 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: halfshellhero
Date: 2013-08-09 23:51
I've been playing clarinet for 5 years now and have never had this problem before. But in the past year or so, when I play for more than an hour-ish a day my bottom lip and right under my bottom lip (sometimes my embouchure slips after I've been playing a while) gets really irritated and cracked and peels a lot. I think this is due to friction from the reed, but chapstick, vaseline, etc. doesn't work (I think I've tried every lip product available) and in fact sometimes makes it worse. Exfoliation gets rid of the peeling skin temporarily, but at the cost of making me bleed, and the thick, cracked icky skin grows right back. The best I can do is use Aquaphor pretty much constantly, wiping it off right before I play. I'm pretty sure the vibration from the reed is rubbing my skin raw. Any ideas as to what I can do? This makes playing very uncomfortable. I can't just stop playing - I'm in an orchestra, my school's honors band, jazz band playing alto sax, and marching band. When it's all said and done I play appx 2-3 hours a day not counting personal practice at home. HELP!
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Author: Tony F
Date: 2013-08-10 00:38
Possibly you're getting some sort of skin reaction. I've heard of woodwind players having allergic reactions to cane, so it might be worthwhile trying a Legere or Forestone reed. Also, see your Doctor. He may have a simple fix.
Tony F.
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Author: halfshellhero
Date: 2013-08-10 00:46
I've thought of using synthetic reeds, but am worried about their sound vs a cane reed's sound. Is it noticeably different?
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Author: clarinetist04
Date: 2013-08-10 01:20
You'll only know when you try them. They can be very good, but it's important to make sure you get the right stiffness. There's a lot of threads about choosing the right stiffness - use the search function that's located above your original post to search for Legere or Forestone or some other choice of synthetic reed.
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2013-08-10 01:45
The right strength compared to standard Vandoren would be 1/4 strength less than Vandoren. So if you play Vandoren 3 1/2, then you'd use a Legere 3 1/4.
I think in your case, curing the lip falling off trumps any change in sound (they are not horrible, just not as 'meaty').
.............Paul Aviles
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Author: kdk ★2017
Date: 2013-08-10 03:11
Even if you don't like the sound of a synthetic reed, using one might rule a skin reaction to the cane reeds in or out.
Had you changed reed brands when this started? I don't know what kind of additives - insecticides, preservatives - might be in the cane from some companies (this has been suggested on the BB before), but it's an idea to consider.
Karl
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Author: halfshellhero
Date: 2013-08-10 04:58
I've made a few forays into Mitchel Lurie and Rico Reserve reeds and a couple others, but I usually come back to the blue box Vandorens. I use a 3 Vandoren, but I do wish they came in like a 3.25 because ideally I like something between a 3 and a 3.5.
I've looked around at some of the synthetic reeds, and though I've heard good things about Forestone, they seem kind of limited in cuts of reeds and have a really terrible website (I may end up ordering if I can't find things in a local store). So most likely in the way of synthetics I'm looking at Legere. Any idea what cut/strength would play between a blue box Vandoren 3 and 3.5?
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Author: halfshellhero
Date: 2013-08-10 05:04
Oh, forgot to add, although I like my Vandorens in all other aspects, I've never liked how they sound in the throat tones. So if I could get a synthetic reed that played like a blue box and was good in the throat tones I would be ecstatic.
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Author: Tony F
Date: 2013-08-10 12:53
If you're playing Blue Box 3-3.5 then youd probably be about right with a Legere 2.75. Personally I like the way they play, your mileage may vary. Legere do have a free return policy if you get the strength wrong with the first one. so you get a second chance. They are very consistent reed to reed. I still think you should consult your GP.
Tony F.
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Author: Rezzie
Date: 2013-08-10 13:03
One more person jumping in here to say that you should check with your GP, or if you have one like us older, gingery types, your dermatologist. I'm on a first name basis with mine, but I'm an old guy who spent way too much time in the sun getting burnt up when I was a youngster. There is an arsenal of products to help with your problem that may be only available via prescription.
Serious, here. Don't mess around with this - get some professional help. You need your skin - it's the largest organ of your body.
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2013-08-10 14:00
Sounds like you'd be safe to try a number 3 Legere (in between a 3 and what would be a 3 1/2).
To me, the sound has less overtones (sounds less reedy) so I'd say the sound in the chalumeau is "less complex." If you like that, you've got it made.
.............Paul Aviles
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Author: halfshellhero
Date: 2013-08-10 14:42
Yeah, I will get in touch with my dermatologist because I do have one. This isn't really new to me... I have really stupid sensitive skin that overreacts to just about everything. And I'll try the 2.75 Legere, too.
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Author: Roxann
Date: 2013-08-10 15:32
I have the same exact problem, although the cause of mine could be different from the cause of yours. I've been biting the reed rather than relaxing my jaw and dropping my chin. Part of the cause was poor instruction when I first started playing (in the late 1950's) and old habits are hard to break, but part of it is also from exhaustion. My embouchure weakens and I start biting. After playing day after day for the circus that recently came to town (really!) and practicing several hours a day ahead of time the skin below my lower lip was raw. It has stayed red and irritated until very recently when I had an "a-ha" moment and realized I was biting the mouthpiece for all I was worth. My skin is slowly returning to normal...to my great relief. Another something to think about...when my embouchure starts to weaken and I start biting and the corners of my mouth weaken, I get a lot of spit build-up between my reed and my lower lip area and I think this might add to the problem. I wish you luck with figuring out the cause and coming up with a solution. Once you do, I hope you post your findings for those of us experiencing similar issues.
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Author: halfshellhero
Date: 2013-08-10 21:27
I picked up a Legere classic 2.5 today because I went down to the instrument repair place to get some pads replaced and played on it for a couple hours. Verdict: I don't like the tone as much, but I do like how responsive it is. The 2.5 is a little too soft for me, so I think I'll go a quarter size up. I think I'll like the tone of the Quebec cut better, so the next reed I get will be one of those. It was not irritating to my lip, though (so far at least), so I think cane was the problem. I'll have to hide it from my band director in honors band, though, so he won't yell at me. I'll probably keep using cane reeds for performances, auditions, etc. and synthetic for practice.
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Author: kdk ★2017
Date: 2013-08-10 22:05
halfshellhero wrote:
> ... It was not irritating to my
> lip, though (so far at least), so I think cane was the problem.
If the Legere works out over the next few days to be a genuine solution to your problem, you should probably still ask your dermatologist (I think you said you already see one) about the irritation. Most players don't have that reaction to cane. It might be useful to you in the future if you can figure out (with medical help) what exactly you're reacting to. If it's something the cane has been treated with rather than the cane itself, figuring out (if possible) what it is and what reeds don't have it, or how to leach it out might allow you more freedom of choice. A lot of players genuinely like Legeres or Forestones, but synthetics aren't everyone's cup of tea. If they aren't yours, either, more choice would be better.
Karl
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Author: curlyev
Date: 2013-08-11 05:03
You can suddenly develop an allergy to something you've never been allergic to before. I use Legere, and I like both The Quebec and Signature Series (not a big fan of the classic). I don't like my forestone or bari reeds, they just don't give me a natural sound, but if you end up not liking Legere, they are worth a try, everyone is different. You haven't switched mouthpieces have you?
I hope your dermatologist can give you something to help. I prefer the sound of cane, but lately I haven't had as much luck with it (humidity maybe). Periodically cane reeds cause the under part of my bottom lip to break out and hurt. I found out it was psoriasis, and it hasn't bothered me since I switched to Legere. I can still play on cane reeds, I just don't do it as often, particularly in the Summer.
I have used my Legeres in performances, and the quality has never been an issue.
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Author: morbius
Date: 2013-08-11 14:46
You might want to give Gonzalez FOF reeds a shot. They come in quarter strengths (which I have found to be just as inaccurate as the regular half strengths). And (this is the big plus as far as I'm concerned) they are based on the old Moree cut a lot of Midwestern Clarinetists were using 30 years ago (Marcellus helped develop the cut). They have a steeper slope and a thinner tip but, when you find the right one, produce a noticeably better sound.
Now for the bad news. Gonzalez reeds come from Mendoza, Argentina. When the cane is good, its the best in the world, in my opinion. But just like elsewhere, if it is not good, they can be just as frustrating as elsewhere. And lately, that has been the case. I bought 3 boxes of FOF last year this time, and found NOTHING I could use. So I got out my old reed Dual, ordered some Gonzalez tube cane from Muncy winds, went through the labor intensive process of making reed blanks. I put one of my best FOF models on the Dual and went to town. The result was amazing. I've had compliments from players around me (including clarinet players) about my sound. And with a Kasper mouthpiece, I'm in clarinet heaven. It has been worth it. Not everyone will want to go to that amount of trouble, but given equal technique with the competition, a better sound will make you stand out. It has for me and I free lance with 3 different orchestras in AZ.
P.S. I'm not sold on the new wave of synthetic reeds out there. I've sat next to players using them, and to my ear, they sound brittle and a bit honky. But that's just me.
John Dorch
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Author: Roxann
Date: 2013-08-18 21:06
Has your bottom lip problem been resolved? What's the verdict?
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Author: Bob Barnhart ★2017
Date: 2013-08-19 15:23
Ben Armato visited our San Diego Clarinet Society many years ago and described a practice of his in which he would put Electrical Tape over the vamp of the reed to avoid such irritation after many hours of rehearsals/performances at the Met.
I've tried this on occasion and found that (1) it can reduce irritation of the lower lip and (2) it darkens the sound so you can play lighter/brighter reeds (depending on what part and how much of the vamp you cover).
In your case I would try to keep the tape on the lower part of the vamp so you don't affect the sound or response.
Bob Barnhart
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