 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Hank Lehrer
Date: 2026-03-12 21:18
Hi All,
I’m a member of an excellent community band that rehearses in a not-so-excellent high school band room. This space is pretty small but making matters worse is that seating is on permanent cement risers.
Access to and from most seat areas is difficult particularly for members that have mobility issues. The are no handrails, designated pathways, or any means to assist navigating; issues like this were quite de rigueur before ADA standards were established.
Making matters worse is the band is getting more “grey haired” each season. So far, there have not been any falls, but I am sure it is only a matter of time with the result being an injury to a person, an instrument or both.
The idea of finding a bigger area in the building, moving to another location for rehearsals, or removing the risers are not viable options. We must find a low-cost solution.
Have you had any similar experiences or dealings with solving these kinds of issues?
Thanks in advance. Hank
Post Edited (2026-03-12 22:26)
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Author: davyd
Date: 2026-03-13 22:25
I have been in similar situations twice. In both cases, the problem was solved for us. In the first case, the school building was renovated, with the resulting floor being all one level, with no risers. In the second case, the school was torn down and replaced; the floor in the new building is also all one level. Is either type of transformation in your venue's future?
Perhaps your group could underwrite the cost of installing railings. Would that be within your financial means? How would the school management feel about it?
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Author: Hank Lehrer
Date: 2026-03-14 16:38
Hi Dayyd,
We are on the same page. Sadly, a renovation or demolishing of the school is not on the horizon.
I am in the process of encouraging the band's Board to allow me to form an ad hoc committee to study the problem. We have an MD, geriatric nurse, and a special services director on board.
The Board now has a position paper with possible alternatives. Contacting the school administration would be step once I get a green light.
The notion of railings is a good one. In fact, I have two donors that will match any grant from the band, school, or the system board. A quick opinionnaire for current band members with some cross tabulations should provide some useful information.
This problem can be handled at the local level.
Thanks,
Hank
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Author: kdk
Date: 2026-03-14 17:30
Hank Lehrer wrote:
> The notion of railings is a good one. In fact, I have two
> donors that will match any grant from the band, school, or the
> system board. A quick opinionnaire for current band members
> with some cross tabulations should provide some useful
> information.
>
I have two questions about handrails. (1) Where would they be installed? (2) Would they in some way impede the room's normal daytime use as a high school band room?
Are you thinking of putting them along either the front or back edge of each riser? My experience with risers of any kind is that in one way or another they limit the flexibility of arranging chairs and stands (in addition to the limitations of the risers themselves). That may be a trade-off your group is willing to live with, but the band director, whose players are all 18 years old or younger, may find handrails a nuisance and may resist the idea. If the band director will support you, then funding should be relatively easy to come by.
You can't put railings across the middle of the risers - they would absolutely interfere with any normal seat arrangement.
I completely understand the concerns, as I'm approaching 80 myself and have mobility issues of my own. I detest risers of any kind.
You dismiss the viability of finding another rehearsal location. I'm not sure from my experience that there's an alternative if safety is an issue. In fact, you may need to be careful about how you approach this with the school administrators - they tend to be acutely lawsuit-averse, and any persistent suggestion of safety issues may end your welcome there.
Karl
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Author: Neil
Date: 2026-03-14 20:53
As this is a school, there is likely grant money available for disability access improvements. You might want to look into that.
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Author: kdk
Date: 2026-03-15 06:27
Just keep in mind as you negotiate that the school building is meant primarily to benefit its students. Most public schools allow community use of their buildings outside of school hours because they are public spaces that are publicly (i.e. tax) funded. Outsider use can bring on issues with a school's insurance providers, who may simply refuse to underwrite more risky uses and force the school to block them entirely. This tends to be the kind of issue that most affects public schools. Lots of private and religious schools simply close the buildings at night and ban outside uses.
You can of course always discuss issues like this with a school administration that's supportive and welcoming (most in my experience aren't). And the ADA certainly has provisions including grants for safety improvements when the building is being used for its intended purpose, which in this very specific instance means rehearsal space (however inadequate and poorly designed) for a group of teenagers under the supervision/direction of a paid school employee who falls under the school's insurance protection.
A welcoming administration may well want to give permission to make safety modifications to the building. The school's music director may even be comfortable with them. But my point is simply that this problem may not be just a matter of funding.
Karl
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Author: clarhorn ★2017
Date: 2026-03-15 08:50
Hank,
If there is room at the end of the risers, is it possible for those who need it to sit down on the floor at the end of the second or third riser? Being below but adjacent to their section would still allow them to hear their section mates. Access to the first riser would not be obstructed to allow others to be seated as the chair and stand could always be placed after every is on the riser. As performance seating is not an issue, seating order should not be problem.
Roger
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Author: kdk
Date: 2026-03-15 17:35
Hank Lehrer wrote:
> Hi All,
>
> I’m a member of an excellent community band that rehearses in
> a not-so-excellent high school band room. This space is pretty
> small but making matters worse is that seating is on permanent
> cement risers.
>
BTW, I've already said that my attitude toward risers is that they're more trouble than they're worth in the way they constrain seating. But IMO permanent concrete risers in a band (or choir) room are uniquely dangerous. I've seen both instruments and kids in my own school groups (both as a student and later as a teacher) get badly hurt on them. The kids run around, knocking things over and/or tripping over them. Older adults have the kind of problems you've described. Often, those risers have metal edges, which can be dangerous in themselves.
The irony (I guess) is that if even one student in the school band were wheelchair-bound, there would probably be an ADA *requirement* to provide a way (probably a ramp) onto the risers for them. Think of a percussionist, usually positioned behind the rest of the band, probably on the top riser. I had parents make a scene when their left-handed child didn't have a left-handed desk during class. I'm sure an active parent would find a way via the ADA to force the school admin to make some kind of accommodation. Those risers were IMO architectural malpractice when they were in vogue, and they were approved in school rehearsal rooms because the music teachers were rarely consulted until after the design was approved and all that was left to choose were the colors on the walls.
Unfortunately for your band, a campaign to level out the floor space would have to come from inside the school district, probably from a parent. But it would (again, IMO) be a worthwhile campaign for everyone involved.
Karl
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Author: Hank Lehrer
Date: 2026-03-16 04:16
Hi All,
Wonderful responses! I'll try to include comments from above with a response.
1. Different venue: There are several high schools and four universities close by. However, this band rehearses in the HS band room of the high school where our director taught for many years. The band room now bears his name. You can see that a political minefield exists.
2. Roger: Using floor seating of two chairs next to the lower risers is what we are already doing. That has been very helpful. But we have run out of room.
3. kdk: You’ve got it all and have captured the entire gamut of issues. Permanent risers were the vogue back in the day and were indeed architectural malpractice. I plan to ask area band directors that have permanent risers to send me photos.
4. Guard rails could be helpful but agreed, if incorrectly positioned could cause more trouble than before.
5. kdk: May I use “But IMO permanent concrete risers in a band (or choir) room are uniquely dangerous. I've seen both instruments and kids in my own school groups (both as a student and later as a teacher) get badly hurt on them. The kids run around, knocking things over and/or tripping over them. Older adults have the kind of problems you've described. Often, those risers have metal edges, which can be dangerous in themselves” in any future presentations (you would probably be called AOFBD).😊😊
As I digest your great responses, moving to another venue is probably the best solution. Preferably a large, riserless band room with adequate percussion equipment.
I have played in a community band that rehearses in a church hall on Sunday afternoon. People bring their own stands and the band have purchased a skeleton percussion set which is stored at the church.
Hank
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Author: kdk
Date: 2026-03-16 05:37
Hank Lehrer wrote:
> 5. kdk: May I use “But IMO permanent concrete risers in a
> band (or choir) room are uniquely dangerous. I've seen both
> instruments and kids in my own school groups (both as a student
> and later as a teacher) get badly hurt on them. The kids run
> around, knocking things over and/or tripping over them. Older
> adults have the kind of problems you've described. Often, those
> risers have metal edges, which can be dangerous in
> themselves” in any future presentations (you would probably
> be called AOFBD).😊😊
Sure. I'm not completely sure what the first couple of letters in your acronym stand for (I can guess at the last three), but as long as you're far enough away that I can't hear them, they can call me whatever they want. I think if there were a serious push from someone with standing in the district, there would be good support for taking the risers out, very possibly from the music faculty itself. But short of that, I suspect your band is stuck.
Karl
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Author: Hank Lehrer
Date: 2026-03-16 19:28
Karl,
Thanks for the feedback. I just heard from the President of the Band that he will advocate for support for my proposal at Saturday's Board meeting. Step 1.
Hank
PS the first two words are An Old... You and I are both.
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Author: kdk
Date: 2026-03-16 21:40
Hank Lehrer wrote:
> Karl,
>
> Thanks for the feedback. I just heard from the President of the
> Band that he will advocate for support for my proposal at
> Saturday's Board meeting. Step 1.
That's a great first step. He's not an elected official, though. The School Board will have the final say, I assume. So, hope that the Band President and the School Board President are on good terms.
Karl
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