 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Mitch K.
Date: 2003-02-27 21:44
In the time that I've been reading the postings on this BB--and in conversation with other clarinetists--only a few famous names seem to occur quite often: Marcellus being the most frequent. Other being: Hasty, Bonade, Gigliotti, Drucker, Opperman, Shifrin, etc. What of the other professional clarinetists, principal, seconds, e-flats, and basses? Why is Clark Brody not mentioned often? His position as principal of CSO was surely as reknowned as that of Marcellus, or Wright. Then there's Lurie, Stephen Girko, Dagon, Simonauer, and a mélange of other theoretically influential clarinetists. What of them?
How is it that we come to only talk about a few when there were so many?
I have my own theories, but I'm interested to read what other people think.
Later,
Mitch King
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Author: GBK
Date: 2003-02-27 21:54
Mitch...I think the key phrase in your posting was "theoretically influential".
When one interprets that to mean clarinetists who advanced, refined and extended principles of clarinet playing - concepts which are still being taught today, then your above list grows much shorter...GBK
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Author: HAT
Date: 2003-02-27 21:56
I, for one, mention Clark Brody all the time. No question in my mind that he was one of the very best over a very long period of time.
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Author: Mitch K.
Date: 2003-02-27 22:43
In response to GBK:
For a clarinetist sitting as principal of a national orchestra (or perhaps even a regional orchestra), he/she automatically has SOME influence, however large or small, on clarinet playing either locally, nationally, or internationally. (And I don't mean that that person can actively guide the direction of clarinet philosophy or practice--they are more of an example that is emulated and studied.) And for a person in that position to apparently have no lasting contribution or influence can/may mean that the clarinet community consciously decided to not ackowledge that person or their playing. In my opinion, winning an audition for principal of, say, NY Phil, Boston, Chicago, Cleveland, etc., should automatically mean that you have a legacy of some sort, good or bad. Now, years later, for there to seemingly be no lasting effects from these players is a little strange to me. Moreover, even the mention of some of their names have been relegated to past issues of "The Clarinet."
Elvis, Nixon, Mandela, Stalin, Napoleon, Bach, The Daley family of Chicago, and many, many more were all high profile. They were all had influential--good or bad.
Now I am not insinuating that Michelle Zukovsky can or should influence the world as did a poorly-aged rock star, a President that wasn't "a crook," a Freedom Fighter, etc., but shouldn't we clarinetists know who she is, what she does, if/where she teaches, any innovations or developments from her, or at least know of her general abilities?
Maybe I'm way off. If so, I can accept that. :-)
Mitch King
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Author: Katrina
Date: 2003-02-28 03:13
Well, Mitch, I think that many of those clarinetists still do have followings. You just don't hear them mentioned as often because they weren't "THE" clarinetist...
Your list of "Elvis, Nixon, Mandela..." etc. does certainly contain many influential people, but however, it lists both apples, oranges, and computer brands. If you were to list, say, "Freedom Fighter(s)", you'd have a much bigger and thorough list than just including Mandela on a list with other types of famous and infamous humans.
I'm also unsure of what you mean by, "Now, years later, for there to seemingly be no lasting effects from these players is a little strange to me." I'm not sure what lasting effects you're not seeing. Just this BB? I talk all the time about my teachers, both here and elsewhere. I don't say the bad things that I think or feel, but have complimented those I feel deserve it whenever I feel the need. And just because I have "bad things" to say about certain clarinetists doesn't mean they're not influential or not good players...LOL!
xoxo,
Katrina
(who had a bad experience in grad school with one of the above mentioned players, but who doesn't think that he was at all a bad musician or clarinetist!)
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Author: beejay
Date: 2003-02-28 13:20
I agree about Pamela Weston.
But even she failed to mention Acker Bilk, who some of us believe to be truly iconic, whatever that means.
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Author: vin
Date: 2003-02-28 13:57
No way, Katrina! I had a bad experience in grad school with Elvis, too!
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Author: msloss
Date: 2003-02-28 13:59
I studied with Clark Brody over a period of seven years, and no question his achievements are legendary in the clarinet world. I don't think the measure of the greats is how many times they get mentioned on this board. It is in the legacy they leave behind. Mr. Brody has countless landmark recordings to his credit, innumerable concerts with CBS and the CSO, and the profound impact he had on his students throughout the years. He influences my playing every day, and my students benefit from his teachings through me.
Sure Mr. Marcellus gets a lot of play, but there are countless others that get mentioned frequently and have had an incredible cummulative impact on the clarinet world, including Klose, Bellison, Cahuzac, Cavallini, Jettel, and... well you get the point. Gigliotti, Marcellus, Combs, Smith, et al have brand-name recognition right now, so they catch your eye. I don't think they are disproportionately mentioned.
Perhaps a more interesting thread could be started about which clarinetists have had the most profound impact on who we are as musicians, and why.
Cheers. M.
By the way, HAT put together a tremendous recorded retrospective and interview with Mr. Brody a couple years ago that is a must-see. Perhaps as our gracious web host cranks up his technology we can make some of that available for everyone to appreciate on this site.
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2003-02-28 14:47
msloss wrote:
> ... HAT put together a tremendous recorded
> retrospective and interview with Mr. Brody a couple years ago
> that is a must-see. Perhaps as our gracious web host cranks up
> his technology we can make some of that available for everyone
> to appreciate on this site.
Just let me know the particulars ... it's the 1st I've heard of it.
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Author: Mitch K.
Date: 2003-02-28 15:41
Thanks for the feedback. However, I don't think I'm making my point clearly, and I don't know how else to put it. So, I'm gonna sit here at my desk at look busy while my mind starts the weekend by playing computer solitaire.
Mitch King
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Author: Sylvain
Date: 2003-02-28 15:43
I think it depends where you are from too.
I did not read anything about Leister or S. Meyer or A. Prinz in there.
Who talked about Arrignon THE clarinet educator in France today along with Jacques Lancelot, Guy Deplus, Guy Dangain, Claude Faucomprez, .
How about, Michael Collins, Anthony Pay, Reginald Kell.
The list is simply endless.
As far as US goes ,Marcellus has had an impact that no other clarinetist of his time had.
He not only taught pretty much every professional player today (well not quite but almost ;->) he also had the chance to work under Szell baton who was also a genius in his own right.
Bonade more or less created the american school of clarinet playing, so he must be on the list.
In the end what makes us remember a musician is I think one of two things:
Either they are such great educators the entire community becomes a student of a student of X.
Either they pursued some kind of solo career or recordings that put their name on the front line, Wright, Leister, Stolzman, etc.
Being principal chair in a great orchestra won't bring you fame...
-S
--
Sylvain Bouix <sbouix@gmail.com>
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Author: Sylvain
Date: 2003-02-28 16:26
Mark-
Was your comment addressed to me?
If yes I don't understand what you mean.
It must be because I'm french, the subtleties of the english language still escape me.
-S
--
Sylvain Bouix <sbouix@gmail.com>
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Author: jim S.
Date: 2003-02-28 16:46
Does anyone have information as to why there is such a disparity between the extant recordings, past and present, of Harold Wright and Robert Marcellus given their comparable reputations within the performing clarinet community?
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2003-02-28 16:56
To hear some truly beautiful playing from Clark Brody, get the Reiner/Chicago reissue of the Tchaikovsky 6th. Brody's playing of the solos is as good as it gets.
Best regards.
Ken Shaw
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Author: HAT
Date: 2003-02-28 16:58
Jim S. Can you clarify your question?
The 'disparity' you speak of. . .is it quantity, quality or something else?
Harold Wright, of course, had a much longer career than Marcellus did.
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Author: jim S.
Date: 2003-02-28 17:32
I was thinking quantity. I didn't make clear that I meant quantity of small ensemble and solo recordings.
Wright may have had a longer career with major orchestras, but many if not most of his small ensemble and solo recordings were made many years ago. I have an old (1987) Schwann Artist catalogue and there was only one ensemble listing and the Mozart Concerto for Marcellus, in contrast to seven for Wright at that time.
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Author: Don Berger
Date: 2003-02-28 17:56
What a wonderful clarinet history we have, I sure do treasure the contacts I've had with many of them. Mitch and Hat, I grew up in Lansing, MI, was a Brody family neighbor, and was in 12 grades and some Mich State with Jim B, a very accomplished flautist. Clark was a bit older, didn't have much contact, but sure knew of his early ability. I have also a book on the CSO of that time period, will post it if asked. Oh, to do it again!! Don
Thanx, Mark, Don
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Author: HAT
Date: 2003-02-28 21:42
Marcellus played at a time when chamber music recordings and solo recordings of clarinet music were relatively rare. That would explain partially the reason there are so few.
The vast majority of Harold Wright's discography (other than the Marlboro items) were made after Marcellus had retired from playing.
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Author: AL
Date: 2003-03-01 00:21
Think of how many of the above mentioned clarinetists are 1st, 2nd, 3rd, etc. descendents of Daniel Bonade--including Clark Brody.
AL
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Author: Ed
Date: 2003-03-01 01:01
As to the number of Wright recordings, Marcellus didn't record much outside the orchestra. We are very fortunate to have his wonderful orchestral stuff. Wright did the Marlboro things, as well as Brahms sonatas, Schumann Fantasy Pieces, Fairy tales, Copland Sextet with the Juilliard Quartet, etc in the mid sixties to early 70's when he joined the BSO. From then on, we are very lucky to have the BSO Chamber players recordings. In recent years, we are fortunate to have the things on the Boston Records label. Much of that is from live concerts. I wonder if there are Marcellus things lurking around somewhere on tape from some chamber performances. If so, maybe someone could issue those. That would be wonderful to hear him in those settings. Maybe David Hattner knows of some, then he could put them out on his label.
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Author: HAT
Date: 2003-03-01 01:11
I can tell you that there exists a stereo tape of a live 1956 performance of the Copland concerto with Szell conducting (and George Silfies playing the piano part). I have never heard it (you have to go to cleveland and make an appointment to hear it and I haven't had the opportunity).
Don't count on that ever seeing the light of day, though.o
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