 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Roxann
Date: 2013-08-19 22:30
I watched a video of Mark Nuccio today and he puts his reed in his mouth for about 5 seconds before playing. I'm curious as to how long a reed should be soaked in water (my mouth) before playing it for the day.
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Author: Caroline Smale
Date: 2013-08-19 22:44
What people do on videos often does not represent their real life actions.
I prefer to use water where possible as it is less damaging to the reed.
The length of soaking does vary from reed to reed and with newness of reed (usually newer reeds tend to need a bit longer) but somewhere in region 30-60 seconds would be my approach.
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Author: AAAClarinet
Date: 2013-08-19 23:13
You probably want to avoid soaking the entire reed. Just soak the half you play on.
AAAClarinet
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2013-08-19 23:33
Well, just to represent yet another side of the story, I prefer water first (2 to 5 minutes), and I DO soak the whole reed (since they float, I put the butt end in first for a little to get things started and just let the two thirds of the business end sit in my little bottle for that time).
The Nuccio video is particularly in-depth and probably the most detailed version of breaking in a reed I have ever heard of. Yes, I'm sure he really does this. As he states, the process of only playing a very short time in a 24 hour period on a new reed for days is to re-hydrate the reed. My process is quicker (maybe 4-6 days of five minutes on a reed before committing them to full time playing). But he goes well beyond that having many batches in the mix at a time and marking every reed with the amount of plays it has had, AND only using one specific reed for one specific piece, during one specific concert series (usually only four plays).
The "water first" idea has rationale behind it. You have plenty of digestive juices in your saliva, so filling the cells of the reed first with water might help prevent breaking the reed down too fast (in my mind anyway).
I think you could not find a better method than Mark's, but you could get away with a little less and not lose too much.
Many of us have many different versions of this almost bordering on voodoo, but the basic idea is still that a new reed MUST be broken in slowly, usually three days as a bare minimum. Violators will be stuck with reeds that get water logged (stop playing nice the next time you pick it up).
...................Paul Aviles
Post Edited (2013-08-19 23:37)
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Author: Ed Palanker
Date: 2013-08-20 00:15
Read my article on why you shouldn't soak the Bark part of the reed at all to help avoid warping on my website. I use water but I only "soak" it for a few seconds as well.
ESP eddiesclarinet.com
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Author: kdk ★2017
Date: 2013-08-20 01:02
As you've already begun to see, there are lots of different opinions about this (and about reed "break-in" in general) and everyone who offers an opinion is certain his or hers works best. In his booklet "Selection, Adjustment, and Care of Single Reeds," which I've just recently read, Larry Guy details a 10-day break-in routine that includes soaking 30 seconds to a minute with only the vamp immersed in warm water (not in your mouth). Ben Armato insists in the literature explaining the Reed Wizard that you should soak *only* the butt end of the reed in water for as long as 15 or 20 minutes and never put the vamp end in water at all. Most of the players I know personally put a reed in their mouth while they assemble the rest of the clarinet, then put it on the mouthpiece.
There may be one best answer to your question, but I've never noticed much agreement on what it is. The bottom line is that if you don't water-log the reed, you don't have significant problems with warped reeds - not the tip crinkling that happens when you first wet an older reed, but a curvature from edge to edge of the entire reed - and the reeds respond well when when you play them, then whatever you're doing is probably OK.
BTW, in contrast to the comment about newer reeds' needing more time to soak, that's the opposite of my experience. The tip edges of older reeds for me become wavy (crinkled) until they're fully moistened. I can hasten the process by "ironing" the reed with my thumb, pressing it flat against the mouthpiece table or another hard, smooth surface and in the process probably pushing more water into the cane more quickly, but the reed won't respond well so long as that waviness is there. I find that a brand new reed will respond well, as Nuccio suggests, after only a few seconds, either in my mouth or in a water container (I use old 35 mm film cans).
Karl
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2013-08-20 04:40
When a reed is dry and you then put it in saliva or water, the tip wrinkles until enough water gets into the cane to flatten it out again.
So there's no hard and fast rule. It all depends on the cane. For me, it takes anywhere between 45 seconds and two minutes.
Ken Shaw
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2013-08-20 11:48
You know, I say this with a bit a amazement. I can't really remember when it was that I last had a reed where the tip actually got "wrinkled." I recall that sort of thing as a student, but haven't had that in many many years.
I don't store reeds with any sort of crazy gizm either. Reeds go into a typical reed holder with a glass surface (in this case, the cool one wooden one from Muncy) or I just throw them back into the Vandoren provided plastic protector and back into the box (well, the older Rue Lepic boxes that had lids that is). Oh yes, and I do place the box into a plastic sandwich bag (the simple ones you're supposed to fold over) that I just fold over without any seal to the end. I do this to keep a modicum of moisture around the reeds.
I'm not about to say that my breaking in method helps with this, but.............
..................Paul Aviles
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Author: kdk ★2017
Date: 2013-08-20 12:48
Paul Aviles wrote:
> ... I can't really
> remember when it was that I last had a reed where the tip
> actually got "wrinkled."
>
> ... Oh yes, and I do place the box into a plastic sandwich bag
> (the simple ones you're supposed to fold over) that I just fold
> over without any seal to the end. I do this to keep a modicum
> of moisture around the reeds.
>
Maintaining a more or less constant moisture level in the reed, even if the bag isn't tightly sealed like a Zip-lock, will keep reeds from wrinkling when you first wet them for use. The tip fibers are already moist. The humidity control items like Reed Vitalizer go a step farther and try to maintain a specific humidity level in the plastic bag (which then needs to be sealed to avoid depleting the Vitalizer) at a high enough level to keep the reeds from ever completely drying out.
The baggie technique (as well as the Vitalizer and Zip-lock approach) certainly works and many players have posted here about the virtues of keeping reeds moist.
Karl
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Author: buckeye75
Date: 2013-08-20 13:05
This is a little off subject, however, it is a reed issue. I have started storing my opened reeds in a small zip lock container. The reeds are not affected by humidity changes and definitely play more consistently from day to day. I am using Vandoren blue box and simply put the reeds back in the plastic sleeve they are supplied in.
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Author: Ed Palanker
Date: 2013-08-20 16:32
One more statement of the subject. This is the honest truth. I've haven't had a single clarinet reed warp in over 25 years since I stopped "soaking" my reeds. By warp I mean not sealing on the facing of the MP, not a single one. When I used to make my own reeds I experimented the way all the books recommend I "break in" the cane. With trial and error I discovered that once the reed was made it was best for me never to allow water to touch the butt part of the reed. I began using the Rico Thick Blank reeds many years ago, some of their Reserves as well, and I've experience the same thing, The bark part of the reed is the strongest portion of the cane and if it never gets wet it doesn't change. Any type of wood will warp when going from wet to dry. As far as the little wrinkles, no problem, I press it against the MP for a "few" seconds to flatten it out. never more than 3-5 does the trick. I used to keep my reeds in my case with humidifiers in it but the last decade have been using the Rico Vitializers in an air tight bag. I repeat, I haven't had a single reed not seal on the facing of my MP for over 25 years. When a reed doesn't seal it doesn't respond right and plays many tricks on the player.
Though I have respect for all those that write books about reeds I've found most of those suggests unnecessary and too time consuming. I break my reeds in very successfully in 4-5 days breaking in a box of them in 10-15 minutes a day max. Making slight adjustments each day after day one. Day one, 5 seconds each, day 2 a few more seconds each, day 3 about a minute each for those that are left, day 4 and 5 five to ten minutes each while I practice them to make my time more efficient. Making slight adjustments as needed after the first day.
ESP eddiesclarinet.com
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