 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: WhitePlainsDave
Date: 2015-02-25 18:29
http://shop.weinermusic.com/VANDOREN-TUNING-RINGS-SET-OF-TWO-FOR-MASTERS-MOUTHPIECES-TR100/productinfo/XVTR/
I suppose in theory, (correct me if I am wrong), any method to elongate the clarinet prior to its first vent on the upper (left hand) joint (as in "the vent closest to the sky") will work towards reducing pitch (even if not optimally).
To rephrase, perhaps it doesn't just have to just be the space between the barrel and upper joint that is elongated (in addition sometimes to the space between the upper and lower joint) to achieve flatter pitch. Perhaps creating space between the mouthpiece and barrel can also achieve reductions in pitch in a way that's not worse than upper joint/barrel gaps.
So I suppose the notion of a mouthpiece tuning ring isn't far fetched, if not optimal. But that said, why would they be specific to the Master's line of Vandoren mouthpieces? (Yes, I get that the openings on each side of a barrel are different in size, so I get the size specific mouthpiece tuning ring, I just don't get why it's Masters mouthpiece specific.)
Certainly I can appreciate an M/O Ligature specific to the Masters product line. Given the unique shape of this mouthpiece from its cork to window, and the nature of the delicate double screw on the Optimimum and M/O brand of ligatures that needs to torque each opening in the ligature such that it remains perpendicular to the screw, I get why the Masters specific M/O ligature is the only metal one Vandoren suggests players use on this mouthpiece.
But a Masters mouthpiece specific tuning ring?
By virtue of the fact that Masters and non-Masters mouthpieces all fit into a standard barrel, the Master's mouthpiece tenon is a stardard diameter, right? So why the mouthpiece specific tuning ring?
Is the mouthpiece tenon's length on the Masters product line somehow different?
What, if anything, am I missing? Was it that these rings had specfic purpose before the 13 series line of Masters mouthpieces were introduced, so that players could lower pitch to A=440, beyond, once there, tuning the clarinet at the classic upper joint/barrel site?
Thanks.
Post Edited (2015-02-25 18:37)
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Author: cigleris
Date: 2015-02-25 19:34
You're missing a lot here.
The Masters tuning rings were designed when the original Master's mouthpiece was released because the originals (and I own a CL5) were made to play at 442. The purpose of the ring is to go over the tenon of the mouthpiece to make it longer and play at 440 (Vandoren gave me them also when they gave me the CL5 back in 2013) A year or so later the 13 series was released to correct this. Though it should be said that the only difference as far as i'm aware is the depth in the chamber of the 13 series, this helps drop the pitch but not compromise on the original design etc.
Peter Cigleris
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Author: WhitePlainsDave
Date: 2015-02-25 19:37
cigleris wrote: "You're missing a lot here"
WhitePlainsDave wrote: "Was it that these rings had specfic purpose before the 13 series line of Masters mouthpieces were introduced, so that players could lower pitch to A=440, beyond, once there, tuning the clarinet at the classic upper joint/barrel site?"
Second snide thing in as many weeks Peter. Granted, my assumption was at the bottom of my post.
http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/read.html?f=1&i=419621&t=419599
Post Edited (2015-02-25 19:40)
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Author: cigleris
Date: 2015-02-25 20:45
I wasn't being sinde, or at least that wasn't my intention. Apologies if that's how you interpreted it.
Peter Cigleris
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2015-02-25 20:51
I personally think Vandoren is sneaking a lot of fixes and stuff right now so that it doesn't look like they made mistakes.
The original CL4 tuning IS preferable because it puts your clarinet internal tuning at a better advantage. It IS a mistake to think a lot of delusional US players who are used to wider than normal 12s will understand that and embrace this mouthpiece. So they came out with the "13" version (and the tuning rings first I will further assume).
This also brings up the M/O ligature. I recall quite clearly there was ONLY ONE M/O ligature for a while (further assuming that the "M" in the name stands for Masters). Now they have the two sizes available, one being a "Masters" M/O ligature to "clear things up."
There is also a new mouthpiece, Black Diamond 5, floating out there that apparently is only on a few European websites and the top of Martin Frost's clarinet in a recent Vandoren TV video.
What are they thinking ?!!!?
.....................Paul Aviles
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Author: donald
Date: 2015-02-26 00:05
Mike Lomax also uses/offers a similar concept for his 442 mouthpieces- a ring at the mouthpiece tenon (rather than where the barrel meets the top joint) that elongates a mouthpiece/barrel combination to slightly lower the pitch.
I recall being told by a Vandoren rep at Clarinetfest 2011 that they had provided these rings so they could release the Masters onto the USA market- at that point in time the research/testing etc for the "Masters 13 series" hadn't been completed. I can't remember the name of the woman who told me this, but it seems to make sense.
Over the years I have owned a couple of mouthpieces that were a bit high in pitch for me to use in NZ summer (most venues/studios etc don't have air conditioning, so if you're going to play over the summer, expect to be HOT!) and have tuning rings to put in the top of my favourite barrels to help keep the pitch down... essentionally the same concept. I recall and american player showing me how to make these by cutting the bottom off a "junker" mouthpiece... many years ago. So it's certainly not a new idea, nor unique to Vandoren.
dn
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