 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: BbMajorBoy
Date: 2014-10-03 01:48
I have been thinking about this a lot recently and haven't come to a conclusion by myself.
Every saxophone from the £150 crap ones upto the £6,000 custom horns has a double register mechanism yet bass clarinets costing £1,500-2,000 are single register only. Why do you have to go pro level on bass clarinet to get the same feature as a £200 beginner sax?
Thanks
Leonard Bernstein: "To achieve great things, two things are needed; a plan, and not quite enough time."
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Author: fskelley
Date: 2014-10-03 02:07
Maybe that's really the only difference between the expensive and super expensive models? (No bass clarinet is cheap.) How else are they going to make you pay more?
Stan in Orlando
EWI 4000S with modifications
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2014-10-03 02:14
Saxes need two 8ve vents (just like oboes) otherwise you won't get much of an upper register - the lower vent is open from upper register D-G# and the upper vent (crook key) opens from high A upwards.
Saxes have a basic range of around two and a half 8ves (low Bb to high F or F#) and are still in the 2nd harmonic series for the high F or F# - clarinets overblow a 12th so they skip the even harmonic series, so the upper register is in the 3rd harmonic series (missing out the 2nd harmonic series which sounds an 8ve above the lower register completely).
That's why clarinets have a large basic range of nearly four 8ves due to the cylindrical bore making them play almost as low as an alto sax and nearly as high as a flute.
Saxes are conical bore and need two 8ve vents to get the full range. Acoustically they behave just like oboes, only with oboes in the UK, the most basic ones have two separate 8ve keys that aren't linked whereas intermediate and pro models have semi automatic 8ve keys.
German and East European players tend to prefer a fully automatic 8ve mechanism that works pretty much in the same way as on saxes, but the mechanism is far more complex and needs to be regulated perfectly with very little room for error unlike saxes which have a very simple but effective 8ve mechanism.
Flutes, oboes, bassoons and saxes (of all sizes) all overblow an 8ve, but clarinets are unique among orchestral woodwinds in they overblow a 12th.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2014-10-03 02:25
You can buy Chinese bass clarinets built to low C with the double speaker mechanism fitted, but they're not the most reliable instruments - bass clarinets having such long key rods and keys are very easily bent and thrown out of regulation by careless handling - even top pro models.
It's much easier and less hassle to build a bass clarinet with the single speaker mechanism and that also makes them more user friendly for schools where a more durable instrument is needed with as few connections across the middle tenon. The extra keywork involved with a double speaker mechanism will mean extra expense as it's a far more complex mechanism compared to a single speaker mechanism which is all contained on the top joint alone.
Both single and double speaker mechanisms aren't without their shortcomings - basses with double speaker mechanisms have some dodgy notes in the upper register, mainly the upper F and F# which can kick or lose quality. German and Austrian pro level basses have a triple speaker mechanism which is fully automatic so the lowest vent is open from throat Bb to upper register Eb, then the middle vent is open from E to G# and then the crook key is open from A to C.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: kdk ★2017
Date: 2014-10-03 06:02
Chris P wrote:
> - basses with double speaker mechanisms have some
> dodgy notes in the upper register, mainly the upper F and F#
> which can kick or lose quality.
I always wondered why the clarion F# on my very old Leblanc Eb bass was so difficult to control - can be unplayable in really delicate situations. F is unstable, too, but not nearly as much as F#. I've spent 40 years blaming it on reeds, mouthpieces and, ultimately, myself for not practicing bass clarinet more. So are you saying that it's in a sort of dead zone between the two register vents' most effective areas? Is there a way to minimize the instability?
Karl
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Author: cyclopathic
Date: 2014-10-03 15:29
A few reasons.
1) 2nd register vent is less needed on clarinet then sax/oboes due to acoustics. Clarinet overblows on 3rd and sax on 2nd harmonic, so the harmonic wave length is 1.5 shorter and vent location is 1.5 times less sensitive.
2) It took a while for sax designers to come up with simple and effective automatic register mechanism which can be easily balanced and is bulletproof. Balancing register mechanism on old saxes from turn of the XX century isn't as easy task. Clarinets are not there yet?
3) Longer keys make it harder to balance and maintain, so double reg is liability on bass clarinet?
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Author: Steven Ocone
Date: 2014-10-03 15:32
Saxes need at least 2 octave vents and the design are more reliable. Clarinets do fine without them (with some acoustical/tuning compromises). Bass clarinet register mechanisms are fussy.
Steve Ocone
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