 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Bill
Date: 2012-08-19 18:49
Yes, I have done a search here but didn't find anything pertinent, so my really, really embarrassing question is: Why would my playing them be turning the tables of my black rubber mouthpieces brown? I have returned to playing after some time away, and this has become an epidemic for me. It wasn't a problem, say, 2 years ago.
I soak my reeds in spring water. My mouthpieces were kept for many years on a wooden rack on my desk top, not necessarily touching one another (I have heard that affects them) but fully exposed to the air (and therefore dust). The surface on which they were kept never received direct (or even indirect) sunlight.
Presently, my mouthpieces are kept, wrapped in cotton handkerchiefs, in a wooden cabinet that has many different small drawers (it's ideal, actually).
TIA.
Bill Fogle
Ellsworth, Maine
(formerly Washington, DC)
Post Edited (2012-08-19 18:50)
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Author: sonicbang
Date: 2012-08-19 20:43
If the table (and the facing) develops some patina, the hard rubber will be softer with time so you may have to have them refaced if the deterioration accelerates.
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Author: Campana
Date: 2012-08-19 22:41
FWIW. This is an extract from a treatise on hard black rubber.
"Hard rubber is a very stable material, but it is vulnerable to fading when exposed to bright light. The effects of exposure may not be immediately apparent, as the breakdown of the surface may continue for days afterwards and may not be visible until the surface is exposed to moisture. In most cases black hard rubber will first turn brown, then lose its gloss while lightening to a biscuit color. Note that while fresh hard rubber can be immersed in water with no ill effects, once light-damaged even cold water may cause it to suddenly fade or spot"
Nothing to be embarrassed about. Seems to be a chemical action caused by light, any light, not necessarily sunlight.
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Author: Bill
Date: 2012-08-22 02:53
Thanks for your responses. This has become an epidemic for me, especially considering that I have invested quite a lot in rubber mouthpieces. Despite my reading and interest in the subject of mouthpieces, someiow I never understood that they are so vunerable. I have purchased many quite old mouthpieces that were fine until *recently*. They're all going to hell, and all at once.
A sad day for me!
Bill Fogle
Ellsworth, Maine
(formerly Washington, DC)
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Author: Campana
Date: 2012-08-22 08:47
Out of interest, has there been any change in the lighting in the room where the mouthpieces are kept? Perhaps brighter lights to compensate for fading eyesight or a change in light source i.e. to/from tungsten filament, energy efficient, quartz halogen, LED, etc.
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Author: Bill
Date: 2012-08-22 12:38
No change (either type of light nor amount). Just to clarify, this isn't a case of the mpcs going brown all over, the way old ones do, often remaining black on the table and rails. Just the opposite. The mpc body is remaining black but the table and rails are going brown (and stinking of sulfur).
Bill Fogle
Ellsworth, Maine
(formerly Washington, DC)
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2012-08-22 15:53
I can't help but think this is a chemical issue (your chemistry that is). Perhaps you are having issues with acid reflux and the higher acidity is causing the change to the 'playing surfaces.'
Just a hunch.
...............Paul Aviles
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Author: Brent
Date: 2012-08-22 15:59
But if that was the case, wouldn't the places where lips touch, and also the inside of the mouthpiece also be affected? If i understand correctly, the only areas affected are those that touch the reed...
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Author: Bill
Date: 2012-08-22 18:35
Interesting - thanks! The part of the mouthpieces that's turning brown is the table and rails only. In fact, the brown stops where the butt of the reed ended.
Bizarre.
Bill Fogle
Ellsworth, Maine
(formerly Washington, DC)
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Author: Bill
Date: 2012-08-23 14:51
[forget it]
Bill Fogle
Ellsworth, Maine
(formerly Washington, DC)
Post Edited (2012-08-23 23:31)
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Author: Bill
Date: 2012-08-23 23:26
Attachment: 2012-08-23_19-20-04_90.jpg (53k)
Today I received a shiny black mouthpiece in the mail. It's a 19 mm facing by Robert Scott, and I thought it best to try it out with a new #4 reed. The mouthpiece was *completely black* as it reached me.
I strapped the reed on, blew a few notes for less than 90 seconds, then removed the reed to use rush on it.
I had turned the corners of the beak brown.
It's me. Forget the storage and the wind and ambient humidity. It's my mouth.
Has anyone ever had this experience?! I cannot imagine what is going on, and I just hope -- you know -- I'm not ill!
Bill Fogle
Ellsworth, Maine
(formerly Washington, DC)
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Author: NBeaty
Date: 2012-08-23 23:40
If it's you, then it's your saliva somehow. Try putting saliva on the rest of a hard rubber mouthpiece and see if it proves to be similar results.
Many times, tables and rails will look less black due to the sandpaper used to hand-face a mouthpiece. The sandpaper to finish a mouthpiece refacing is generally not very high grit. For example, I finish mouthpiece tables with 600 grit, but even 2000 will scratch the surface of the rest of the mouthpiece, leaving it less "black".
The inside of the mouthpiece varies. Machine made mouthpieces are generally more "polished" or finished out with a higher grit. There are sufficient reasons to me for leaving the inside finished out with a rougher texture, which leaves the inside not very shiny.
The only other reason why it may only happen because of YOU is something in the way the saliva and reed interact, causing the reed to become less smooth...shot in the dark...
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2012-08-24 01:16
Or some treatment you apply to the reeds you're not telling us about?????
.................Paul Aviles
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Author: Bill
Date: 2012-08-24 02:25
My reeds are moistened with spring water, that's it. I've ordered one of those rolls of special paper that can tell the pH of your saliva. Something must be terribly acidic with me that I can turn black rubber to brown in 90 seconds. Scary!
In the meantime, wow, the O'Brien sounds NICE!
Bill Fogle
Ellsworth, Maine
(formerly Washington, DC)
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Author: Buster
Date: 2012-08-24 02:52
Do your mouthpieces with concave tables turn completely brown as well? Of course the ligature tightness might have some effect on that...
(By the way, did you get a chance to look at the Sayre yet... extremely concave table?)
Don't try to simply clean the "browning" off as you'll change the dimensions in an unpredictable way... send them to someone reputable if they seem to be responding poorly to have the facing re-laid.
BTW what vintage is your O'Brien? I have an ancient O'Brien/Selmer that I wouldn't trade for less than a small fortune.
-Jason
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Author: Bill
Date: 2012-08-24 03:08
The Sayre is on its way over the sea to Ramon Wodkowski. My O'Brien is an OB* from 1979. I once owned an O'Brien that I guessed was from much earlier, because the markings were different (I searched for a photo but don't seem to have one). Also, it did not have a metal tenon ring. I sold it because I couldn't play throat tones in tune with it (even on 1950s clarinets). It wasn't "green" (vaguely Coke bottle color) as my present one is. Just clear (like old Selmers). Perhaps it was one like yours.
Looks like I'm playing the O'Brien for awhile
Bill Fogle
Ellsworth, Maine
(formerly Washington, DC)
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Author: Buster
Date: 2012-08-24 03:45
One piece of advice.... find a suitable replacement for the O'Brien ASAP...
I've been searching for a few years, having accumulated, hoarded, and sold some 30 O'Brien, Selmer and assorted non-Pomarico crystals, even refacing a few to get them closer to mine, to no avail.... sometimes the precise number of flaws present in a mouthpiece make it work better than a "corrected" rendition. (I played an equal that the owner wouldn't have sold for a few thousand bucks... perhaps due to the name etched on the back.)
Assuredly, my *precious* is far from where most would put it. Kaspar facing (34- 1.13) slightly asymmetrical, wider tip-rail than I usually like, 'interestin' window shape and other "flaws" that are a closely guarded secret...
Though these glass/crystals slowly flow and change shape over the centuries, they do change far quicker with a quick hit on the music stand, or when dropped on the floor. I always keep a well-intentioned back-up mouthpiece in my case when playing my fav. crystal. Safety first!
(When I'm feeling even braver, I break out the 20s-40s "golden-era" hard-rubber 'pieces. They seem to spend more time in storage than in my mouth strangely enough.)
-Jason
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