 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: DLAW
Date: 2007-11-21 11:11
I am doing a small project on Brahms and his clarinet sonatas. I know that most of the records say that after Brahms heard Richard Mühlfeld play and got to know him personally, he decided to compose again and wrote his three famous clarinet works.
My question is exactly how close were Brahms and Mühlfeld? A friend told me a couple of years back that the two were secret lovers, but there is no mention of this in any sources that I've come across so far...and I know that Brahms was madly in love with Clara Schumann from the time he met her through the rest of his life, but that obviously doesn't eliminate the possibility that he could have been a closet homosexual, or had secret relations. Any help with this would be greatly appreciated. Thank you in advance.
-David
dlawson1@mix.wvu.edu
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Author: kilo
Date: 2007-11-21 11:24
Richard Mühlfeld, Brahms' Clarinettist by Maren Goltz & Herta Müller
"Richard Mühlfeld was the clarinetist who inspired Brahms to write his four brilliant chamber works for clarinet. This book is based on the archive kept by his brother Christian and published here in a complete and annotated form for the first time along with many photographs. The book includes a short biography and many tables of data (concert tours and programs, chamber music events and ensembles, orchestral performances, repertoire, musicians he performed with, and concert reviews). The primarily language of the book is German. All of the text has been translated into English but the tables have not. However, except for the concert reviews, they are mostly lists of compositions, places, instruments, and performers that are easy to understand. There is also an appendix with information on Mühlfeld's clarinets and his compositions."
You might have to read between the lines, in German no less, but there might be some information in this book, available at:
http://www.vcisinc.com/
Van Cott Information Services is a board sponsor and a very fine place to do business.
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Author: beejay
Date: 2007-11-21 13:20
I'm not sure what such proposed sexual reorientation of the past has to do with the music, but a good place to start might be the catalogue of the Library of Congress. On a cursory look, I spotted a couple of volumes concerning Brahms and his friends.
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Author: DAVE
Date: 2007-11-21 13:50
So this is how it goes right? Two guys are friends and hang out a lot and play many concerts... so they must be gay! Right. Seriously. There is no evidence to suggest that and to make that leap is ridiculous. Add to that, so what if they were?
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Author: DLAW
Date: 2007-11-21 14:23
Come on people...I am not saying that because they were "good friends" and played together often meant anything at all. I had just heard that rumor a couple of times, so I was wondering if anyone could help me find any information on this if it is out there. I've learned that Brahms was somewhat introverted, and kept his personal life very private, so I figured that it could possibly be true. There is obviously nothing wrong with it if they were secretly involved either. Moreover, if this rumor were true, then I would think that it would have a big influence on the music considering that Brahms was an emotional man. Thanks for all of the posts thus far everyone!
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Author: Cass Tech
Date: 2007-11-21 14:24
DLAW:
I recently re-read Jan Swafford's magnificent biography of Brahms and enthusiastically recomend it to you all. Swafford, who also wrote a biography of Charles Ives, is a composer who, in addition to having a novelist's insight into Brahm's character, also provides analysis of most of his major works. For those of you who love Brahms, its a great read. It also goes into his relationship with Mulhfeld, and relates the great story of how Brahms came out of retirement through the inspiration of Muhfeld's playing. Boy, do we clarinetists owe a debt of gratitude to Dick Muhlfeld!
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2007-11-21 14:54
"I had just heard that rumor a couple of times, so I was wondering if anyone could help me find any information on this if it is out there. I've learned that Brahms was somewhat introverted, and kept his personal life very private, so I figured that it could possibly be true. There is obviously nothing wrong with it if they were secretly involved either. Moreover, if this rumor were true, then I would think that it would have a big influence on the music considering that Brahms was an emotional man."
Isn't this just reducing the likes of Brahms and Mühlfeld to the level of idle gossip often associated with scummy 'celeb' magazines?
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
Post Edited (2007-11-21 15:08)
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Author: Bob Phillips
Date: 2007-11-21 15:32
I find it interesting that so many of our finest clarinet literature resulted from collaborations between composer and player --whatever the attraction. Mozart and Stadler, von Weber and Baermann, Brahms and Mulhfield, Copeland and Goodman, ...
I can't get the Mozartian character from the movie "Amadeus" out of my head and extrapolate that image to Wolfie and Anton giggling over a well-turned arpeggio and a "miraculous" chord progression. Maybe the "Kegelstadt" Trio came when Wolfie and Anton befriended a violist.
Making me wonder if the personage(s) did not inspire the collaboration.
Baermann's son claims that the flamboyant adagio variation of von Weber's variations was contributed to the mix by his father. The two of them used that to promote von Weber's oper "Sylvane" (sp?).
I imagine Brahms and Mulhfield woodshedding the Sonatas together --how about using this?" ...plays a good lick. Oh, and what's that Bb doing in there (grins).
I also imagine these wonderful piano and clarinet duos were written for the composer, himself, to play. When I'm playing these, I feel a kinship not just with the original clarinetist, but with the pianist.
In the case of the Copland, there must have been a more clinical association than we find in the cl/pia duos.
(OH, tangential to this topic: Are not these sublime interactions between pianist and clarinetist so much finer than the best "piano reduction.")
I imagine that the chemistry between
Bob Phillips
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Author: Alseg
Date: 2007-11-21 16:14
Duquesne U. did a three year survey (with recitals) of the Brahms chamber music. A pre-recital lecture accompanied all of the music. At no time was it alluded to that Brahms was attracted to anyone except Clara.
The next part of the series deals with the clarinet connection and will feature guest artist James Campbell.
When Muhlfied is discussed, I will listen for any material about this matter and report back, but somehow
I think that Brahms and Muhlfied never velcroed their beards or anything else. This all sounds worthy of TMZ or the Nat. Enquirer to me, not that it matters.
Former creator of CUSTOM CLARINET TUNING BARRELS by DR. ALLAN SEGAL
-Where the Sound Matters Most(tm)-
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Author: NorbertTheParrot
Date: 2007-11-21 17:58
If you look at
http://www.deutsche-klarinetten-gesellschaft.de/Meiningen_2007/meiningen_2007.html
you will find the names of several people who might be qualified to provide a more authoritative answer to your question - and indeed to help you more widely with your research.
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Author: grifffinity
Date: 2007-11-22 00:35
Quote:
I've learned that Brahms was somewhat introverted, and kept his personal life very private, so I figured that it could possibly be true.
While Brahms did his best to keep his personal life just that, even going so far as to request that Clara Schumann return the letters he sent her so he could destroy them (and requested she do the same), we do know a few things:
Brahms had some sort of Madonna/Whore complex, possibly developing due to his experiences as a young, effeminant looking boy playing piano at seedy pubs near the port. While there are no exact facts, some have speculated he was abused and/or rideculed by the sailors and prostitutes who occupied these establishments. In his adult life, it is well known that Brahms frequented female prostitutes and also treated them very well. I believe they called him "Papa Brahms".
Of course, we also have a decent sketch of his relationship with Clara Schumann, and several other women he had very intense, yet asumedly platonic relationships with. At one point, I recall Brahms was briefly engaged to a singer.
While there are rumors/fact base assumptions of homo and bi-sexuality among many of the "classical genre" composers: Copland, Tchaikovsky, Chopin to name a few ....Brahms hetero-sexuality was never questioned from the text I've read on him - including the Swafford book which I own but haven't opened in years.
Perhaps some of the confusion comes from Brahms calling Muhlfeld "Frueline klarinette"...something along those lines. Brahms found the tone of Muhfeld's clarinet feminine, but I would not equate this with Brahms & Muhfeld having a sexual relationship. Brahms had much closer male friends throughout his life, including the violinist Joseph Joachim, for whom a majority of his string works were inspired by.
Post Edited (2007-11-22 00:36)
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Author: skygardener
Date: 2007-11-22 03:45
I have never heard that Brahms was even slightly gay. Would it mattar?
And although he was 'in love' with Clara he played around with many women.
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Author: DLAW
Date: 2007-11-22 07:57
Thanks for all of the posts everyone! They have been a tremendous help. I was actually planning on checking out the Swafford biography, but it is checked out of our library. I'm a huge fan of Brahms, so I am deifnitely planning on purchasing my own copy in the future...after I'm not a broke college student anymore, lol. Seriously though, I appreciate all of the help, and if anyone has any other information to offer, please feel free to do so. Happy Thanksgiving everyone!
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Author: xxColorMeJoshxx
Date: 2007-11-23 01:42
It's interesting that this topic came up. The sonatas are two of my all-time favorite compositions for clarinet. I have also always thought that Brahms and Muhlfeld's relationship was romantic. Muhlfeld, according to what I have read, had such a profound impact on Brahms: he brought him out of "retirement" and caused him to compose 4 HUGE works for him. To me that sounds like they were more than "just friends" - haha. I would be extremely curious if anyone could find concrete evidence.
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Author: skygardener
Date: 2007-11-23 12:58
Here is a question that might help you in the right direction with your research- Was Muhlfeld homosexual?
It seems there is nothing refering that Brahms was, but if you have something stating that Muhlfeld was homosexual then you have at least half of your puzzle.
... but it does seem a far bet.
You know it was a 'cello Sonata that Beethoven first wrote after a long break from composing in mid-life? Do you thing that Beethoven had a relationship with a 'cellist, too?
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Author: grifffinity
Date: 2007-11-23 13:50
Quote:
Muhlfeld, according to what I have read, had such a profound impact on Brahms: he brought him out of "retirement" and caused him to compose 4 HUGE works for him.
Big difference between Muhfeld's clarinetistry being the Muse and Muhfeld the man being the Muse.
Quote:
You know it was a 'cello Sonata that Beethoven first wrote after a long break from composing in mid-life? Do you thing that Beethoven had a relationship with a 'cellist, too?
After Brahms heard the Dvorak Cello Concerto, he did respond, "If I knew the cello was possible of that (sounding through the orchestra) I would have written one myself"
Now...did Brahms and Dvorak have a little something something? ;-)
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Author: runner
Date: 2007-11-23 23:49
Skygardener beat me to the punch. I was ready to respond (quite late) that if there was any info as to Muhlfeld's sexuality. Perhaps there is no documentation. I would start with a check of his marital status. Yes, I am aware that one can be married and be of homosexual orientattion. I am also aware that remaining single does not mean one is possibly gay. But, what evidence do we really have?
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Author: toney
Date: 2007-11-24 06:30
Perhaps if there had been more of a love affair with Muhlfeld, it may have produced for us a clarinet concerto after the quintet which, IMO, would have given Mr. Mozart a run for his money as the greatest piece in our wide and extensive repertoire........
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Author: kpawelek
Date: 2013-05-12 06:22
Hi
I am conducting a research on Brahms and Muhlfeld and the sonatas. I was able to find a lot of letters from Brahms. However I can not locate any letters from Muhlfeld to Brahms.
Does any one have suggestions or reccomendations where to find them?
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2013-05-12 15:11
Kurt Hoffman exploded the myth that the infant Brahms played piano in brothels. Jan Swafford disagreed, based on Brahms's stories, told in his old age, but I imagine these were embroidered almost beyond recognition.
I've read that Brahms never married Clara because Robert had infected her with syphilis. That explains why Clara's father reconciled with her only after she bore apparently healthy children with Robert, with no immediate signs of congenital syphilis. However, the children died young, and Brahms wouldn't take the chance. However, Clara lived to the age of 76 without symptoms of tertiary syphilis, so we'll never know
Mozart himself was an expert violist, so there would be no problem in finding one for the Trio.
The Goltz & Müller biography of Mühlfeld is nearly unreadable heavy-going German scholarship, but it should have everything known about Mühlfeld's letters to Brahms.
Ben Redwine wrote scholarly materials on Brahms and Mühlfeld http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/read.html?f=1&i=321619&t=321400. A search on this board, the Klarinet archives and the Keepers archive produces a large amount of material.
James Fay wrote his dissertation on Brahms's clarinet chamber music. https://catalyst.library.jhu.edu/catalog/bib_283392.
Ken Shaw
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