 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: janlynn
Date: 2010-03-07 14:20
are there any advantages at all to buying a used BUffet R13, or is it always best to buy new if you can afford it?
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Author: tictactux ★2017
Date: 2010-03-07 14:58
Advantage: you likely pay significantly less. And chances are that if the instrument hasn't cracked before it won't do so in the near future either.
Disadvantage: you usually don't know the instrument's care history.
It all depends what state the instrument is in, whether or not it has been overhauled, whether or not you get a warranty with it and so on. And of course, you may want to play-test it in order to find out if you like its tone.
I have owned a brand new instrument only once. The rest were all second hand or older. Never had a problem, never paid more than $500 (with $80 being the average) for a clarinet.
--
Ben
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Author: weberfan
Date: 2010-03-07 15:37
...what Ben said.
Also, and it's been mentioned on the Bboard before: the wood in an older clarinet may be wonderful, but watch out for the keys.
I spent far too much money overhauling and then re-overhauling a 50-year-old Evette & Schaeffer instrument with a great sound. But the keys just won't stay put. Fix something one place, and it seems to throw something else out of line. It just won't hold a repair.
Whatever you do, insist on a trial period and have your teacher play it as well.
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Author: Ed Palanker
Date: 2010-03-07 15:54
A clarinet is not like buying a used car. You look at it, you play it, you see how it tunes and then you decide to buy it or not. It's not likely to break down three months later. It's either good or it's not. Heck, you can by a new clarinet that's out of tune or cracks in two weeks. ESP http://eddiesclarinet.com
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2010-03-07 19:52
Older Buffets, particularly those from before the introduction of the R13, are likely to have had the bore reamed out. Look down the upper joint bore from the top. If the part above the register vent is dull, it's been reamed, and the instrument will probably be incurably out of tune.
You should also figure in the cost of a new barrel. Older barrels almost always have shrunk, expanded or been reamed. (Of course, a hand-made barrel will usually make a big improvement in a new clarinet, too.)
Ken Shaw
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Author: GLHopkins
Date: 2010-03-07 20:34
Older wooden clarinets usually are pretty dry. The wood can be re-hydrated if done properly. Other problems with these instruments is loose posts and keys that need to be re-fit. This involves swedging hinge tubes, tightening lose pivots and occasionally fitting oversized rods. A qualified tech can make the keywork feel like new.
If the clarinet is only a few years old you should have no problems with it if it hasn't been cracked. If it has a serial number under 100K I would have a qualified repair tech to look it over before buying it. My favorite Buffets have serial numbers between 60K and 90K. I will do the extra work to bring one of these back because they usually play and sound the way I like.
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Author: Ed Lowry
Date: 2010-03-07 22:36
For Ken:
What does it mean that the bore has been reamed? Why would it be done? Is it something that was once thought a good idea and isn't anymore?
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Author: skygardener
Date: 2010-03-07 23:05
As several have said, the keywork can be horrid. I have a Buffet from 1896 that sounds wonderfully, but I would have to replace almost all the keys to get it reliable. This is an extreme example, but just about all clarinets I have seen that were made before the 60-70s have rather soft metal on the keys.
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2010-03-08 11:20
Ed -
Older clarinets often get wood shrinkage in the bore. Also, rising pitch means that older ones can be unusably flat. Repairmen often re-reamed the bore -- a universal cure, equivalent to a prefrontal lobotomy.
Early R13s had intonation problems between the registers, due to the relatively low placement of the register vent. Bore reaming was often done to adjust this, but it usually created more problems than it solved. There was a design change in the late 1960s or early 70s, which raised the vent. This improved the intonation (particularly the relation between the registers), but hurt the throat Bb and, at least in my opinion, made the tone less beautiful and flexible.
Murray Snyder, a well-known repairman in the mid-60s (may he roast in hell), put a gauge in the top of the upper joint of my first, beloved R13 and told me "the bore has collapsed and needs to be re-reamed." I let him do it, degrading the instrument so badly that I had to get rid of it.
On an R13, reaming altered or even removed the polycylindrical shape.
Also, barrels change much more than upper joint bores, because they get wetter and the wood end-grain is exposed in both sockets. Repairmen regularly reamed barrels, usually with a cylindrical reamer that removed any taper.
Bore shaping is highly expert work. Moennig could do it reliably, but even he did it with the owner in the shop, testing each tiny adjustment. And of course he could make a new barrel if he messed up the existing one.
The lesson is that when you are offered a used Buffet, look down the upper joint bore to make sure it's shiny in the area above the register vent. If it's not, you need to do the most meticulous play testing, checking intonation and the relation between the registers extra-carefully.
Ken Shaw
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Author: A Brady
Date: 2010-03-09 17:00
However, if an older clarinet has the bore reamed, then replaced with an insert, usually hard rubber, which is then reamed to the proper dimensions, the clarinet can become a marvelous, "better than new" in some cases, instrument, at least tonally.
I can personally attest to this.
AB
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Author: haberc
Date: 2010-03-09 23:43
At the same time, I bet we could get dozens and dozens of responses from people who have "older" clarinets that play like a dream with good key work, etc.
I have a Selmer series 9* that I wouldn't trade for anything. Tone, action, keywork, all primo.
What's your favorite "Old" clarinet?
haberc@earthlink.net
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