 The Clarinet BBoard
|
Author: Matt74
Date: 2020-07-16 19:18
Has anyone ordered pads from Prestini through “arizonawwandb”? Pads are much cheaper, and in bulk, so I was wondering if they are seconds or something.
- Matthew Simington
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: jdbassplayer
Date: 2020-07-16 20:23
They've messed up my order the past 2 times, and the pads they sent me for my basset horn did not seal and had to send me roo pads instead. To their credit though every time I have had a problem they have been very helpful and polite and the replacement pads they send me are usually quite good. I've also ordered sheepskin sax pads from them that were very good
That being said, I have had some major quality problems from other vendors like Music Medic and Instrument Clinic. As of right now the best leather pads for clarinet I can find are available from Zheng Hao music:
http://zhmelody.com/
The fact that the major pad manufacturers in the US can't compete with the quality from a Chinese company with tons of spelling errors on their website is just sad. The leather pads from Zheng Hao are dirt cheap yet are usually quite high in quality and seal perfectly. I hate the fact that I have to buy directly from China, but until US manufacturers start putting more focus on quality there really isn't a better option I've found.
-Jdbassplayer
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: jdbassplayer
Date: 2020-07-16 20:35
Attachment: FE99FDEC-E015-467F-AA41-C5BA02606614.jpeg (1039k)
From left to right: Instrument Clinic, Prestini, Music Medic and Zheng Hao. The two pads on the left do not seal at all and the Music Medic seals okay but only when coated with paraffin wax. Only the Zheng Hao has a near perfect seal, coming close to cork or synthetic.
Edit: and to clarify these are just random pads I pulled out of the bag. There are better and worse examples from each manufacturer, but the Chinese ones are the most consistently good.
-Jdbassplayer
Post Edited (2020-07-16 20:41)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Hurstfarm
Date: 2020-07-16 22:26
Interesting comparison. So, a dumb question: if there’s a choice between grained leather or smooth to seal what will ideally be a perfectly flat tone hole rim, why would a manufacturer opt for the former? Surely smooth must increase the chances of getting a good deal, other things being equal?
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Matt74
Date: 2020-07-17 04:05
JD, The pic and comments are very helpful! Thanks.
I was hoping someone might be able to compare www.prestiniusa.com with their postings through what appears to be their store on a certain auction site. The difference might just be wholesale vs. retail, but IDK.
- Matthew Simington
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: clarnibass
Date: 2020-07-17 08:01
>> That being said, I have had some major quality problems from other vendors like Music Medic and Instrument Clinic. As of right now the best leather pads for clarinet I can find are available from Zheng Hao music <<
Have you tried pads made by Music Center? None of the ones you mentioned are made by them. They are from Italy, but sold by some American suppliers like Kraus, J.L. Smith, Allied and Ferree's.
They have many models and suppliers can ask for any spec, so even the same name might not be exactly the same.
They are the best pads I've tried and I've been using them for years (tried many others occasionally, never wuth a reason to change).
Some of their models (like the ones I use for clarinet sometimes) have a plastic layer under the skin too.
It's hard to tell much from a photo like this, but I'd say the texture of the Music Center pads is anything from the right most one (or even smoother) to the one next to it... but they pretty much always seal (there's the rare defective pad from any maker... but it's extremely rare with Music Center).
For whatever reason, even the ones that look like they have a pretty significant texture always seal just fine with a very light touch.
Post Edited (2020-07-18 07:43)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Steven Ocone
Date: 2020-07-17 17:45
I use Ferree's. They seal and are smooth, have a level of firmness I like (good for a variety of situations), but can get sticky. And are definitely more expensive.
I believe the grain of the leather has to do with the animal and the age of the animal.
Steve Ocone
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Matt74
Date: 2020-07-17 22:28
Clarnibass, I had problems ordering from Music Center - not their fault. It’s worth another try.... What models do you like?
Steve, I ordered 100 from Ferrees. I *think* they were B21s. I really liked the way they were made, they sit in the cups real nice, but the felts were too thick. What model do you buy? I’m going to need a bunch, for both student and nicer horns (and flutes).
- Matthew Simington
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Matt74
Date: 2020-07-18 01:15
I called Prestini. They said that both “arizonawwandbrass” and “prefina” are legit and sell real Prestini pads, but neither are Prestini themselves. “Arizonawwandbrass” sells overstock. “Arizonawwandbrass” did not answer a message I left them. IDK why “prefina” is cheaper. My impression is that they are both probably fine, but you can be sure to get exactly what you want on the Prestini site.
I was told that Prestini uses different thickness felt for different thickness pads, and you can do a custom order of 100 pads.
- Matthew Simington
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: clarnibass
Date: 2020-07-18 08:37
>> Steve, I ordered 100 from Ferrees. I *think* they were B21s. I really liked the way they were made, they sit in the cups real nice, but the felts were too thick. What model do you buy? I’m going to need a bunch, for both student and nicer horns (and flutes). <<
Most of their pads are made by Music Center. Maybe except the Norbecks and I'm not sure about the De'jurs (Music Center has no pads with that name, but it could be a name Ferree's made for a certain pad model they have from Music Center... I don't know).
The thing with Music Center pads sold by Ferree's or any of the other supplier, is they order a specific model, or ask for specs, so might not be exactly the same as any model direct from Music Center.
The B21s seem to be a "basic" bladder model, but who knows if it's more similar to the Mypads, or the Premium Deluxe, two models which are quite different (I far prefer the Premium Deluxe). Or maybe a different model entirely.
>> Clarnibass, I had problems ordering from Music Center - not their fault. It’s worth another try.... What models do you like? <<
It depends. If I'm doing a repad or overhaul, I generally prefer Valentino Masters now. Music Center also has a synthetic model now, both the "regular" one, which is sort of between a Greenback and Masters, and the plastic covered model, which so far I don't really like, though it's very good, nothing against its quality.
I mostly stopped using stepped bladder pads. The model I liked most was Premium Deluxe (or Lucien Deluxe models sold by some suppliers is pretty similar... but not always, or the models from Kraus with no name are also very good, slightly different too). Even though I prefer their feel, they usually don't last as long. That is, some players still have them and they are fine after a decade, but occasionally they might not even last two years (depending on many things) while synthetic pads would last longer in the same situation.
The leather pads I use are mostly Premium Deluxe too. They have the plastic disc between the skin and the felt.
You can get more or less similar pads from J.L. Smith, maybe Votaw, possibly some other places (from memory... it's been some years since I've ordered Music Center pads through them).
The B33 from Ferree's seem to be the closest to that, but I don't know if or how they are different.
By the way, Music Center also makes an imitation leather pad, made of microfiber, that is better IMO, but only special order directly from them (or I guess a supplier would get them for a large order). I'm vegan and try to use as few animal products as possible. I've changed everything other than pads so far (luckily synthetic and plant products are at least as good or better for all other uses). However it still uses wool felt. There's probably a synthetic felt version, just like there is for real leather pads, but I don't like it for pads... If synthetic felt was as good or better than real felt I would make the effort to stock these...
Post Edited (2020-07-19 08:29)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Steven Ocone
Date: 2020-07-18 17:06
I order the B32 and B33 pads. They have a woven felt and so are softer than some others. I also use them for bassoons.
I also use synthetic pads on bass clarinets, but it's very tricky. The larger the pad, the more likely it gets pulled out and thrown away.
Steve Ocone
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: David Spiegelthal ★2017
Date: 2020-07-19 04:53
Ferree's pads have worked well for me for 30-some years.
People get ridiculous over pads. All pads have to do is seal the hole. It isn't that hard. Many materials work just fine. The technician has to seat the pad properly. That is all.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: ruben
Date: 2020-07-19 16:54
David: do you not believe that pads have acoustic properties; that they impart a certain tone? Some people do; some don't. I don't know what to believe any more.
rubengreenbergparisfrance@gmail.com
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Tony F
Date: 2020-07-19 17:51
Speaking only for myself, I don't find a great deal of difference between pads of various types with the exception of cork pads, which to my ears sound different to other pads. Whether this is because of the pad itself or the reflecting surface it offers over an open tone hole I'm not sure.
Tony F.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: David Spiegelthal ★2017
Date: 2020-07-20 03:33
Ruben, I don't believe that anyone but the "golden ears" people (those who claim, for example, to be able to audibly differentiate between thinner and thicker loudspeaker wires in their stereo systems, or believe that key plating material on clarinets affects the sound) could 'perceive' a difference in sound between pad materials. And I personally believe those people are just fooling themselves.
The impact sound of a pad closing, however, is verifiably audible and this may be the "cork pad" effect Tony F has noted.
It would take a whole bunch of double-blind tests to prove or disprove my assertion. To do that properly, for each trial you'd have to take the SAME clarinet/mouthpiece/reed/player combination, play a bunch of music in front of a large audience behind a screen, IMMEDIATELY change all the pads to those of a different material, and repeat the test. Many repetitions, with the pad materials changed in a randomized order. Of course every pad would have to seal perfectly every time, and open to the same height to exactly duplicate the venting of each note (very important!). Clearly such a test will never happen.
So, players will believe what they want to believe, and nobody can really say they're wrong or right.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Steven Ocone
Date: 2020-07-20 17:12
I believe that cork pads, properly installed project more. Whether that is desirable for the specific clarinet and player is a different question. Cork pads create more key noise, especially after they've been on for awhile.
I went to a clinic where a sax was altered so that just the resonators could be changed. Virtually everyone in the room could hear a difference. The set-up a person preferred mostly had to do with what area the room they were sitting in.
Steve Ocone
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: ruben
Date: 2020-07-20 17:22
David: I'm pretty sure you're right. -certainly well-argued.
rubengreenbergparisfrance@gmail.com
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
The Clarinet Pages
|
 |
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
