 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: NBeaty
Date: 2010-01-16 21:33
I just aquired a Vandoren M14 mouthpiece and was wondering if 1) anyone else owns one and 2) if anyone knows the specifics of the facing.
I'm also curious if these were made in 13 series only, or both? Mine doesn't say 13 series, just profile 88, but seems to play low in pitch.
Thanks in advance!
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Author: vin
Date: 2010-01-16 22:44
The M14 was developed after the M13 and M13Lyre by Vandoren after consulting with former Philadelphia Orchestra clarinetist Donald Montanaro. It was pulled, to the consternation of many, and the M15 took its place. The M14, like the M13 and M15-13, is a close facing designed to play at A=440 (13 series).
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Author: kdk ★2017
Date: 2010-01-17 00:42
I have two M14s, both of which have tip openings a little under a millimeter (.038" on my taper gauge) and long (about 38 on a standard measuring glass with a .0015" feeler) - basically identical to a Gigliotti P facing. I had been under the impression that Montanaro was involved with the design of the original Series 13 mouthpieces, which started with the M13, but I only "knew" that 3rd hand.
A former student of mine who recently took some lessons with Montanaro tells me he recommended she get an M13Lyre, which has the same tip opening as M14 but a shorter (34) curve.
Karl
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Author: NBeaty
Date: 2010-01-17 22:20
I just measured my M14 and found it to have a 36 length curve, compared to the 34-35 curve on my M13 lyre. Seems to be a touch more focused and darker than the M13 lyre. Unfortunately I do'nt have tip measuring equipment (yet).
Really nice playing mouthpiece though. I wish they were still around!
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Author: D Dow
Date: 2010-01-18 17:06
Interesting set of posts here, for 10 years I experiment with Vandoren facings while playing a Hite D professionally..
during a ten year interval I started experimenting using M13s in the late 90s with a varied degree of success. The sound was warm and deep but seemed to lack bite and overtones.
Then the M14 came out in the late 90s or was is it in the early part of 2000? On this piece I liked the sound but felt it lack flexibilty in the large intervals and I gave it to a student who sounded better than me on it.
For me the M14 seemed to lack defintition in the chalumeau and was not as good as the M13 to me, so I decided to go with a M13 lyre which was decent but tuning seemed tricky. (flattish)
During this whole period I stayed with my Hite pieces ( all D facings). But in the early part of 2005 I started in on the M15s after a summer of using it...
to me m15s are a great compromise between brilliance and depth of sound. The tone is generous and rich and is malleable enough to be loud and soft without taxing me. for me . M30s seem too low to me, and string players notice this more than I do...however, m30s do have an operative harmonic apparent from listening that does lower the pitch.
David Dow
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Author: tylerleecutts
Date: 2016-02-10 10:32
I want to revive this thread- if anyone has a M14 or knows where one could acquire or at least try one, let me know. I play the M13 Lyre currently but my friend absolutely swears by the M14.
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Author: sonicbang
Date: 2016-02-10 12:07
Well I don't have one, you may find this useful; since all Vandoren mouthpieces (except Masters and Black Diamond) in the 440 tuning area has the same interior, you just have to ask a good refacer to work on an M13 or M13 Lyre to reach the specs and rail width of an M14. You may found it even better than a stock Vandoren facing...
Mark
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Author: Radovan
Date: 2016-02-10 17:37
There is a little (but big) difference between M14 and M15. Of, course, M14 is out of stock, because Vandoren dont find any business (money) interest to produce such quality mouthpiece, compared with affordable price. M14 is better than many Vandoren mouthpieces.
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Author: kdk ★2017
Date: 2016-02-10 18:06
Radovan wrote:
> There is a little (but big) difference between M14 and M15. Of,
> course, M14 is out of stock, because Vandoren dont find any
> business (money) interest to produce such quality mouthpiece,
> compared with affordable price. M14 is better than many
> Vandoren mouthpieces.
There is a difference in the facings. M15 is a little more open and a little shorter-curved than M14 was. There's little doubt that the reason Vandoren stopped producing M14 was that it probably wasn't selling - it was fairly extreme among French-style mouthpieces. But there's not an issue of quality "compared with affordable price." M14 and the other Series 13 mouthpieces are made of the same material, probably in the same molds - the blank AFAIK is the same - and the divergence happens when the facing is applied. There was no difference in manufacturing quality, only in the final response and tone characteristics that depend on the facing differences.
I've been told by at least one well-respected mouthpiece craftsman and refacer that trying to close a tip opening while maintaining the rest of a mouthpiece's design is often a practical impossibility. The curve shape applied by hand may not be the same as the original M14, especially since the curve also has to be lengthened. To close the tip, you have to sand down the whole table. Once you do that, you bring the window closer to the baffle. So after the new facing is applied, the resulting shallower baffle may have to be corrected by hand and the rail thicknesses adjusted. If there's a concave curve designed into the table itself, you will have to try to reproduce it as well. By this time the chance is high that you've introduced something (or many things) into the structure that wasn't part of the original M14 design.
You may end up with a good mouthpiece or not - it isn't that you can't close the tip and lengthen the curve, but you won't necessarily have an M14 when you're done.
Karl
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Author: Mojo
Date: 2016-02-10 18:19
Did you try your friends M14? You may not be as impressed as he/she is.
MojoMP.com
Mojo Mouthpiece Work LLC
MojoMouthpieceWork@yahoo.com
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Author: tylerleecutts
Date: 2016-02-10 22:03
I have not tried his M14, but we do agree on just about everything mouthpiece wise.
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