 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: A.Nori
Date: 2025-04-25 03:45
lefreQue
https://www.lefreque.com
Post Edited (2025-04-25 03:45)
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Author: Dan Shusta
Date: 2025-04-25 22:40
From the Klangbogen link provided above, as far as the Klangbogen Bore & Reed stabilizer is concerned, no spectral analysis is available to provide any sort of visual proof to their ad statement: “The Klangbogen™ instantly increases output and depth of tone of the saxophone while stabilizing the extreme ranges of the horn so it speaks with clarity.” To me, imho, this is simply ad hyperbole.
As I look at the spectrum graph of the Lefreque, https://www.lefreque.com, the majority of “spectral level increases” of sound intensity is somewhere around 3db. (Per my visual interpretation.)
In the following link. https://community.blackspectacles.com/t/acoustic-calculation/2199/6, is found the following: “An increase of 3dB doubles the sound intensity but a 10dB increase is required before a sound is perceived to be twice as loud.”
My interpretation of this is that a 3db increase of sound intensity will hardly or just barely be noticeable to the listener’s ears.
The only thing I believe that this device might be able to add to the clarinet tone is to ever so slightly increase the “ping” of the tone.
Just my opinion.
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2025-04-26 00:12
6dB difference is "twice as loud." However, this is purely by the numbers (and precise measure of energy). One would "notice" a 6dB shift. NO ONE would label that as twice as loud......except an audio engineer.
...........Paul Aviles
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Author: Dan Shusta
Date: 2025-04-26 02:10
Hi Paul,
First as to my personal, visual interpreted 3db increase brought about by the Lefreque device, from this article,
https://jlaudio.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/217201737-Doubling-Power-vs-Doubling-Output
I found the following sentence: “A change of 3 dB is accepted as the smallest difference in level that is easily heard by most listeners listening to speech or music.” (The bold was added by me.)
So my guesstimate was wrong. The ping brought about by the use of the Lefreque device would easily be heard by most listeners. I consider that to be a plus for those looking for ping or more ping in their tone.
Now, as to whether 6db or 10db doubles the loudness, hopefully the following article with its accompanying graph will show that 10db is the perceived doubling of loudness: https://sengpielaudio.com/calculator-levelchange.htm.
There appears to be 2 schools of thought: 1) the calculated doubling of loudness and the perceived doubling of loudness. What matters most to me, however, is that the Lefreque device does appear to actually increase the harmonic content by 3db and that increase will be heard not only by the player but also by the listeners.
Just my opinions.
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Author: MarkS
Date: 2025-04-26 13:52
"6dB difference is "twice as loud." However, this is purely by the numbers (and precise measure of energy). One would "notice" a 6dB shift. NO ONE would label that as twice as loud......except an audio engineer."
To clarify a common confusion: For power (rather than voltage), an increase in magnitude by a factor of 10 corresponds to 10 dB, not 20 dB. Sound intensity is power, so an increase in 6 dB increases sound intensity by a factor of 4, not a factor of 2. An increase of 3 dB doubles the power.
Of course, this is not necessarily what a listener perceives.
Mark
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2025-04-26 19:05
So the links can be helpful to a degree (certainly accurate), but I'd further assert that if anyone gets their hands on an audio mixer (board) things become more practically obvious. If your source is just a little too soft, movement up 5 or 6 dB will usually be the fix. Then there is panning. If you take a sound and move it all the way to the left, you will have lost 6dB. The reason to keep that in mind is that you may have gotten a great stereo effect placing that sound off to the side but if it is played back on a mono speaker, all you have is a sound that is half as loud as it was before (or just perceptibly softer, that is, if it was the right balance before it is now just a little too soft).
I hope that's not too arcane. I'm just trying to add practical context.
............Paul Aviles
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Author: SecondTry
Date: 2025-04-27 05:30
Does anyone have a scientific explanation, even if it is only the manufacturer's, of how a device like a Klangbogen or a lefreQue might alter the instrument's sound, all other things equal, as compared to what things would sound like without such devices?
In my "physics for non Physicists" view of the world the energy we exert to push air down a column of every changing length (courtesy of our fingering), that causes a reed to vibrate at different speeds depending on this column's length (and harmonics and partials etc.) seems to be mechanisms that all occur inside the bore.
I'm not calling these devices meritless, I simply don't know, and haven't tried them, but they seem to be based on capturing energy in the mouthpiece that might be lost to the surroundings, back into the instrument, external (??) to the instrument's air column.
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