 The Oboe BBoard
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Author: DrayGuevara
Date: 2008-09-17 12:32
Hello Oboists! I play the clarinet in my spare time and am thinking of taking up the oboe. I realise it is far more expensive to get a decent oboe compared to a clarinet. Are there any pointers you could give me? My budget isnt huge so am probably looking to get one second hand. Also, clarinets are far cheaper in the US than the UK. Is this true for oboes?
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Author: DrayGuevara
Date: 2008-09-17 12:44
I have just seen a Howarth (which seems to be well regarded for £390. It is described thus; Howarth B. English ring model. Serial No. 1511. Complete with carrying case and reed case. All in excellent condition. Any thoughts?
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2008-09-17 12:50
These are made by Orsi (Milan) for Howarth and will give you a good start as they've had their bores reamed up to Howarth spec. They are basic thumbplate system to low Bb so will have the full range. The ring keys could be a problem if you have small hands as the toneholes are much further apart on an oboe than a clarinet. But it's still worth a try.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: Dutchy
Date: 2008-09-17 15:36
I don't think oboes are any cheaper in the U.S. than in the UK, mainly because it's a fairly restricted market; beginning elementary school oboists are probably just as scarce on the ground on both sides of the pond, and that's what drives the cheap U.S. musical instrument market, the presence of millions of 10-year-olds who every fall decide to take up one instrument or another. And very few of whom choose the oboe. Supply and demand, capitalism in its purest form.
A good quality used oboe (personal rule of thumb, nothing carved in stone), ought to run at least $500 (and that's only if you know the provenance and are sure it isn't some made-in-China knockoff), and in the neighborhood of $1000 is more usual. Plus the reeds run from $8 to $20. This isn't a cheap hobby. ![[grin]](http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/smileys/smilie5.gif)
Plastic vs. wood doesn't usually signify, when you're talking about good quality (as opposed to El Cheapo) oboes, so don't let it sway your decision overly much.
I wouldn't advise you to patronize the Online Auction Site, as it's too easy for novices to get taken.
Make sure any oboe you buy has the Low Bb key on the bell (you can just look at the bell to see if there's a key there), and if it has Left Hand F, that's highly desirable.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2008-09-17 19:39
Basic thumbplate systems built for the UK market (Regent, Howarth B/Orsi, Howarth S10, Bundy, Buffet, etc.) will have low Bb, but only have a C-D trill for LH finger 3 only, forked F vent, simple 8ve keys and no LH F key.
Basic conservatoire system oboes made for the US and worldwide market excluding the UK (Bundy, Buffet, Yamaha 200, etc.) mostly descend to low B, have the RH2 C-D trill and the LH2 C-C# trill, semi-auto 8ves and may not always have the forked F vent or LH F key.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: vboboe
Date: 2008-09-18 04:08
... long term plans (5+ years from now) may be something to take into consideration when chosing oboe, is it going to be (1) tootling a bit in your spare time as a hobby, or (2) are you thinking doubler on clarinet / oboe in a local band, or (3) are you thinking local community orchestra, or some other 'good player' venue?
if you're seeing yourself still tootling at home in 5+ years time, then the ring-key oboe will probably give you many spare hours of satisfaction -- as long as it isn't a 'resistant' instrument -- one that needs a lot of strong blowing all the time -- you just wouldn't want to play it at all after the novelty wears off, too much effort needed -- and as long as your hands / fingers / fingerpads are sized big enough to easily seal the tone holes completely when moving rapidly -- the huge open low D tonehole could be especially problematic to seal properly
however, if you're thinking of finding public venues to play in later on, it would be better to get a 'plateau' oboe, with caps covering tone-holes, for greater ease of rapid fingering, and with that you'd also find the semi-automatic octave mechanism a boon (the Howarth is manual octaves), include the UK standard forked F vent, and add the Left F, which has several advantages in alternate fingering sequences involving F-D & F-C intervals around Eb Enatural & D combinations
If you end up playing with a band where brass is dominant, be prepared to play nearly everything in flats, which takes extra finger work than playing in sharps for orchestra with strings dominant
ChrisP mentions that the Howarth you're interested in only has the upper joint (left hand) C# and D trills. Personally i find the lower joint (right hand) D trill lever very handy, wouldn't want to be without it
Nice to note that the Howarth basic oboe comes with a reed case, over here that's often a pricey extra accessory
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Author: DrayGuevara
Date: 2008-09-18 14:07
Thanks for all your help! In the longer term I would probably want to play with local groups. I mainly play my clarinet at UK churches where the standard is hardly very high! I'll report back with how I get along.
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Author: D
Date: 2008-09-18 19:51
Dray,hope you enjoyit. I too am a refugee from the clarinet camp. One thing I have found really really hard is tuning. On clarinet I struggle with tuning, sometimes I can tell I am wrong (but not know if I should go up or down) and sometime someone else has to tell me (whereupon I crawl under my chair in embarrassment). On the oboe my tuning is so bad that I notice it almost all the time and I wont play it in public although I can actually play grade 6 and 7 pieces pretty convincingly (cept the tuning parts). Be prepared for this! You will almost certainly need a teacher to sort it out. Get a specialist oboe teacher. They are the endlessly optimistic and patient ones......
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Author: EaubeauHorn
Date: 2008-09-18 22:45
I'll chime in on the tuning thing since it's something I find frustrating in amateur US groups. It seems that even college graduates with a degree in music ed, have not had basic training in how major and minor intervals sound when played in tune; that is, there is no concept of beats (or the lack therof) and you will hear two amateurs playing the same note with beats occurring that fairly rattle the chandeliers in the room, and neither person budging. They just sit there a few hertz apart in pitch and seem to not even understand that it's not supposed to sound that way. It's like they both are thinking to themselves "I'm right and he's wrong so I'm not changing," instead of "EEK! BEATS! MUST STERILIZE!" In pro groups, the players adjust so quickly that most in the audience won't even realize there was a foray into beats, and no one even thinks about who is right and who is wrong....everyone adjusts as fast as they can, and the chords sound in tune.
So if you have problems with tuning, see if you can find someone to show you (not tell you) the quite simple concept of listening for beats; how octaves, perfect fifths and fourths, and major/minor 3rds and 6ths are supposed to sound. This can make a huge difference in your ability to play in tune, and really it is not difficult. It simply is not taught.
Once you get accustomed to where in-tune pitches are on your instrument (and the in-tune pitch changes depending on the note's position in the chord) you will become practiced at putting them in the right place to start with.
EBH
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2008-09-18 22:59
On oboe when playing up top (from top C to top F), if you think you're in tune, chances are you're blowing sharp, so you may think you're playing a top D but it is in fact almost an Eb - it's something about the oboe tone that's deceptive. So be sure you blow the top notes DOWN to pitch.
But it's not helped when you're in unison with flute (or an 8ve below piccolo) players that blow sharp as they inevitably do!
Do plenty of playing along with a tuner to check where you are, and plenty of ear training.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: jhoyla
Date: 2008-09-20 18:20
If you are REALLY serious about your intonation, and are willing to work on it to improve dramatically, this is the place to start:
http://www.idrs.org/publications/Journal/JNL4/oboe.html
The article by Orlan E. Thomas was published in The Journal of The International Double Reed Society (Number 4, 1976), and is as true today as it was then. By carefully reading, understanding and then practicing as described in this article your intonation is guaranteed to improve markedly, and you have the added benefit of being able to rapidly determine if others are playing in-tune or are out of tune (since you will train your ear to hear intervals correctly).
Nowadays we have the advantage of cheap, accurate electronic tuners such as the Korg Chromatic tuner CA-30 (though there are many others). You can modify and improve the exercises given in the article by using the tuner for reference.
It requires consistent practice and dedication to the cause :-) - but then, we are all oboists ...
J.
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