 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: jayhong426
Date: 2017-02-13 09:03
So I got a new clarinet (buffet crampon festival Bb) a few days ago and I've been having trouble with assembling/disassembling the clarinet. It assembles well until it hits the wood part of the tenon, it gets really hard to put it. and when I disassemble the clarinet, its really hard to take it off. I am worried because I dont want to bend the keys, but i have to use alot of strength to take it off. the top part of the upper joint is fine, but the lower part of upper joint and lower part of lower joint has problems putting on and off. Although i play for a long time, (3x 30 minutes of playing and 1 hour of rests) I always swab it out and put it away. Everytime I assemble the clarinet and after I disassemble it, I use cork grease to see if it helps or not. The problem has been happening since I got it and its been 2 weeks. The same thing happened for my previous clarinet and for my previous clarinet, i got it sanded but the upper and lower joint was unstable and wobbled a bit when i pulled it out. Does this happen to most new clarinets? I dont really want to bend and ruin my new and expensive clarinet so what can i do?
Post Edited (2017-02-13 09:29)
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Author: clarnibass
Date: 2017-02-13 11:33
I don't know if I would say "most", but it does happen with a lot of new clarinets. The area where it gets stuck needs to be turned down slightly. Just in the last few weeks I had to adjust this on a few new Buffet clarinets.
Since that area swells a little you can't have zero wiggle. The joint needs to have the smallest amount of play that would still allow it to not get stuck when playing.
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Author: Tony F
Date: 2017-02-13 19:05
Buffet clarinets seem to be particularly prone to this. If your clarinet is still under warranty then take it back to the dealer for rectification, as it may void your warranty if you do it yourself. If it's out of warranty you need to get the end section of the tenon turned down slightly. I've successfully done this myself without a lathe using a diamond nail file very carefully.
Tony F.
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Author: Ed Palanker
Date: 2017-02-13 19:21
That usually happens in the warm humid season with a new clarinet. I've had to "sand" many clarinet joints for my students over the years. A very little at a time constantly trying the fit so not to over sand. I'd use a thin piece of light sand paper, having the student hold the joint and turning it to get an even sanding. It also depends if the swelling is on the front or the back part of the cork. In any care, it's easy to do but must be done carefully and slowly. Of course a decent tech will do it for you if you're not comfortable doing it yourself.
ESP eddiesclarinet.com
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Author: kdk ★2017
Date: 2017-02-13 19:27
Tony F wrote:
> you need to get the end
> section of the tenon turned down slightly.
Is it always the end of the tenon binding in the bottom of the socket? Or can it sometimes the opposite - bottom of the tenon (at the shoulder) binding in the end of the socket? And if it can be either, how can you tell for sure which it is?
It would be good if there were some kind of colored marker material you could put at each end of either the socket of the tenon to see where it's rubbing onto the other. But I'd be concerned that the tolerances are close enough that the thickness of the marking agent itself might aggravate the problem.
Karl
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2017-02-14 00:48
You don't need to have much wood removed from the tenon rings to make the difference between binding, fitting well and wobbling, so have it done properly instead of blindly sanding things down if you don't know what you're doing.
I skim just the high spots on the tenon rings where they bind in the sockets to achieve a good fit that neither binds nor rocks when assembled - only removing wood dust and no more.
I never turn the socket rings down as that will remove far too much wood if overdone (and that's easy to overdo) and sanding will risk rounding the tenon rings off or leaving them uneven or hollowed if done badly, so don't do either of those unless you want to ruin the tenons and then have to get them sleeved when they end up wobbling.
Have it done properly by a woodwind specialist as they'll know exactly where and how much of the surface of the tenon rings to remove.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: kdk ★2017
Date: 2017-02-14 02:55
Chris P wrote:
> I skim just the high spots on the tenon rings where they bind
> in the sockets to achieve a good fit that neither binds nor
> rocks when assembled - only removing wood dust and no more.
>
> I never turn the socket rings down as that will remove far too
> much wood if overdone (and that's easy to overdo) and sanding
> will risk rounding the tenon rings off or leaving them uneven
> or hollowed if done badly, so don't do either of those unless
> you want to ruin the tenons and then have to get them sleeved
> when they end up wobbling.
>
Chris, this confuses me.
First, in the case of a barrel that's binding on the top tenon, what if the particular barrel is the only one that binds? Won't taking the tenon down make all the properly fitting barrel sockets too loose? And why will sanding the socket (of the barrel) have any effect on the tenon at all?
If we're talking only about a middle joint, so the two pieces in question are specific to each other, I understand a little more clearly why you would always work on the tenon and not the socket. But still, if you turn down the socket, why will it round the tenon? Just from the resulting wobble alone?
Karl
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2017-02-14 03:40
I don't understand your confusion.
Why are you confusing things the original poster hasn't even mentioned?
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: clarnibass
Date: 2017-02-14 10:52
>> Is it always the end of the tenon binding in the bottom of the socket? Or can it sometimes the opposite - bottom of the tenon (at the shoulder) binding in the end of the socket? And if it can be either, how can you tell for sure which it is? <<
It can be either, or sometimes both, though the inner end of the tenon getting stuck in the outer end of the socket is a lot more common.
To find which, when you insert the tenon and it almost always gets difficult at the end, which means the problem is at the (more common) inner tenon end. Sometimes you feel the friction immediately (any time before the inner tenon end is getting into the socket), which means the outer tenon end has a problem.
This covers about 99.9% of the cases. When not, you can assemble them, remove (try not to turn too much when inserting and removing) and check where there are shiny areas. These are where they touch. If the tenon is already too shiny from before, you can rough the tenon shoulders with relatively fine sand paper (just slightly to remove the shine, but rough enough to not polish it). One turn with sand paper around it is usually enough.
You can also measure, telescoping gauges and micrometer (or caliper) is much more accurate than necessary.
The no wiggle without cork approach depends on how you feel the wiggle. If inserting the tenon all the way in, the shoulder at the end of the tenon and/or the socket will help a lot against it. Any wobble then is almost impossible to feel (only to the side). If not inserting it all the way and you can't really feel any wiggle when angling the parts slightly, then it is close to zero play and will get stuck as soon as you play.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2017-02-14 17:35
Buffet Festivals have metal tipped tenons - these are usually too narrow to cause any binding issues within the socket, but they're also too narrow to offer stability.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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