 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: spikey1973
Date: 2023-07-04 04:30
Hey to all,
I am happy to tell that I am the the proud owner of a.... eh yeah what the heck is this / are these anways???
Oke, this is going to be a bit of a long story, so please bare with me..
I went out today to buy 2e hand, fix her upper clarinet.
I was told that it was a G.H. Huller clarinet.
after i recieved this info (pictures weren't clear enough) I had a look at this thread here
http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/read.html?f=1&i=328551&t=328320
And felt like it would be a nice deal for 40 euro, so I headed there after work on my motorcycle and was caught in a rain storm and arrived soaking wet.
Being there presented with an G.H. Huller instrument I looked at the key work mostly which was a bit off and different, but I assumed (wrongly) that it had to do with it not being a boehm and that it would need to be fixed some how -> goal of the 'project', and it wasn't damaged, just not functioning properly.
Additionally I was offered a second clarinet, clearly a small one (compared to my Bb). I stopped paying attention to the G.H. Huller and looked at a "nice" small clarinet. As I wanted to leave and get home to warm up, considering I still had like close to 100km to ride in the rain storm to get back home I struck a (still good deal) and left.
Finally at home I found mself in the possession of an g.h. huller OBOE,
not a clarinet. This while the original picture of the instrument was clearly a clarinet and not a oboe.. never the less, in hindsight.. doubtfull to be an G.H. Huller, what else? I don't know.. I hope to still find out.
I looked at all his adds and saw that he was also selling the oboe and it was reserved for a slightly higer price then what I got it go for.
Anway, I contacted him and I'll see how thing turn out as he clearly gave the wong intrument by accident , but for now I feel I have the better part of the deal.
Although I am (still) completely unfamiliar with the keyworking of a oboe, I can still see that things are of.. definately not play ready. So it would be a nice to fix up and have also have a different instrument to have a play with (but this would be for the long run ofcourse.. just a possibility).
But back to the original topic of this post..
The second instrument is a G. Rudolf Uebel clarinet, I assumed (wrongly again) to be an Eb clarinet, but looking on it looks more to something like a high G instrument. I looked around and found statements like G. Rudolf Uebel clarinets are the lada's under the clarinets. Not sure how true this is, but it is looks oke made and maybe even play ready and included vandoren reeds.. so after a small clean I can just try it out.
Anyway, there where the mouth piece connects to the clarinet, there is a (ugly, brass) metal insert so the mouthpiece can fit.. but i am not sure, if this is like original, or if the instrument has been modded afterwards.
So basically...
1) what the heck is this? is it indeed a high G clarinet and how common are they?
2) how bad is the brand G. Rudulf uebel really?
It seams to be a wood clarinet and no cracks at all (as far as I saw for now anyways)
3) and mostly.. is this a post production adaptation? As it resides in a box that looks like it should've stored a standard Eb clarinet. Also, it looks like a mod. (brass part in an instrument that is nickle plated on all other parts)
Post Edited (2023-07-05 15:40)
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Author: SunnyDaze
Date: 2023-07-04 16:44
Hi Matthieu,
Did you get a chance to measure the length of the clarinet yet? That might give an idea of what it is. After that I think the next thing is to find out what note comes out when you play a written C.
Jen
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Author: spikey1973
Date: 2023-07-05 05:28
Hey Jen,
Well these are fairly easy questions to answer..
so with no barrel present..
length: 48,8cm = 19.21" from tip of MP to bell,
length: 42,7cm = 16.81" from top of instrument -MP to bell
tone @ written C:= Eb 4 +27 cents -> 458Hz vs 440Hz?
To add, the tenon between upper and lower joint don't hold stable (it wiggles)
and I assume there to be a (large) leak, so bottom joint is basically unable to be played.
It also seems to be an Ohler (or anything related to) clarinet (not too unexpected) with rollers and also doesn't have a bridge key.
The MP is still pretty oke condition (wood) and there are two Vandoren german cut reeds with it hardness 2 (med-soft)
kind greats
Matthieu
Post Edited (2023-07-05 15:38)
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Author: spikey1973
Date: 2023-07-05 15:39
Attachment: Dietz_9_clarinets.jpg (725k)
@ Jdbassplayer
I tend to agree, length wise and tonality wise
(both determining factors, meaning if it sounds like an Eb, it is an Eb ofcourse..)
still there is a small but..
taking a glance at the picture added
it has the design of the high G, partiularly focussing on..the absence of a barrel, the absence of a tenon, the relative extended length between the register key the joints edge (seemingly the length that would otherwise be the tenon is added to the joint) and the absence of a valve on the bell.
or is this something more common / cheaper design version?
kind greats
Matthieu
Post Edited (2023-07-05 15:49)
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Author: jdbassplayer
Date: 2023-07-05 16:06
The design of clarinets can vary considerably between makes and models. For example at different points in history Buffet offered Eb clarinets with 2 body joints and a removable barrel, 1 body joint and a removable barrel and instruments where the only removable section was the bell and mouthpiece. Also note that the Dietz high G clarinet has a 1 piece body whereas your Eb has a middle joint.
-JDbassplayer
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Author: Philip Caron
Date: 2023-07-05 20:22
Hi Matthieu. A G clarinet is either obviously bigger or obviously smaller. The G soprano is a pitched a whole step below an A clarinet and correspondingly longer. A G sopranino clarinet is pitched well above an Eb clarinet and considerably shorter. Here's a vid of an Ab sopranino, which would be larger than a (very rare) G instrument.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EVAI6IdOHAk
Yours looks bigger, and measurements are consistent with an Eb. The way it's sectioned isn't relevant.
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Author: Philip Caron
Date: 2023-07-05 20:30
Sorry for my error above. The G is slightly longer than the Ab instrument depicted. Still short!
Note, some time ago I found reference to an "obsolete" piccolo clarinet pitched an octave above the (also "obsolete") G sopranino instrument. That would be the highest pitched and smallest clarinet ever made, as far as I could find when I made my list. Hard to imagine such being playable by any adult hands.
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Author: clarnibass
Date: 2023-07-05 21:41
>> still there is a small but.. <<
Those are all design/feature variations that can happen with almost any clarinet. The way it plays (i.e. sounding Eb when playing C) is the determining factor regardless of anything else (assuming not using a barrel or mouthpiece that are completely off for the instrument or anything like that).
>> tone @ written C:= Eb 4 +27 cents -> 458Hz vs 440Hz? <<
This is based on only one note playing 27 cents "sharp" (I assume in comparison with 440Hz), with one player, one mouthpiece, possibly one reed, not much else to go by (I don't mean to suggest anything, it's just that from posts it's not possible to know how you are able to assess it).
That said, a note being 27 cents sharper than A=440 is approximately A=447 (or a fraction below). Not anywhere near 458Hz. It might be a higher pitch clarinet (even likely), but not enough to determine that (could be the mouthpiece+player causing it, for example).
Post Edited (2023-07-05 21:42)
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Author: lydian
Date: 2023-07-05 22:31
Keep in mind the OP is a novice and doesn’t yet have the skill to play an Eb clarinet perfectly in tune.
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Author: spikey1973
Date: 2023-07-06 04:07
@ All
Oke the existance of those variations is interesting for me to know, I wasn't aware of this, so thank you!
From written G to C it plays as Bb, A, G, F, Eb, as expected!
All play approx 30+/-5 cents sharp (correctly assumed to be in comparison with 440Hz), with only some minor variation (3-6 cents) between the notes, nothing that wouldn't be able to be adjusted when playing.
This main sharpness is ofcourse adjustable to "in tune" by pulling out the MP 2-3 mm (MP as there is no barrel).
The mouthpiece came (supplied to me) with the instrument, but ofcourse I am not sure if it is from the same maker as the instrument (and/or sold as a set) as there is no name on the MP itself.
And ofcourse, as Lydian mentioned, I am still fairly a novice.. specifically to an Eb instruments so there is also influence by me playing it, but for now I will assume it to be a A=440hz.
Kind greats
Matthieu
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