 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Kontra
Date: 2010-01-27 03:30
I'm looking for a new mouthpiece, and I know I should try them out for myself, but are there any good sounding LOUD ones out there? Ive been eyeing the Fobes San Fransisco HB facing for awhile.
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Author: William
Date: 2010-01-27 14:21
The Pomarico crystal "Jazz" #1 also impressed me as being "loud" (I also tried the #2) with good articulation, especially on the G#5 & A5 notes that are typically problems on most bass clarinets. I bought the #1 and started used it "full time" for about a year. However, I have since returned to my older CX_BS Grabner model for two reasons--better quality of sound & easier projection through the orchestra and band ensembles when needed. While the Pom is a great mouthpiece, I feel the Grabner allows me to be more expressive and simply put that wonderful Buffet Prestige sound "out there" when it is needed. FWIW, I use the Legere #3 for both mpcies and in all of my playing venues--orchestra, band & occassional theatre pits--with a John Winslow ligature (trad six-post configuration).
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Author: Ed Palanker
Date: 2010-01-27 15:25
I've never heard of someone looking for a "loud" mouthpiece. Sure you want one that YOU can project with but shouldn't you be looking for one that sounds good that also projects for you and plays in tune and covers all the registers. There is no other way for you to know what's best for you without trying them with perhaps a few different reeds. I use, and love, my Selmer C* that I bought from David McClune, he will also voices one that you send him. Is it the best for you, I can't say. I've had several students in love with it as I am but I can't say you will. For me it does it all, I can even play loud. ESP http://eddiesclarinet.com
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Author: John J. Moses
Date: 2010-01-27 16:00
Play "loud" sounds good to me. Play "soft" too, sounds better!
I use Clark FOBES CF on my Bass Clarinet & can play real loud, but can also play real soft, and that's a good thing.
Try any of Clark's mpcs, but I like his CF facing.
Good luck!
JJM
Légère Artist
Clark W. Fobes Artist
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Author: William
Date: 2010-01-27 16:20
To clarify & agree with EP, my CX_BS is a customized (re-voiced) Selmer C* mouthpiece that Walter Grabner was selling prior to the development his recent LB Zinner blank model. He told me that he stopped using Selmer C*s because of declining quality control issues. (my Selmer C* was from older stock)
If JJM says the Fobes CF bass mpc is good, then it must be. I wonder if it is also a Zinner...........??
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2010-01-27 16:27
Perhaps this is really a vote for Zinner. I have used a Zinner "blank" for a number of years with much success. I just got a little enthusiastic about this newer mouthpiece because, quite frankly, I don't run into a lot of bass mouthpieces I really care for.
..................Paul Aviles
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Author: DougR
Date: 2010-01-27 18:36
Let me just throw in here: when I studied with a local orchestral bassist, he always stressed projection (cutting through the sections) in terms of a good solid air column rather than a "loud" mouthpiece. I suppose among a range of top-quality mouthpieces, some might vary intrinsically in terms of ability to project, but my inclination would be to find the best sounding mouthpiece and MAKE it project with my air. (I imagine most of the mouthpieces mentioned so far would project just fine, but I haven't played them.)
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Author: JEG ★2017
Date: 2010-01-28 01:04
I have to agree with the prevailing wisdom about projection over sheer volume. I play on a Bill Street mouthpiece. Bill uses a Zinner blank and the mouthpiece is excellent. I was able to improve the sound further using a regular Buffet metal ligature, but what really made a difference was learning how to voice and support the sound correctly. As has been said elsewhere in this post, any top-of-the-line mouthpiece will allow you to adequately project if you're breathing correctly.
Keith Stein's book defines what makes a good clarinet sound. If you haven't read it you should. There are a number of elements that he cites that make up a good quality projecting sound, and if you get it right your sound will cut through the orchestra without any unusual effort.
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Author: Ed Palanker
Date: 2010-01-28 03:28
I agree with all the above, all of the mouthpieces mentioned above are good mouthpieces but just because John Doe plays one and thinks it the greatest ever, it may or may not be the best one for you. If I thought that was true I would tell everyone that the only good mouthpiece is the one I use. Well it is the best, for me, but may not be for you. Try as many as you can, that will be the only way to know which one will play loud, soft, articulate, play in tune, play all the registers etc. for you. ESP
PS. By the way, the Selmer C*s I've tried lately, especially when voiced by Dave Mcclune, have been first rate. I also have a Forbes RR facing as my second, but for me it's not quite as good as my C*.
ESP eddiesclarinet.com
Post Edited (2010-01-28 03:36)
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Author: Iceland clarinet
Date: 2010-01-28 04:25
So Ed does McClune reface current C* because Mr Grabner discontinued refacing them several years ago as he said the current quality of the C* was/is not good.
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Author: clarnibass
Date: 2010-01-28 05:07
I don't remember ever trying a decent mouthpiece that didn't allow me to play as loud as I wanted.
I've played several Pomarico mouthpieces for years including one with a facing/tip the same as the Jazz1. I've also tried many others. They are too incosistent to really say anything general. Even comparing several excellent ones they could be different. Not many, but some Pomaricos are very bad too.
As far as new Selmer mouthpieces, I've tried some that were excellent.
I play with a Clark Fobes mouthpiece and I have two. One is a Zinner blank and one is made from a French blank. Both are very good.
IMO getting mouthpiece advice on a forum is only good as a suggestion on what to try. It's not really possible to find out anything specific about different models and how they play because of the incosistency of players and mouthpieces.
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Author: Kontra
Date: 2010-01-28 05:13
Ok, I'm just going to try some of these out then. I might also try a legere reed. If I'm going to play a legere, should I get a 3, the size I usually play on, or a 2 1/2?
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Author: Grabnerwg
Date: 2010-01-28 05:22
I'm glad Dave is having good luck with Selmer C*'s. I used them for several years and made some really fine mouthpieces from them. In several cases people won some pretty important auditions using them.
I think it was in 2004 or 2005 that I started getting many Selmer C*'s with warped tables. Since I was buying them in orders of a dozen or more, this was very disconcerting.
Lawrie Bloom thought the C* based mouthpieces were fine and even used one in chamber music performances. However, neither he nor I felt that the C*, as a blank, was capable of producing the projection we wanted.
Walter Grabner
www.clarinetxpress.com
1193 Bass clarinets
World Class clarinet mouthpieces
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2010-01-28 12:07
As far as the synthetic reed question goes, traditionally a Legere is about one quarter strength stronger. So, if you use a 3, you should try a 2.75 Legere.
I would offer a suggestion to try the FibraCell reeds though (at strength for these). They tend to sound much more like a real reed on the lower horns. Legeres sound too "thuddy" for me on bass.
.............Paul Aviles
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Author: Ed Palanker
Date: 2010-01-28 12:37
Wrong Ice, Dave McClune has been voicing the C* long before Walter Grabner stopped doing that himself. I've been using one for about ten years now, ever since I tried one of his at a clarinetfest. It was love at first play. Before that I used one out of stock for about 35 years.
A student came in last week from NY for a lesson and he had a C* that he recently bought from Mcclune, it played beautifully. I'm not going to question Walters opinion of the new C* blanks, I'm just telling you and everyone else that once Dave voices them they play beautifully. Whatever he does to them they are not warped once he works of them. I always suggest that a player try several of the type they like. Although I haven't tried any new C*s straight from a store in about a year, I would always have a student order 3-4 if they wanted to buy one, I've always found one or two that played very well, even before sending them to Dave if we both felt they needed to be voiced. I usually just suggest they contact him and have him send them several already voiced. BUT, I do always encourage people to try several other makes and models as well before making a final decision. I have tried some of Walters and though I didn't like it as much as what I presently use, it is a very good mouthpiece, as are the Forbes and several others as well. By the way, a conductor has never had to ask me to play louder more then once. ESP
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Author: NBeaty
Date: 2010-01-28 14:16
It is possible to play quite loudly on any bass mouthiece with a reasonable facing\reed combination.
Which ones are easier and more conducive to projection and power for an individual player is something else entirely.
No doubt, the physics of mouthpieces can LIMIT the amount of sound produced. The factor that is 99% of the time more limiting is the player. Proper air support (this is not just FORCE of air) is a much larger factor.
"Quality is what projects"- Paul Meyer
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Author: Ed Palanker
Date: 2010-01-28 14:30
NBeaty and Paul Meyers, I totally agree with both of you.
The thing about mouthpieces is that no matter who makes them, voices them, refaces them or what ever is this. Every single mouthpiece I've ever tried, and I've tried many, all play slightly different. It doesn't matter if it's Chris Hill, David McClune, Walter Grabner or it's a Vandoren, Selmer, Gennusa, Forbes, Bay, Morgan, Kasper or any of the other dozens upon dozens of makers, no two mouthpieces ever sound or respond exactly alike. So I'll repeat what I always advise, try as many as you can because what works for someone else, that includes me, may or may not work for you. I may get a big dark sound on what I use and you might get a small bright sound with the same mouthpiece. That goes for anyone else too. The mouthpiece is only one part, important part of course, of you getting the sound and volume you want. ESP
ESP eddiesclarinet.com
Post Edited (2010-01-28 20:34)
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Author: Noel
Date: 2010-01-29 14:09
I seem to remember reading that the potential loudness of a mouthpiece could be influenced to some extent by the height of the baffle - and that old hand Jazz guys on Albert clarinets used to use chewing gum as a temporary method to pad the baffle in order to achieve this result - maybe at the expense of tuning, but if that's the trade-off someone is willing to make....
Perhaps it points to what kind of mouthpiece design to look for if volume is the priority.
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Author: Ed Palanker
Date: 2010-01-29 16:56
That's interesting about the gum. I'm sure there's no doubt that some mouthpieces for all instrument can be made to play louder but it will be at the expense of something else. Quality, intonation, control. I really think any good player can find a mouthpiece to play "loud enough" if they are playing properly and find the "right" mouthpiece. Or put gum in the baffle. ESP
ESP eddiesclarinet.com
Post Edited (2010-01-30 17:22)
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2010-01-29 17:12
My understanding of the gum is that it is the opposite of a concave baffle, in other words, it makes the mouthpiece play brighter, edgier.
For me it is a balancing act of getting control and being able to put more air into the moutpiece. It is not a matter of simply using a larger tip openning.
I've had my fair share of straight baffle mouthpieces that only produced a diffuse sound.
.................Pau Aviles
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Author: William
Date: 2010-01-29 18:33
I remember, some twelve yrs ago, a Mid-West Band and Orchestra Clinic vendor who was selling little rubber insert stick-ons that you stuck to the baffle of your soprano clarinet mouthpiece to "improve and amplify" your sound and be able to project farther. I passed on his offer and bought a couple of Charlie Bay's new mouthpieces instead........besides, he was more fun to chat with.
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Author: super20dan
Date: 2010-01-30 16:10
yes chas bay is fun to talk too. those powertone baffels dont work well for clarinet. if you want balls on bass clarinet use a bari plastic reed
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