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 Rico/D'addario/Boveda humidipaks
Author: PeterinToronto 2017
Date:   2016-01-17 10:15

Hi everyone,

I've been using the 72% humidity packages in the Rico/D'addario plastic reed cases, and am getting ready to re-order the inserts. Here in Toronto reeds tend to warp quite easily (at least mine do) with the variable weather conditions and indoor heating. I'm curious about others' experience with the different humidity levels available (58%, 72, 84%) and if anyone has an idea how I could do a bit better with the warpage.

Thanks a lot,

Peter

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 Re: Rico/D'addario/Boveda humidipaks
Author: CEC 
Date:   2016-01-17 22:38

Hi Peter,

Perhaps trying the next step up? I think it's 83%.

Best of Luck!

Chris

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 Re: Rico/D'addario/Boveda humidipaks
Author: Jim22 
Date:   2016-01-18 07:16

I use the 58% ones. I found the higher humidity levels caused mildew.

Jim C.
CT, USA

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 Re: Rico/D'addario/Boveda humidipaks
Author: sfalexi 
Date:   2016-01-18 07:22

Out of curiosity, how thoroughly do you dry your reeds before replacing them back in the reed case?

I'm not in Toronto and it's been a long time since I've been in such a cold climate, but in general, I use my thumb and forefinger to "squeegee" as much spit as possible from the Reed before replacing it. I think the warping is more of an effect of it drying unevenly from areas of the tip than an effect of it being stored with or without humidity. So I try to make it as dry as possible, quickly, before any evaporation takes place.

So far so good....

Alexi

US Army Japan Band

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 Re: Rico/D'addario/Boveda humidipaks
Author: WhitePlainsDave 
Date:   2016-01-18 18:20

Maybe it's best we identify what causes your problem, even if already known, before we talk solutions.

Ask even your experienced clarinetists why we wet cane and they'll look at you like you have 3 heads and respond something akin to "because it makes the reed easier to play."

But press them much beyond this answer as to cause and don't be surprised if either no, or a wrong answer is furnished.

http://www.doitpoms.ac.uk/tlplib/wood/water_effect.php

The pliability or flexibility of wood increases when exposed to water because the hydrogen bonds that give wood strength break apart somewhat, given the hydrogen's greater affinity for water. The reverse occurs, but not in its entirety, when the reed dries.

This helps explain the useless of wetting synthetic reeds, beyond perhaps the adhesive properties that the water can provide, temporarily "gluing" the synthetic to the mouthpiece until the ligature can be attached.

Sadly for us though, the reed doesn't dry evenly. And the wood's polymer chain's reformation, as hydrogen is given up by evaporating water, back into these chains to strengthen them, causes small changes to the wood's shape, that adjacent sections of the reed, wetter and more pliable, accommodate, a.k.a. warpage.

===

Once wet, it's easier for us to keep the reed moist, than manage its even drying, or even its even rewetting.

===

With the science behind us, your reeds are warping Peter, as if I have to tell you, because they are drying (too much), and drying unevenly.

While I can't easily help you with the latter's uneveness, I can help you to prevent it from happening.


I suggest you:

- Buy Humidity packs directly, online, from Boveda rather than Rico, who simply rebrands the Bovedas. Boveda "moves" more humidity controlled product than Rico and you're more likely to get fresher product--although packs are well wrapped from either vendor and have good shelf life.

- Label your packs opening dates. Change them when they dry out. Don't hesitate to use more packs per volume of humidified area, recognizing that one 84% pack is not a substitute for two 58% packs in one enclosure.

- Use good enclosure. A well closed good quality plastic bag's all that's needed here.

- Recognize that the more reeds per enclosure, even holding enclosure size constant, the more humidity packs needed.

- Wet reeds with tap water after use. Not only will this rinse off saliva, which has properties that help digest (molecularly break apart) things, including cane, (this preserving reed life) but this will help keep the reed moist prior to storage.

Get rid of excess water on the reed from this process, but don't dry it off.

Finally, practice more ([wink]). It will not only make you a better player, but perhaps play will become easier as the drying cycle will be reduced in time.

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 Re: Rico/D'addario/Boveda humidipaks
Author: kdk 2017
Date:   2016-01-19 03:12

Dave, I know we've been through this before. With all respect, my only reason for rehashing this is to say that, apparent (but maybe incomplete) scientific evidence or not, there is not at this point a single valid solution to the problem of warped reeds (other than to make them from a synthetic material).

You give a detailed chemical explanation to justify your advice about this, but the empirical, practical experience I've had is that my reeds don't warp because they dry out, but they do warp when the flat sides' exposure to the air is restricted as they dry, as by laying them against glass. I understand your explanation and can't argue the science with you. I can only assume some additional part of the process is missing from your description.

Or maybe it's just that you (and others) and I have differing views on how difficult ("it's easier for us to keep the reed moist, than manage its even drying, or even its even rewetting") we find using those humidity packs compared to just drying the reeds upside down (or keeping them in a holder that stores reeds on their edges).

My completely empirical experience is that my reeds, dried flat side up, don't warp and that reeds I keep humidified over time become unresponsive and must be regularly readjusted to maintain response. I have no molecular explanation for any of this - it's what I personally experience.

Karl



Post Edited (2016-01-19 07:05)

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 Re: Rico/D'addario/Boveda humidipaks
Author: DavidBlumberg 
Date:   2016-01-20 21:31

Here's the solution to never having a warped reed.


BREAK IT IN PROPERLY. And also do not ever wet the bottom of the reed. Only wet the cut part.

Then the reed won't warp period the end.

Do clean the reed after playing to remove debris (I also use an alcohol swab before dipping the reed in water to clean it off).


Ed Palanker's website details reasoning for not wetting the non cut part of the reed, as the reed will not warp as a whole unit.

http://www.SkypeClarinetLessons.com


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 Re: Rico/D'addario/Boveda humidipaks
Author: PeterinToronto 2017
Date:   2016-02-01 22:54

Thanks to everyone for their responses; I have always allowed my reeds to dry out before putting them back in the cases (I currently use the Rico cases with the rubber moisture seals and the humidi-pak inside). As Dave and others have suggested, I use little round tupperware containers for tap water, and always make sure that the water is never up past the cut part of the reed.

All that being said, virtually all of my reeds warp on the back, and have to be lightly sanded most days. You can hear the buzziness in the sound and feel the propensity to squeak on long-tube notes over the break until this is done.

I have been ordering directly from Boveda, I'll try moving up a humidity level. We all used to use locally-made cases that had great moisture-seals, but mildew was a constant problem.

And I do follow a 4 to 5-day breaking-in period with them all. I wondered that if I didn't let the reeds dry before putting them back in the cases, wouldn't taking care of the moisture left on them wear out the humidi-paks sooner?

Thanks again,

Peter

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 Re: Rico/D'addario/Boveda humidipaks
Author: kdk 2017
Date:   2016-02-02 00:01

PeterinToronto wrote:

> All that being said, virtually all of my reeds warp on the
> back, and have to be lightly sanded most days. You can hear the
> buzziness in the sound and feel the propensity to squeak on
> long-tube notes over the break until this is done.
>

Let's just make sure we're using "warp" in the same way. A warped reed has a convex shape lengthwise across the back of the reed, which ideally should be flat. So the reed, if placed on its flat side, will rock from side to side over the curvature. It can definitely cause response problems, but I've never noticed "buzziness."

You aren't talking about the crinkling in the tip that happens when you first wet a dry reed? That could cause buzziness and squeaking, but straightens out on its own as the reed absorbs water. Humidifiers can prevent this from happening, but the problem takes care of itself without humidifiers if you wait a little longer, certainly without sanding.

> I wondered that if I didn't let the reeds dry before putting
> them back in the cases, wouldn't taking care of the moisture
> left on them wear out the humidi-paks sooner?
>
Well, if they're doing their job, that's why you're using them. That doesn't seem like much of a concern.

Karl

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 Re: Rico/D'addario/Boveda humidipaks
Author: PeterinToronto 2017
Date:   2016-02-02 07:02

Yes Karl,

I do mean the backs going out of flatness, and not the tips. Fair point about the inserts, as long as they work!

Thanks again,

Peter

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