 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: TomS
Date: 2022-03-23 22:25
Having a couple of blackwood Backun Protege clarinets sent my way for evaluation. Can't get the Beta models right now ...
I've been a lucky dog for the last few months and have had the opportunity to play principal in our community band ... we play outdoors often and I use an Alpha, (or a Ridenour 576 or Libertas). Looking for something with a little more "core" sound than the Alpha, but similar playing characteristics for indoors ...
The first Protege I played years ago was not good, but I suspect someone stuck a swap in the bore and in the process of trying to remove it, scratched things up ...
I love my Alpha, apparently the keywork is very similar to the Protege, and I have hopes that the acoustics are of the same family, as well.
Also, I've noticed that on all Alpha's, the RH little finger A/E-flat and G/C keys are lower and at a a slant in respect to the F/C-sharp and E/B keys ... I had to bend the crows foot quite a bit to "fix" this ... Does the Protege have similar "problems"?
So, anyone out there playing the Protege clarinets with aplomb? These made a splash a few years ago ... wondering if still a popular clarinet.
Tom
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Author: cigleris
Date: 2022-03-24 02:02
It’s a great clarinet and definitely worth it. If your budget can stretch the Q series would also be worthy of consideration.
Disclaimer I’m a Backun artist
Peter Cigleris
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Author: TomS
Date: 2022-03-24 02:23
Well ... I just had the chance, just a few minutes ago to play one of the Protege clarinets. Higher pitched than my Alpha with same MP and reed. With tuner set to 442, barrel pulled for in-tune thumb F, clarion B,C and D were still about 15-25 cents sharp. Pulled middle joint about 1mm and still very sharp. Checking the upper clarion register, the high B and C were quite flat. Noted other problems elsewhere. Not good. Much worse than any of my other clarinets.
This seemed to be an old production model that has been in inventory for several years, so don't know what kind of care has been taken. Might be a dud that was warped or damaged in some way, and they couldn't sell it ...
MP was Reserve Evolution/440 with Evolution #3 reed.
Nice sound though. Plays really well. If the pitches were closer, I'd bought it ...
We have a community band made up of older musicians, (one guy in the sax section is about to turn 100). So, we tend to tune, unfortunately, at about 438. A problem for a 442 pitched instrument. I try to tune to 440, usually.
I've played the Q and really liked it, but didn't check the tuning ... might have to have one shipped to me, as the local dealer has very little except kids klarinets.
Tom
Post Edited (2022-03-24 06:37)
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Author: gwie
Date: 2022-03-24 07:55
I have an Alpha for outdoor gigs, and I put one of their grenadilla Fatboy barrels on it, and it adds a satisfying amount of "core" for those playing situations.
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Author: TomS
Date: 2022-03-24 09:45
The Protege had much, much smoother blowing resistance from note to note, a warmer sound, etc. than the Alpha. Probably a lot more to this than just the material. I suspect the tone hole placement and undercutting (and possibly overcutting?) is very different. Workmanship was excellent, but this instrument had "been around the block" a few times ... I worry about clarinets that have been store demonstrators not being properly broken in, swabbed and oiled. This one also had some mechanical adjustment issues.
A 2nd Protege should be headed my way ... I have high hopes but afraid that it might be the "dud" that I played a few years back.
I might have to go to a bigger dealer, like Kessler and Sons to provide a truly new one in perfect working order. I wanted to do business locally, but the music business here is so weak ... might have to call Dave.
I am tempted to just order a Yamaha CSVR, as those are nice and at a nice price. Actually, if memory serves, despite the tuning issues, the Protege played and sounded better. Morrie Backun has a touch of genius making wooden instruments.
Or I could ask Ted Ridenour to let me audition the new Libertas II.
Too many good choices, but I don't see another Buffet purchase for me ...
Tom
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Author: cigleris
Date: 2022-03-24 23:15
Tom I would suggest that the barrel was short, did you check the length? For good 440 tuning you’ll need a 65 or 66. You mention that it was out of regulation, that could have had an impact.
Peter Cigleris
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Author: seabreeze
Date: 2022-03-24 23:16
If you're looking for a relatively inexpensive clarinet that has lots of core in the sound, don't overlook the Uebel Advantage, which goes retail new for about $3028. That's against $3300 for a new Yamaha CSVR.
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Author: TomS
Date: 2022-03-25 07:33
Peter
Well ... I pulled at the barrel, so if simply just too short, this should have effectively lengthed it. Oh, I know it's not exactly the same thing as adding a longer barrel, but in the ballpark.
On most instruments, after a good 20 minute warmup in a 72-degree room, I pull the barrel and check the thumb F. This usually means that the open G is sharp (with no fingers down) and adding 1 & 3 or 1, 2 & 3 fingers of the RH will lower the pitch and improve resonance. The pinch E will be flat and lacking resonance, so throwing open the C-sharp key will fix that. I'll check the throat A and B-flat for pitch ... I almost always use resonance fingers on these notes, so I'll see how those tune ...
Next, I check the clarion C, which is usually a bit high, so I pull the center joint slightly, and possibly the bell (if the low F is not too flat). The clarion D is usually higher on most instruments, even after the center joint pull.
Some instruments have the pads over the tone holes too high, causing the pitch to be higher than necessary with still having good clarity ... I forgot to check this.
I'll then test the upper clarion B and C (sometimes a bit flat).
Once a find a MP, reed and amount of joint pulling, I'll often install tuning rings and test the tuning ...
I just couldn't find any combination that didn't have considerable anomalies.
Otherwise, I love this sound and response! I have played the Q ... right now, you can't get these in Blackwood (?) ... As I remember, it was extra nice ...
I think I'm gonna have to just "bite the bullet" and commit to the Protege or Q from a good dealer that will set these up properly, and just find my own way on the tuning. Maybe the Reserve Evolution just hates this clarinet ... although it works fantastically with the Alpha.
BTW, Peter, I've been listening to some of your recordings (you need to post more!) and very impressed with your playing!
Tom
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