 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: BaconLord
Date: 2020-02-04 22:54
Hello,
I have a few questions regarding the Copland Concerto.
I have chosen it for grad school auditions and have always been troubled with interpretation.
There’s some people that play it “straight through” while others jazz it up a little bit. I like both interpretations but I cannot put finger on one.
What do you guys think, especially for grad school auditions?
If I were to play the more jazzy version, my additions are straight from recordings of the pros, including Anthony McGill, Patrick Messina, Eddie Daniels, etc.
But I also like the simplicity of Rusinek’s and Neidich’s recordings...
Help me choose and what would be appropriate for college auditions!
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Author: rmk54
Date: 2020-02-04 23:25
Why don't you listen to the Benny Goodman recording with Copland conducting? I would imagine that comes closest to what the composer intended.
IMO, not as jazzy as one might imagine. I think Copland was more inspired by Brazilian music than jazz for this particular piece.
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Author: brycon
Date: 2020-02-05 04:49
I think any teacher who wouldn't admit someone solely because they either jazzed-up or didn't jazz-up the Copland isn't a teacher with whom I'd want to study. I also think a good teacher wouldn't be looking for your version of Anthony McGill's or Eddie Daniels's version of the Copland: he or she would be looking to see what you have to say.
The Copland, of course, was recorded by Copland and Goodman in a pretty straight-forward way. I think it says something that the King of Swing doesn't swing the Copland. For me, the feel of the piece is much more in the accents--similar to South American music--than in the eighth-note feel or any added jazz inflections. But if I were listening to an audition and a student played a beautiful Copland--super legato in the opening, singing phrases, impeccable intonation, great rhythm and technique in the cadenza, etc.--and also jazzed-up the piece, I would definitely admit him or her.
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Author: duxburyclarinetguy
Date: 2020-02-05 05:02
There is a recording of Harold Wright performing this at Tanglewood that is a wonderful example of his legato playing and his ability to "swing" at the appropriate time.
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Author: Ed
Date: 2020-02-05 06:00
I much prefer if a player does not try to play it as if it is jazz. Maybe a little inflection can be used here and there, but I never thought of it as a jazz piece, in the same way that Copland's Billy the Kid or Rodeo are not country or folk music.
I always liked Goodman's recording and felt that with the composer conducting it gives us a pretty good sense of his intent. I agree with the assessment of Wright's recording. Another recording worth checking out is Bill Blount's recording
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o8B4DzoWmtk
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Author: JohnP
Date: 2020-02-06 01:03
There was a story I heard once that Copland told Jack Brymer that he, Copland, didn’t like the way Benny Goodman played the concerto, he thought it was too straight, preferring the way Jack played it. Maybe it’s in one of Jack’s books, I don’t know where I heard it now but it certainly wasn’t first hand. It’s probably worth taking with a pinch of salt. Has anybody else heard this tale?
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Author: donald
Date: 2020-02-06 02:40
When I studied this with Ron de Kant (who had performed it with Copeland conducting) I was told that Copeland had said, when asked about swing in the 2nd movement, "why not, if you can make it work". Mr de Kant told me he never felt it needed it, and Copeland complimented him on the performance (he wrote on Mr de Kant's solo part, and this lived on the studio wall for many years!). Which, at the end of the day, means nothing.
Larry Combs told me that if I was to swing, to make it more like a Charlston feeling (ie, lots of syncopation, but light on the swing and with a more "clean" feeling). He may have suggested something else to other students, who knows?
Maybe that's helpful.
dn
ps- I personally don't feel a great need to swing in this piece, it sounds fine without it.
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Author: Bob Bernardo
Date: 2020-02-06 03:06
I've played this wonderful piece several times. I didn't play it under Copland, but I did talk to him about it around 1977. Aaron was 77 years old then. Born in 1900 and live until he hit 100.
He was disappointed how most players were handling it. These are more or less his words - "I wrote this piece for Benny Goodman. We grew up in NYC and we loved the New York City Swing band era, in the 1940's. Even Benny played it too fast."
So he wants a big band jazz feel. Every time I've played this I got a standing ovation, probably because of the slower jazz feel and not articulating the cadenza at 240! Big band music was a dancing tempo. So play it whatever way you wish, fast or the way Aaron wanted it played. Surely commit yourself to the style you want and don't hold back or switch the style around trying to show off your fast fingers and fast articulation, then go back to a jazz feel. Don't. Please don't. It might keep you out of grad school.
Check out Eddie Daniels on youtube. He had a blast playing it.
Cheers! Good luck with your audition.
Designer of - Vintage 1940 Cicero Mouthpieces and the La Vecchia mouthpieces
Yamaha Artist 2015
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Author: GBK
Date: 2020-02-06 03:41
Bob Bernardo wrote:
> I've played this wonderful piece several times. I didn't play
> it under Copland, but I did talk to him about it around 1977.
> Aaron was 77 years old then.
> Born in 1900 and lived until he hit 100
until he hit 90.
...GBK
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Author: seabreeze
Date: 2020-02-06 04:46
Donald,
I studied with Ron deKant in the early 1960s when he was with the New Orleans Philharmonic. deKant had an interesting learning curve with the Copland Concerto. He gave a performance in New Orleans that he wasn't satisfied with and then spent considerable time reconsidering how he wanted to play the piece. Do you have the vinyl LP recording deKant did of the Copland with the CBC Vancouver Chamber Orchestra under John Avison (CBC Radio Canada SM317)? By then, he and the concerto were "on the same page." Ron was proud that he had received praise from guest conductor Pablo Casals for getting a tricky rhythm in some piece (by a Latin American composer?) just right the first time, and I know he must have cross-questioned Copland extensively on how to approach the concerto. In New Orleans, some of Ron's students were telling him to jazz up the clarinet line, but I always thought it should be played as a bucolic South of the Border song and dance with a few obvious North American infusions. A jazz composition, it certainly isn't.
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Author: cigleris
Date: 2020-02-06 19:55
JohnP that was probably Gervase. He played it with Copland conducting
Peter Cigleris
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Author: Bob Bernardo
Date: 2020-02-06 21:30
GBK, thank you for correcting me.
Designer of - Vintage 1940 Cicero Mouthpieces and the La Vecchia mouthpieces
Yamaha Artist 2015
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Author: GBK
Date: 2020-02-07 01:43
John Moses, who played it for a movie score with Copland conducting, wrote about his experience numerous times:
From http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/read.html?f=1&i=184836&t=184698:
The Copland Concerto has always felt jazzy to me, and that's why I "swung" some sections of the piece for Copland when we worked together on the film project. He liked the little bit of swing I tried, and it seemed to work for the film. After he watched the spot, and listened to the playback, he liked my style, and suggested I do more.
I've played the Concerto quite a few times, and I change my "jazz feel" from time to time. I think the piece has grown since it was written, and passed through many fine clarinetist's hands. Copland was charming, and liked creativity and change from musicians. He enjoyed the "jazzy style" I brought to our time together working on the Concerto. I think Aaron Copland understood "jazzy style" better than any of us mere mortals.
There are numerous threads on this topic. Search 'John Moses Copland' for lots more.
...GBK
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Author: JasonOlney
Date: 2020-02-07 20:29
Sharon Kam is the one for me. (https://youtu.be/SwibyWRI3FY)
Listen to lots of recordings, but I don't think there's a wrong or right way to do it. I personally don't find Benny Goodman's performance particularly inspiring, but that's just me. How do you like to play? And what about your personal approach do you want to highlight?
One the one hand, interpreting music well requires considering the goals of the composer. On the other hand, you have functional questions about how to highlight your strengths. If it's for grad auditions, that function may be more important (remembering that your committee will have their own tastes and preferences). Like Bob B said- be convincing of what choices you make.
And play for lots of people.
Best of luck and happy practicing!
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