 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Johnny Galaga
Date: 2022-12-17 07:47
There doesn't seem to be a way to find the names of the orchestra players who record movie music. All you can ever find are just the composer (which I find annoying). Screw the composers. Who are the actual PLAYERS?
You watch a film and the playing is absolute PERFECTION. Spot-on in-tune, nailing every note, brilliant crystal-clear sound. I'm so damn jealous. Who the hell are these people and how on Earth did they get to be that good?
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Author: SebastianB
Date: 2022-12-17 08:32
If an ensemble is not listed by name, i.e. London Symphony Orchestra, then it's likely to be independent session players hired just for the recording. LA session players are notoriously outstanding.
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Author: David H. Kinder
Date: 2022-12-17 08:42
Attachment: 20221216_204140_HDR.jpg (262k)
About 20 years ago or so, there was a magazine called WindPlayer that was published about quarterly. There was an article on how to become a studio musician and earn $200,000 a year doing it (which was certainly a nice sum back then!).
The most noteable studio musician for me is Eddie Daniels who dubbed the clarinet part in The Majestic. I just looked up the IMDB for The Majestic and Eddie Daniels wasn't even listed, even though he's listed in the closing credits.
For Mr. Holland's Opus, I know the groups were mentioned, but not individual musicians.
So if Eddie Daniels isn't even listed, I'm not sure that what you're looking for could even be found?
Getting back into playing after 20 years.
Ridenour AureA Bb clarinet
Vandoren M15 Profile 88 (non-13) mouthpiece
Vandoren Optimum Silver ligature (plate 1)
Vandoren blue-box #3.5 reeds
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2022-12-17 13:45
Crediting musicians in movies is WAY WAY down the list. Look at all the folks and various sub-companies that ARE credited (particularly when there is animation). In fact actors who play non speaking roles (not just having coffee in the background but some interacting with "the talent") often don't get a mention either (not required......they are not much more than furniture to a producer).
...............Paul Aviles
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Author: Hunter_100
Date: 2022-12-17 16:42
Are there different techniques when playing into microphones in a studio compared to a live performance?
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2022-12-18 02:50
Unlike live, it is definitely best to keep movement to a minimum since the distance to the mic is a critical part of the equation. But it is up to the engineers to determine the mic to instrument placement that works best for the session. Also, it helps to have a quiet mechanism to keep extraneous noises out of the mix.
................Paul Aviles
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2022-12-18 13:19
Absolutely.
Session musicians usually don't have the luxury of getting music in advance (such as repertory musicians, your usual subscription orchestras). Granted, much of the film and tv music is not "Stravinsky" but some of it is pretty tricky.
.............Paul Aviles
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Author: donald
Date: 2022-12-18 13:22
Listen to old Disney scores from the 50s/60s... listen to the old Daniel Boone soundtracks (episodes all on youtube). ALL that music was recorded by people sight-reading. If you can learn to read out loud, you can learn to sight-read, it's not that hard.
Over the years I've had to sightread (in performance or recording) numerous film/TV scores, an entire Wagner Opera (Flying Dutchman), the first time I had to play the Elgar Cello concerto it was sight-reading IN A CONCERT... I'm not even half as good as those LA session musicians, but I made it without embarrassing myself. It's a skill that these guys have mastered to a high level, but it's not magic.
Post Edited (2022-12-18 15:58)
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Author: JTJC
Date: 2022-12-18 14:12
Maybe not Stravinsky but . . . . There's a great video on YouTube of a BBC Prom concert where the John Wilson Orchestra play music from Tom and Jerry. It's a top class, hand-picked orchestra. Wind and brass from top classical and Jazz orchestras/ensembles (clarinet from the London Symphony Orchestra). Amongst the rank and file strings are the leaders of several orchestras. No doubt the music was rehearsed but those players are working really hard and concentrating like crazy. When the original soundtrack to those cartoons was done I imagine it was played by session musicians and largely sight read from hand-written scores. The composer would have known the capabilities of those players so you can guess how accomplished they must have been on their instruments and how good their sight-reading.
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Author: Johnny Galaga
Date: 2022-12-18 20:19
I can't even comprehend how good you have to be to do that. I want to look up these musicians just to learn who they are. What are they like? How in God's name does anyone get that good? These players must have some kind of crazy freakish skill level beyond belief. How do they do it?
In High school, we'd practice a handful of songs for several months. And we wouldn't sound anything like these pros just seeing the sheet music for the first. This makes me jealous and upset.
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Author: concertmaster3
Date: 2022-12-19 08:24
My former teacher was one of John Williams's oboists, John Ellis. He was on a lot of films, but only got credited for one, Angela's Ashes, due to the significant amount of solos he played. He also played for Memoirs of a Geisha. There was a DVD extra on that movie, and it showed the orchestra, and John Williams deciding who was going to play the main character's theme. It was down to my teacher, Itzhak Perlman, Yo-Yo Ma and the traditional flute player, Masakazu Yoshizawa.
It was interesting to watch my teacher in action! We've seen him play in the symphony, and in chamber music, but film scores were his calling. He did tell us a lot of stories about the film scores, including having to sight reed a Shostakovich symphony and playing really high notes (High C on oboe, but that because he and the piccolo player were fooling around and seeing who could play the highest...he popped out the equivalent of a high C on piccolo!)
Ron Ford
Woodwind Specialist
Performer/Teacher/Arranger
http://www.RonFordMusic.com
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Author: donald
Date: 2022-12-19 11:27
Johnny, they were ALL students once, they all had to start with Mary had a little lamb. Sure, there are certain kids/students who seem to progress faster than others and in some it DOES seem like some kind of uncanny genius...
But most of them got as good as they are by starting in the same place as everyone else... and then busting their arse.
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2022-12-19 18:34
There is more to it than just putting in the time. There is also the ability to REALLY listen to yourself critically, in the moment. And then you need to assess your weak areas and see if there is another way around the problem. For example: if you have naturally slow muscles that hold your tonguing speed back, you need to move to double tonguing as soon as possible…….for example.
………….Paul AVILES
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Author: ruben
Date: 2022-12-25 14:38
I imagine the great Mitchel Lurie was on the soundtracks of a lot of movies from the 50s, 60s and early 70s.
rubengreenbergparisfrance@gmail.com
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Author: DougR
Date: 2022-12-25 18:58
Well THIS is a fascinating topic for me, and I can contribute a couple of things. first is the website Scoring Sessions.com
( https://www.scoringsessions.com/about )
where you'll find photos and sometimes video of LA scoring sessions--it's hit/miss, so you may not find the particular movie you're curious about, and personnel aren't always listed, but it's fascinating. You can get a bit of a sense who the first-call players are from an immersion into the Scoring Stages website.
(there are still a very very few scoring sessions done in NYC but no website following them that I'm aware of) Also, Scoring Sessions is LA-only; no listings for any of the big scoring orchestras in Europe or the UK.
Also, there used to be a website listing LA studio musicians, run by Gio Washington-Wright. The website no longer works but Gio is on Facebook and he's worth following; a multi-instrumentalist and composer who's also a school band director--great guy, incredibly generous and frequently posts video of scoring sessions and/or west coast big bands when he gets them.
Then there's the LA Recording Musicians Association website, which seems to be a bare-bones directory; it probably wouldn't do you much good unless you wanted to look up a particular musician. Some of the musicians' website links are dead; when I first started following the LA scene I was tracking an entire previous generation of players; there are still some of them around but my knowledge of the current players is pretty stale, I'm afraid. https://directory.rmala.org/members
It's also hit or miss for musician screen credits on individual movies; Clint Eastwood ALWAYS (afaik) credits the musicians in his films; I believe Tom Hanks takes pains to credit musicians in his films too.
In olden times, of course, every major studio had its own scoring orchestra. It's fun to listen to the woodwind-choir version of Alfred Hitchcock's TV show theme and wonder, "Am I listening to Mitchell Lurie?" COULD BE!
Post Edited (2022-12-25 19:02)
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Author: cigleris
Date: 2022-12-25 23:04
I’ve done a few sessions in my career including recently for the King and the recent death of The Queen.
There used to be a website that listed where possible the musicians on the soundtracks especially those fixed in London by Isobel and Gareth. Unfortunately I can’t find it anymore.
Peter Cigleris
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Author: DougR
Date: 2022-12-26 00:07
Yeah, Peter, seems like a number of those sites that were started some years back are going dark--too bad, too, because I'd LOVE to know who was playing on the sound tracks of some of my fave UK shows--Foyle's War and Sgt Lewis to name a couple. Haven't caught "The King" yet, but when I do I'll listen for you!
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Author: cigleris
Date: 2022-12-26 00:57
Thanks DougR but I should add that meant I had recorded on a disc actually for King Charles so I doubt it’ll every be out in the public domain unfortunately.
Peter Cigleris
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Author: vrufino
Date: 2023-01-02 22:40
After my son (French horn) finished his sophomore year at Temple University, he received a full scholarship to attend the Henry Mancini Institute in LA. All students were on scholarship, and they came from around the world. The Mancini estate sponsored this for years with the intent of training future studio musicians and to keep the film scores of Mancini in young peoples consciousness. Each student was mentored by an active studio musician and they spent time at the major studio sound stages. My son had the opportunity to participate in daily rehearsals of the large orchestra and smaller ensembles. In addition, he played for a concert in the Hollywood Bowl backing up jazz singer Diana Krall. Sadly, this institute no longer exists. One of the other benefits was a data base of all the graduates compiled by where they lived, so that employers would have a source of hiring qualified musicians. That son now plays in two union symphony orchestras.
Dr. Vincent J. Rufino
Professor of clarinet and saxophone
St. Elizabeth University
Morristown, NJ
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Author: gwie
Date: 2023-01-03 00:56
My students sometimes ask me what the level of players were like "in the past" especially pertaining to the studio recordings for film. What did they sight-read like?
I like pointing them to this recording, of the first take of Jerry Goldsmith's theme for Star Trek: The Motion Picture on October 23, 1979: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cBRamuDC65w
Post Edited (2023-01-31 17:28)
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Author: A Brady
Date: 2023-01-03 01:16
This is based on union contracts. Pretty much every member of the crew on a shoot gets a listing in the credits, as required by their union. The musicians get great pay and benefits, and are absolutely among the finest in the world, but are largely anonymous, as per the contract.
Smaller, independent films are more likely to list the players, or if there are extensive featured soloists, they will probably be listed, ie, Emily Bernstein in The Terminal, and Itzhak Perlman in Schindler’s List.
AB
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Author: donald
Date: 2023-01-31 15:43
Sometimes you CAN find out, we googled a film once and the clarinet turned out to be someone who had gone to school with my wife...
I have to say, there's a version of the "Bear necessities" (from The Jungle Book) that has an orchestral introduction (not in the movie version) with a pretty slick clarinet solo... have often wondered who did that...
AND while we are on the Jungle Book, "I wanna be like you" (sung by Louis Prima) has awesome Jazz Ocarina playing going on, for years I've wondered if there was some studio flute player/doubler who just happened to be an ocarina virtuoso... or if they got a specialist in etc
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Author: jim sclater
Date: 2023-01-31 18:14
Does anyone know who the clarinetist is on the soundtrack to "All Creatures Great and Small," now showing on PBS Masterpiece Theater?
jsclater@comcast.net
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Author: donald
Date: 2023-02-01 03:26
Is that the original TV series from the 80s or is the newer one? As a 13 year old I was madly in love with Helen!
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Author: jim sclater
Date: 2023-02-01 18:05
Donald, it's the newer one. (Rachel Shenton is a stunning Helen, too!) The clarinetist on those tracks just has a beautiful sound.
jsclater@comcast.net
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Author: Paul Globus
Date: 2023-02-01 20:03
Without a doubt, one of the greatest session / studio musicians of the 20th century was the amazing Al Gallodoro.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al_Gallodoro
In his heyday, he performed live solos on the radio, on saxophone and clarinet, two or three times a week. That's right, live solos on the radio several times a week! You can hear some of those live solo recordings (including the Brahms Clarinet Quintet) on CD complications such as this one, titled "The Many Sides of Al Gallodoro"
http://www.algallodoro.com/buy-music.html
He was true phenomenon. Classical or jazz, his performances were always out of this world both technically and stylistically. I had a brief correspondence with him in his later years (he lived well into his nineties and played his last gig less than a week before he died). He told me that the Brahms Quintet recording referenced above was virtually a sight-reading session. So was his recording of Chopin's Fantasy Impromtu for clarinet on the same disc -- listen and weep.
To what did Al Gallodoro attribute is supreme mastery of the saxophone and the clarinet? I asked him that question and he told me it wasn't really about talent but rather because he simply liked to practice.
Something to think about there.
Paul Globus
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