 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: WhitePlainsDave
Date: 2015-03-07 19:29
Clarinets just seemed more affordable when I was teenager in the 1970s and 80s, even adjusted for inflation.
Is this opinion shared, and if so what do you think this cost increase is most caused by e.g. dwindling grenadilla supplies, corporate legacy costs of retired workers?
One of many things I liked about the clarinet growing up is that the cost differential between low and high end models was not as large as for many other instruments (flute, oboe, violin, etc.) , and that Buffets top of the line (the R13)..was the same model top professionals played on.
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Author: TomS
Date: 2015-03-07 20:22
It was very common for the "better" players in high school (late 1960s) to own totally professional instruments such as a Leblanc LL or a Selmer Series 9 or 10. The Buffets were unheard of in our area until you made it to college, but they were not any more expensive.
A Selmer Mark 6 alto sax was only $650.00!
You went to you local music store, where they had a half dozen of each model, picked one you liked, and your parents wrote a check or paid out $400-$450.00 ... which was RETAIL price ... no discounts in those days!
Clarinet prices have greatly out paced what the Government's numbers are on inflation.
Starting in the 1970s, the prices started going crazy and the quality started going south. I can remember talking to the repair shop relating how the last shipment of clarinets were terrible (especially the wood quality) and the price just jumped 15%.
I think when the retail prices started going crazy, the discount mentality started up. So the mail order business grew and the "brick and mortar" operations gradually evaporated. At one time, in the central Arkansas area, we had a half-dozen music stores that handled band and orchestra instruments. Now, there is just one ... and no pro instruments in stock. Actually, hardly anything in stock ...
Maybe Lord Kelvin was correct, everything is running down ... at least in woodwinds.
Tom
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Author: ClaV
Date: 2015-03-07 20:30
TomS wrote:
>
> Maybe Lord Kelvin was correct, everything is running down ...
> at least in woodwinds.
>
and there will be just string instruments playing a requiem...
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Author: Kel
Date: 2015-03-07 22:15
Part of the price increase may be due to the discount mentality. People expect discounts, so the suggested retail price is inflated to allow for discounts.
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Author: Lelia Loban ★2017
Date: 2015-03-07 23:29
Kel wrote,
>>Part of the price increase may be due to the discount mentality. People expect discounts, so the suggested retail price is inflated to allow for discounts.
>>
Yes, I think you're right. Look at what happened to J.C. Penney's when that venerable department store tried the innovation of lowering regular prices and ending the weekly sales. Customers were so addicted to the weekly sales gimmick that the chain got into serious trouble.
Penney's sales started recovering a bit when new management dumped the "no discounts" innovation and went back to advertising those phony weekly discounts. I was sorry the "no discounts" strategy failed. Much as I enjoy bartering at flea markets, I'd like to be able to just go into the department store and buy what I need now, instead of waiting around until I can get the best deal. And I do have to wait around, because otherwise I'd lose my Cheapskate Credentials. Hw could I face my flea market buddies if I paid full list price for a set of bedsheets? -- or a new clarinet?
Lelia
http://www.scoreexchange.com/profiles/Lelia_Loban
To hear the audio, click on the "Scorch Plug-In" box above the score.
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Author: TomS
Date: 2015-03-07 23:33
True on the inflated retail prices.
I worked where we sold stereo equipment for pretty much retail prices ... but our markup was only 30-45 percent ... and we offered free extended warranties and in house service. On some very popular items like Shure phonograph cartridges, the markup was much higher and you could throw in a $75.00 magnetic cartridge with a $200.00 turntable ...
So, a street priced $4000.00 Buffet clarinet is really only a $4000.00 instrument ... and working backwards and deflating to 1970 prices it's still a $400.00 clarinet?
Tom
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Author: TomS
Date: 2015-03-07 23:45
You will remember, at first, Saturn automobile prices were fixed ... the sticker price was pretty much final, unless a year-end closeout. No big sales or promotions, but as GM took more control of Saturn, it think the promotional mentality surfaced ...
Tom
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Author: donald
Date: 2015-03-08 00:03
Has anyone actually done the math and worked out the inflation adjusted cost of clarinets?
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Author: Kel
Date: 2015-03-08 01:01
According to one on-line inflation calculator, $400 in 1965 equals a little under $3000 in 2015. $400 in 1955 equals $3500 now. But that's dollar against dollar, not dollar against franc or euro. I remember 15-20 years ago the dollar was worth maybe 40% more against the euro than it is now.
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2015-03-08 01:57
I agree with "Kel's" price calculator. We mentioned cars a few posts ago. In the 70's you could by a great family car for six grand that is now thirty.
So I don't think clarinets are any different than a gallon of milk or anything else. Yet they are still a bargain compared with the current prices of other top of the line instruments. Anyone try to buy a top flight flute lately? You'd have to choose between that or a good family car.
The odd pricing recently was with Yamaha pro horns it was only ten years ago when Buffets and Selmers were already closer to today's prices and the Yamahas were only about $1800. It took Yamaha a bit to catch on to the discrepancy and charge what they are worth. For those who missed the bargain.......oops.
...........Paul Aviles
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Author: Kel
Date: 2015-03-08 02:10
Paul Aviles wrote:
> In the 70's you could by a great family car for
> six grand that is now thirty.
If clarinets had improved as much as cars over the past thirty years, we'd be playing on reeds that lasted 10 years and keywork with automated chromatic runs.
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Author: ClaV
Date: 2015-03-08 02:23
Kel wrote:
> If clarinets had improved as much as cars over the past thirty
> years, we'd be playing on reeds that lasted 10 years and
> keywork with automated chromatic runs.
It indicates that we may see am overall different direction of development: if any music can be readily played on i-pod/android/etc - the motivation to learn to play musical instruments is much less, especially for more sophisticated ones, like a clarinet.
The same is with the availability of calculators/software, the average math proficiency plunged...
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Author: TomS
Date: 2015-03-08 04:14
Glad I'm not looking for a new bassoon or purchasing a really good violin bow!
In addition, new cars are much more trouble free than they were 50 years ago. The average guy did a lot of his own maintenance because you were always fixing something. Now, you can drive a new car for 100,000 miles with only oil changes and no repairs ... and with good maintenance, 300,000 miles. Back in 1970, if you had 75,000 miles, you started thinking about trading ...
I'd like to just see , using technology, the consistency and reliability of clarinets and all accessories improve. I think there is room for better designs, but I would not want electronic keys, auto-tuning and stuff like that ... You can hang a barn door with a microprocessor, but a hinge is better ...
Tom
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Author: Wisco99
Date: 2015-03-08 10:01
I bought a Selmer Mark VI tenor sax in 1972 for $600. My Powell flute cost me $6,500 in 2002, and the same instrument today goes for $10,920. Inflation, quantitative easing, and other factors seem to have really pushed the prices up. In junior high I recall several students getting new Buffet's, and it was not a big deal in high school to play one or a Selmer series 10. Most band instruments were made in Elkhart Indiana. That is all history now.
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Author: BartHx
Date: 2015-03-09 20:52
The discount mentality is a powerful thing. My wife used to have a mobile tack (horse equipment) store that we would take to three day events. She had a German made saddle in stock for quite awhile at a time the Mark was doing strange things against the dollar so that her retail price was actually below the current wholesale price. At one event we had a lady spend a lot of time looking at it, trying it on her horse, etc. She did not buy it. The following weekend, my wife had marked it up to current retail price and then put it on sale for $100 off (still well above the price she had it marked the previous weekend). The same woman came into the display, but didn't recognize us from the week before. She purchased the saddle on sight because it was "such a great price". I see no reason why the same psychology would not apply to clarinets.
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Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2015-03-09 21:48
A Rep at a large Music store told me that one of the big (many products start with a "Y") company has the "if it costs more, it is obviously better" mentality.
CEO is big on that.
So their prices jacked up big time.
Student Saxes from $1100 to $1800!!
http://www.SkypeClarinetLessons.com
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Author: clarnibass
Date: 2015-03-10 10:48
>> One of many things I liked about the clarinet growing up is that the cost differential between low and high end models was not as large as for many other instruments (flute, oboe, violin, etc.) , and that Buffets top of the line (the R13)..was the same model top professionals played on. <<
Probably the main reason is that there weren't any very cheap Far East clarinets back then. A long time ago student models were made at the same places as the pro models, so I'm guessing the only way to make them cheaper was... to make them cheaper.
It seems that say that overall clarinets are more affordable now, but good clarinets are either more or less affordable, depending on what time you compare with.
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