 The Oboe BBoard
|
Author: WoodwindOz
Date: 2011-07-08 06:44
I am working on the Poulenc and am really enjoying the 1st movement - it is my kind of piece! I freaked out a bit when I first heard the 2nd, but I am beginning to work my way through it and can get the majority of it around 120bpm - well under tempo but better than I originally thought!
For those who have played the 2nd movement, I have a couple of questions:
1. Is there a certain technique or any advice for the downwards octave slurs (bar 8, 21) so that I don't sound like a dying duck? I can tongue them fine, and tuning isn't an issue, I just kind of get a 'donkey' effect when I slur these bars. 
2. Fingering for the 3rd register D# to E at that tempo - I am using 1/2XX|0XXEb for the D#(not sure how to write the half hole, if you are wondering what the 1/2 is), changing to 1st 8ve key plus 1/2XXG#|0XXEb (basically, just adding 1st 8ve and G# to the D# fingering I am using here). I hope you can understand that! Does that sound accurate/efficient?
Thanks again,
Rachel
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: HautboisJJ
Date: 2011-07-08 08:58
Glad you like the Poulenc, it's beautiful beautiful music. There is a wonderful and amazing recording of Francois Leleux on Sony thay you will enjoy thoroughly if you can find it. That speed in the 2nd movement!!!!! And all the breathtaking phrasing in the 1st and 3rd movements. Also one of the rare recordings where you can actually hear dynamics!
1.
I know exactly what you mean. My advise is, don't compensate the downward slur. Just move your fingers and change nothing else! (don't loosen your embouchure, don't change the breath) Fundamentally simple, but we seem to assume that oboes can't do that well when actually good instruments nowadays allow it much more than we think. It also makes it more musical. Also, when it is fast enough, there will be less of that annoying donkey effect.
2.
Have you tried the "standard" long fingerings?
h = half hole
with half or without half (i prefer without and set my oboe to play without)
D# oxx|oxx +low B +1st oct
E oxx|oxx +low B +1st oct +right hand G# +right hand Eb
Not sure whether your instrument allows it but my method is:
D#
oxx|ooo + 3rd oct
E
hxo|ooo + 3rd oct
Both with low C key if too sharp. My half hole plate is waxed though so perhaps that, together with the height of the half hole plate as well as the 3rd octave key will affect whether this will work. Good luck!
Howard
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: JRC
Date: 2011-07-08 17:22
Howard, what kind of oboe do you have to produce
D# oxx|ooo + 3rd oct?
This the first on me and it does not work on my oboe, a standard conservatoire model, with or without the 3rd octave key.
Do you mean
D# oxx|ooo + 3rd oct + G#?
This does not produce as stable a note as the fingerings below. But essential fingering for running passage.
Now, I have been using this for over 50 years as these produce stable notes. I call these standard fingering.
D# oxx|oxx +low B +1st oct
E oxx|oxx +low B +1st oct +right hand G# (+right hand Eb -- not sure all oboe would need this)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: mjfoboe
Date: 2011-07-08 18:08
Howard, what kind of oboe do you have to produce
D# oxx|ooo + 3rd oct?
This is my preferred fingering on the Marigaux 901. It is better in tune and since there are less fingers involved more accessible.
Mark
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: tfriedle
Date: 2011-07-08 18:32
Rachel, to answer your second question, try these fingerings for the D# and E.
D# hxx|ooo +3rd oct.
E hxx|ooo +3rd oct. & G#
Granted, you may have to open your 3rd oct key some for these to work.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: cjwright
Date: 2011-07-08 18:52
Rachel,
1. I would concur with JJ and suggest you just either make/buy a reed which is stable enough to make those slurs, and then keep the air going! I see too many students (college level) try to even help it with the air and and it ends up coming out donkeyish.
2. I think your original fingers aren't bad.
a. Add the low B for your first D#
b. Use RIGHT HAND Ab for high E, so it'd be
back octave, hxx|Aboxx Eb
For both my Loree and Howarth, just adding the back octave key to the D# makes it a sharp D# and doesn't really work.
Blog, An Oboe In Paradise
Solo Oboe, Thailand Philharmonic Orchestra
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: JRC
Date: 2011-07-08 18:54
Wow!!
All my life with all different oboes, I used
D hxx|ooo + C (sometime + E depending on reed and instrument)
hxx|ooo (alt D in some running passages - tends to be sharp)
or oxx|ooo (about 1/4 tone or so, needs to lip it)
I suppose I could let go another 1/4 tone and it could play D# with it. I do not think I will change what I have been doing for all those years.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: HautboisJJ
Date: 2011-07-09 00:44
JRC, like Mark that D# fingering is my preferred fingering. I realize it is not always possible and indeed that has brought me a some inconvenience this week after that tenon of my Buffet oboe broke (currently stuck in Leipzig customs) and i have had to play on a, actually, really nice student model Buffet courtesy of a student.
Also, the fingering that you suggested with G# key does not work with my Buffet and makes it a slightly flattish E! Ha! BUT on my old Loree it was a perfect E!
A previous teacher taught me this fingering and on his Marigaux it seems that he has to set his 3rd octave key quite high and admits that it is not always easy to get to it nice and soft without the right reed. On my Buffet the 3rd octave key is set to what i think is fairly standard BUT my half hole plate is waxed and that could have a profound effect on the possibility of these fingerings. I lift my index finger for most if not all notes above 3rd octave C. (A common practice in Europe and in Asia, where many many students were taught by teachers trained in Europe.)
Don't want to open a GIANT can of worms here but style of reeds could have a profound effect. E.g. smaller neck staples like Loree/Chiarugi 2 flattens the shorter fingerings that i use whereas bigger like Glotin/Chiarugi 3-7/Big Klopfer copy staples sharpen them. As with common sense, the closer the reed (NOT bad, soft cane of course) the more perfect these notes speak in soft dynamics.
Howard
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: WoodwindOz
Date: 2011-07-10 04:43
I knew there were a lot of alternative fingerings for these notes, but I am impressed! Thanks especially to those with Marigaux tips. I have written all the fingerings out and with try them during my next practice session - school holidays tomorrow!
I am trying my best not to adjust my embouchure for the octave slurs, but I still think I sound like a donkey! I will persevere - can't expect change without the work! I am attempting to use a bit of detache (do oboists use this? It is a flute technique) but I doubt I can do that up to speed.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
The Clarinet Pages
|
 |
.jpg){kind=small}
