: The_Clarinetist
Date: 2012-04-03 18:31
Does anyone know if there are any differences between a german clarinet and a reform boehm that affects the tone negatively? I mean for the price of one wurlitzer full boehm you can get one good french bore and one good german bore clarinet which might even sound better than a RF.
The main question; is the quality of sound in a RF clarinet in some way compromised compared to that of a german clarinet?
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Author: Jeroen
Date: 2012-04-04 14:51
The_Clarinetist wrote:
> The main question; is the quality of sound in a RF clarinet in
> some way compromised compared to that of a german clarinet?
Wurlitzer did have different bore designs in history for Reform Boehm (RB) and German clarinets, even requiring different mouthpieces. So the sound is not identical but I don't think the sound quality of the RB design is compromised, it is just different. It seems that their current bore designs are more closely related, minimising the sound difference.
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Author: macmountain
Date: 2013-12-05 14:40
Dear Hans,
I've just registered to the ClarinetBB because I'm interested in Schmidt Kolbe
clarinets made by Fritz Wurlitzer and you seem to be the expert in Holland.
About 20 years ago I had the opportunity to buy a set FW's. I sold my Klingson Oehler to a guy of the Marinierskapel and brought the set to van Nieuwkastelen who did the revision. Last year I brought the B-clarinet to Ton Kooiman who
did a wunderfull job: the instrument is playing very easy now. I'm using a Zinnermouthpiece (4MR/715) combined with Steuer 100 (3) reeds. I'm still using the original case.
The B-clar has ser.nr 324, the A-clar 325. Just above the bell are the numbers resp. 0912 en 0913. Can you tell me in what year this set was made ?
If you need photo's I can supply them. I have also copies of old fingercards of Schmidt Kolbe and Reform-Boehm clarinets.
Hope that you have information for me.
Hoogachtend,
Wim van den Berg
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Author: macmountain
Date: 2013-12-05 14:44
Dear Hans,
I've just registered to the ClarinetBB because I'm interested in Schmidt Kolbe
clarinets made by Fritz Wurlitzer and you seem to be the expert in Holland.
About 20 years ago I had the opportunity to buy a set FW's. I sold my Klingson Oehler to a guy of the Marinierskapel and brought the set to van Nieuwkastelen who did the revision. Last year I brought the B-clarinet to Ton Kooiman who
did a wunderfull job: the instrument is playing very easy now. I'm using a Zinnermouthpiece (4MR/715) combined with Steuer 100 (3) reeds. I'm still using the original case.
The B-clar has ser.nr 324, the A-clar 325. Just above the bell are the numbers resp. 0912 en 0913. Can you tell me in what year this set was made ?
If you need photo's I can supply them. I have also copies of old fingercards of Schmidt Kolbe and Reform-Boehm clarinets.
Hope that you have information for me.
Hoogachtend,
Wim van den Berg
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Author: RenéSchoon
Date: 2019-11-23 03:31
Dear Hans,
Here I am, almost 10 years after your response to my question regarding my fathers' Fritz Wurlitzer clarinet! To be totally honest I never thought anyone would ever answer my question but of course you did! And I was so amazed to learn all this information, even after 10 years. Thank you very much!
The previous owner of the clarinet, my late father Wijbert Schoon, was indeed the principal clarinet player in the Koninklijke Militaire Kapel (Royal Military Band) in the years '60, '70 and 80'. Now, 10 years after my post on this forum, the clarinet is still in my possession but it lives its life in France to where I emigrated 3 years ago. I still play it from time to time and I adore its large, clear but warm tone. For me a real masterpiece. I have decided to keep it and use it, in honour of my father. Again many thanks!
Greetings from Nades, France.
René
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