 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: ClariNorth101
Date: 2013-12-27 17:35
Hi there,
Considering Erasmus places, just wondered about the small/ maybe not so small community of French system Clarinettist in amongst all the German system players in Germany? Are there many and is there actually any worth in studying in Germany as a French system Clarinettist? Is it possible to get a job there?
Thanks all! Much appreciated.
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Author: Caroline Smale
Date: 2013-12-27 23:53
Certainly in years gone by there were large numbers of British players on Boehm system in many German orchestras.
I think it is only a few of the very top rank bands such as Berlin Phil etc that require a German system clarinet as pre-requisite for application.
Even the Amsterdam Concertgebouw has a Boehm playing principal now.
I have a CD made by 8 players who were all pupils of Sabine Meyer and they are evenly split German - French system.
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Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2013-12-28 00:19
Chen Halevi is among the best of the best in Germany (or anywhere really) he lives in Germany, plays French system.
Big deal player - enough that a while back, the Berlin Phil. Clarinetists lobbied to get him sanctioned (thrown out??) for playing the French system.
http://www.SkypeClarinetLessons.com
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2013-12-28 01:00
Amsterdam Concertgebouw have used reform Boehms for years, so does the current principal play a French bore Boehm system (Buffet, Selmer, Yamaha, etc)?
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
Post Edited (2013-12-28 01:01)
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Author: srattle
Date: 2013-12-28 03:55
Hi,
I am a french clarinetist living in Germany.
It is usually very hard for us there. Almost all the professional orchestras require german system to even attempt an audition (except a very few, like Deutsche Kammerphilharmonie Bremen)
I studied in Berlin, finished my diplom, and then continued on there as a freelancer. I am actually just about to move, because the challenges, and limitations there for me are just too great.
There are some wonderful french system clarinetists living in Germany, Chen is one, and Sharon Kam also lives in Germany. But the ones I know usually aready had an international career beforehand.
If you're not content with working mostly outside of Germany, and when inside, only doing chamber music, solo concerti and recitals, and smaller, regional orchestra gigs (plus some session work etc.) then, germany is not the right place to move. I think it's a great place to spend some time, learn the way people make music here, learn a little bit about how clarinet is playing in Germany, that's all great. I would hesitate to recommend it as a place to move to, and study, because the life for a french clarinetist is very hard, and during your studies is when you want to make a lot of your important contacts to start you off as a professional.
David, I'm pretty sure that isn't true. The Berlin Phil was trying out many players for first clarinet, and had a couple french players sit in for a concert or 2 (Halevi, Morales, Paul Meyer) but they were never members of the orchestra. I'm pretty sure of that, at least.
Also, Amsterdam is not Germany. . .they have rather different ideals, so I wouldn't assume if Concertgebouw has opened its doors to Boehm, then it would be the same in Germany, it very much is not the case
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Author: brycon
Date: 2013-12-28 06:12
Not that it matters, but I am pretty sure Chen lives in Paris but teaches in Germany.
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Author: donald
Date: 2013-12-28 12:52
I seem to recall the clarinet teacher in Freiburg plays french system... the name escapes me just at this moment. A number of NZ flute players have gone through the Hochschule there, and a good friend of mine who plays Bassoon (now playing in Southbank Symph). I asked her a few weeks back "did you notice a big difference, playing with German system players?" and her reply was along the lines of "about 50% of players were on French system, and because they were all really good players, they worked hard to blend, so no I didn't notice a huge difference" (not an exact quote).
I wish I could remember the teachers name- he is also a composer.
dn
Jorg Widmann (umlaut over the "o")
here is a link to him....
http://www.mh-freiburg.de/en/faculty/person/details/widmann/
In his publicity shot he is holding an Oehler clarinet, but apparently many of his students play Boehm system.
Post Edited (2013-12-28 13:00)
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Author: ruben
Date: 2013-12-28 08:07
Chris: The new principal clarinetist of the Concertgebouw is French and plays Buffet. The tradition in the Netherlands since the war is to play Boehm-reformed clarinets: Wurlitzer and Leitner and Kraus of late (spelling?) Their mouthpieces are usually Viotto. I have a friend here in Paris who switched to the German system, and I had never seen this in France! But then again, he is a Germanophile and semi-retired, so he's taking no big risk. The protectionist policy found in Germany could be compared to that which existed in France and was designed to protect the use of the French bassoon. This was a losing battle: very few orchestras still use the French bassoon. Some would bemoan this state of affairs, claiming that this leads to a uniformisation of sound. Others would see this as the survival of the fittest principle at work.
rubengreenbergparisfrance@gmail.com
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Author: clarnibass
Date: 2013-12-28 09:30
>> I am a french clarinetist living in Germany.
It is usually very hard for us there. Almost all the professional orchestras... <<
What if you are not interested at all in playing in any orchestra...?
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Author: Liquorice
Date: 2013-12-28 11:38
I heard Jörg Widmann play the Brahms quitet last year with the Hagen quartet. It was a phenomenal performance. Widmann was playing German system.
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Author: seabreeze
Date: 2013-12-28 20:50
It may be a little ironic that German clarinetists steadfastly hold to their Oehler system instruments but willingly discard the Germanic tradition of string binding for the reed and reeds made of cane only. Berlin principal Wenzel Fuchs plays and endorses Legere composite reeds and uses a clamp ligature just like the French on his Nick Kuckmeyer mouthpieces. Sabine Meyer's students are tending to use much more open facings, and some German clarinets now come with mouthpieces open to as much as 1.17 mm at the tip--a big deviation from traditional opening of less than 1.00 mm.
If German players and orchestras do not care for what they perceive as a nasal and buzzy French Buffet sound, one would have thought they would express some interest in the rounder, more recorder-like sound of some of the Backun Mo-Ba instruments.
A further irony is that the excellent German clarinetist Jorg Widmann does use the traditional string to bind his reed but doesn't sound all that German, even on the Oehler clarinet. On YouTube he offers one performance of a solo clarinet work with difficult multiphonics From listening, I would have thought he was playing a Boehm.
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Author: Bill Patry
Date: 2013-12-28 23:14
There is also the very talented Spanish clarinetist Laura Ruiz Ferreres, who lives and works in Germany and who plays both systems.
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Author: SchwarzKlarinette
Date: 2013-12-29 10:05
All of this makes me wonder; forgive my ignorance, but would it be difficult for a Boehm player to play an Öhler system clarinet at first? I can't imagine that muscle memory does one any favours, there...
"Kein' Musik ist ja nicht auf Erden, die unsrer verglichen kann werden."
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Author: donald
Date: 2013-12-29 14:27
Kia ora SchwarzKlarinette,
When I first played Oehler system clarinet I didn't actually find it that hard to learn the new fingering patterns- for me the main difficulty is with the left hand little finger keys (for E/B and F#/C#. These two long levers feel very strange, and are in the wrong place for my hand position. I don't know if other Boehm system players find this. Also strange is that the left thumb doesn't have a raised tonehole/ring, and for this reason the register key feels strange.
These things will obviously differ from instrument to instrument and player to player, but this was my experience. I did some playing on Oehler system clarinets to prepare me to move to Germany in 1998 (I was married to a German and we developed a 2 year plan to move there from USA, but a year later decided to move to NZ). For a year I was primarily performing on Boehm system, but also practising on Oehler- I used to have a really good recording of me performing the Johann Stamitz concerto on Oehler (since lost/destroyed) that I was quite proud of.
dn
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Author: SchwarzKlarinette
Date: 2014-01-05 03:45
Interessant.
Are Öhler clarinets more expensive? I really have no idea about them at all. Thanks again. I'd like to get my hands on one so that I can at least experience what it's like playing one. Thanks.
"Kein' Musik ist ja nicht auf Erden, die unsrer verglichen kann werden."
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2014-01-05 08:59
I could never get accustomed to the wide spread between my right index and middle fingers on any German-fingering clarinet (Buffet, Selmer, Wurlitzer). To get on those keys and holes, I must stretch my wrist to get on the right ring finger and little finger keys. After about five minutes, I get excruciating cramps in my right hand and wrist.
It's probably because I have short index and little fingers. A reform Boehm may be the answer, but I'm too old (and too poor) to change.
Ken Shaw
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